German / Imported Märzens

Have you had the Hofbrau Maibock? Even stronger but with a very distinctive taste. Great stuff.

 

It's not a particularly dry beer, but dry enough to be a quaffer for me, especially with that malt richness. Probably at the upper edge of the style, though, and not too far from bock territory.

 

It's due to shipping & packaging.
Bottled Schlenkerla is bottled in, and shipped from, Germany. Canned Schlenkerla is shipped from Germany in huge temperature controlled tanks at canned by B. United in Connecticut. You can really tell the difference in the Helles.

 

I have had that one. Usually get a 6-pack each year but missed it this year with everything going on. Pretty rich on the toasted malt but very clean from what I remember. Dangerous stuff for just over 7%.

 

Yeah, I agree with that. Easy enough to drink a few in a row but that richness does keep me from drinking more of it than some other Oktoberfests. Which... maybe is a good thing?

 

Bill, that was certainly the case for when I bought my four-pack of canned Helles. That beer, for some reason, was waaaay more smokey than any of the bottled/draft Helles I have had.

What are your specific impressions about canned vs. bottled Schlenkerla Marzen? Did you personally notice a big difference in the sensory aspects of those two beers?

Cheers!

 

Well I don't think I've tried to make that argument. I agree a kolsch should be fresher too similar to a pils or "lighter beer". I don't think IPAs are the only style that falls off considerably. I just think that hoppy beers would be the first to "fall off" since aroma hops are more volatile and fade quicker. In the case of noble hops though I think styles that mainly use those are still ok a few months down the line because they add less aspects to the beer and are there mainly for preservative and balance reasons. Any beer with main flavors that are coming from hops won't be as good after 3-6 months. I agree too though that some styles like wheat beers, golden ales, lighter less malty styles etc should also be consumed fresh, but that doesn't mean they will be bad after 3 months.

 

Yes, that is exactly what I am saying.

For all of my past drinking experiences for Schlenkerla Helles (bottles and draft) I noted a smokey aspect in the background but the dominant flavor was a bready Pilsner malt flavor. In contrast for the canned beers the smoke was 'front & center' with the other beer qualities (e.g., malt flavor) was in the background. I was not expecting this and FWIW I preferred the draft/bottled Helles better. In addition the canned beers from B. United are not inexpensive so there is that aspect as well.

Cheers!

Edit: I did a search and 'discovered' that I discussed the canned Helles in a NBS thread:

"While the smoky aroma/flavor is dominant in this beer there is more to it than just the smoke."

 

I believe "Festbier" is simply the term for a beer brewed for a festival. For example, Maibocks can be a "Festbier" if they're brewed for the lesser known spring festival in Munich called Frühlingsfest.

The Munich six are the only breweries that can call their beers "Oktoberfestbier", which is a pale Oktoberfest (a stronger Helles) served at the tents.

Traditionally this was a darker amber Oktoberfest (more or less a stronger Vienna lager), but it was a "Märzen" in strength alone.

If I have any of this wrong (I likely could) someone feel free to correct me.

I was at a local brewpub in Darmstadt Germany a couple years ago and was served a "Märzen"....in January.

This wasn't in Bavaria, nor was it anywhere near Oktoberfest season.

This is an amber Maibock though right?

I had no problem downing 2 liters at Oktoberfest.

Yup, this was my experience as well. I liked bottled/draft better for this same reason. The Helles in bottle/draft has an exemplary Pils malt character with a complementary smoke character, rather than overpowering.

For what it's worth, despite freshness, I haven't enjoyed any of their canned offerings as much as the bottled/draft versions.

Yup, completely agree!

My apologies, I wasn't trying to imply that.

I suppose this is where you and I are different, and that's ok. We all have different palates. If the hops fall off in say, a Pils, it becomes a more malt forward beer. If I wanted that, I'd get a Helles. The hops are an essential aspect of this style and add balance to a Pils, as you said.

When I went to Germany I was FLOORED by how hoppy the Bitburger Pils I had on draft was so close to the source. And I've had Bitburger in the US that wasn't all that old. It was completely night and day.

