Should we bring back New Beer Sunday?

Heck yes, it was always great to see Malto's posts for NBS, please bring it back!

 

I don't get that, either. I've been participating for quite some time and while NBW people posted personal anecdotes and the occasional extra picture of general interest among friends or a tune, I don't think it was out of hand. I saw more of that on the daily thread, as well as more general banter, inside jokes, and unrelated content on WBAYDN. Most of the non-new beer posts I typically see in NBW are comments on beer or mentioning things about a style, tasting tips, or comparison of tasting experiences. I've learned more about tasting and have a greater understanding of beer styles from reading NBW and "listening" to people I can relate to than any other source.

And something I have never understood is the idea one must read every word of every post. Hell , in some recent very serious threads people were jumping in with misplaced commentary who openly admitted that they hadn't read or followed the thread. If you don't want to read the extra content, skip it. There are many lengthy posts in this thread, a few short ones not on point, but so what? Pass on to the ones I want to read.

Participation...so there is a core of folks who post religiously on NBW. Isn't the same thing true for the daily thread? I don't play there anymore, but I remember post after post by the same handful or two of people. So somebody starts NBW, people who want to play jump in. How is that different than any other thread? Is it work for someone when a new thread gets started? Is it somehow a drain on site resources whether NBW runs four pages versus ten? I don't see why the new tradition can't stand regardless of how many people participate, same as any other thread.

 

I think if getting my act together and really starting posting new beer impressions, the W serves better than the S. "Good morning" doesn't have to mean "Good afternoon" or whatever. The 48 hours paves the way for posting around the globe.

 

That's how BA was until a format change about 8-10 years ago.

 

I posted this upthread, but I'll run it out there again: last week there were 125 posts on NBW, over two days. For the sake of discussion lets say all 125 were posts that contained reviews (they weren't, but...). I had to work Saturday and didn't post, but, on Sunday, I reviewed 5 new brews and posted them all. One single poster was responsible for 4% of the threads total amount of review posts. How is that increasing participation?

If one just looks at the number of posts as a raw data set, then it doesn't matter who is posting who many times. But the changes were made to increase the number of posters and, without having the actual data, I don't think that has happened.

If someone has more patience than I, here's a project: Go back to the last 4 NBS threads, and count the number of different users in each, and average them out. Do the same with the 4 most recent NBW threads. Perhaps also note names that appear in one set of threads and not in the other.

 

Just for the record, at one point I was asked to take over NBS hosting, having occasionally jumped in as an alternate when needed and available.

I declined since I couldn't consistently always be around to start a thread first thing on a Sunday morning (and usually early).

Glad to see there's some feedback on this and people are discussing it.

 

Lets keep it simple; any post counts as participation