You're in MA. If you go to Notch, have The Standard (their 12P Czech Pale Lager) on draft compared to it canned. It is amazing in a can, but it is otherworldly on draft. And I've noticed recently the cans are noticeably different around two months than when fresher.

And then there's IPAs that do in fact hold up after a couple months. For example, John Kimmich himself prefers Heady Topper at 10 weeks old.

 

I do know what Festbiers are, but it didn't seem to fit the Lagerbier < Export < Marzen < Bock story. I believe that there may be a historical context to Marzen being based on strength, but is there any evidence that it still is that way? I don't recall seeing any German Marzens that were anything but amber or copper, and the golden variations aren't called Marzen (as far as I know).

Yes, it is. Am I missing the significance of that? (that isn't meant to sound as crabby as it does)

 

So, as was discussed previously (post #131) the temperature at which beer is stored impacts beer shelf life. Hopefully the German beers are being shipped across the Atlantic in refrigerated containers vs. regular containers but needless to say there is a cost consideration here so sometimes, maybe the regular containers are used instead? Also, if a refrigerated container is utilized at what temperature is it set? Again, costs potentially can be saved by setting the container at a warmer temperature (e.g., 55 degrees F) vs. keeping the beer cold at refrigerator temperatures (e.g., 40 degrees F). As an end customer all that you really know is how the beer was stored at the retailer (which is largely room temperature for me).

If a consumer is looking for the optimum fresh drinking experience drinking local (e.g., drinking draft beer at a brewery's (Notch) taproom) is the optimum way to go. Drinking imported beer comes with 'risk'.

Cheers!

 

And I would be willing to bet that 10 week old Heady Topper was continually stored cold which is an important/critical aspect here.

I purchased a four-pack of Heady Topper a week ago and to my pleasant surprise on top of the four-pack holder was a sticker which commanded "This Beer must be kept cold at all times". And yes, the retailer did indeed place this beer in their limited refrigerator section.

Cheers to cold Heady Topper!

 

Here's the single image that the The German Brewers’ Association uses for Märzen.


@patto1ro

 

Like this?

I purchased a six pack of Paulaner Marzen last night with a 3 21 best before date. Not my favorite, but $9.99 for 2 month old German beer is not bad. Half of them are gone (see picture above) and the rest are on borrowed time. Hofbräuhaus is out here as well, but I didn’t check dates.

 

That's a really nice bottle design for a 33cl bottle. A (small) pet peeve of mine is all of the long neck bottles nowadays without neck labels, it just looks like something went wrong during packaging to me. But with a shorter, "stouter" neck like that it doesn't look like there's anything missing, plus the embossing is a nice touch.

Oh, and the beer doesn't look half bad either .

 

Do we know for a fact that when it comes to beers exported to the US that Paulaner is not using a 12 month best by duration?

In the other thread @Snowcrash000 relayed "Paulaner stated a 9-month" but I interpreted that as meaning for the German domestic market.

I know that many US craft breweries that use best by durations of 4/5/6 months for the domestic market will utilize a 12 month duration for the beers they send to Europe.

Cheers!

 

Could be a different time frame for us. My only alternative to aged German beer is flawed local lagers which I will not purchase. Whatever sierra nevada puts out will be the bulk of my purchases this year. There is one brewery here in Indiana that makes great traditional lagers, but does not distribute here. I'm 3+ hours from a good lager, so I take what I can get.

 

@FBarber
Yes I do and the effect of just as you describe. The smoke is noticably more prominent in the canned version, but so is the taste of the beer.

I've found that the märzen and fastbier is very well balanced in the canned versions, but not necessarily in the bottles. In the bottles the smoke has faded and sometimes seems like an afterthought causing the beer to taste “off”, like something's missing.
The opposite is true with the Weizen and Helles. The canned versions of those can almost taste too fresh with the smoke overpowering those lighter tasting beers. This is especially noticable in the Helles. The flavors of this beer can be overwhelmed even though it's “second hand” smoke. I prefer the bottled versions of these because the smoke has dissipated by the time they're on the shelf.

 

Nice! But that is a little over 4 months old, as it was brewed in March.

Edit: I saw a note about a 9 month window now, but pretty sure that is not the case for Paulaner sent here. And they have always brewed the stuff sent here in March.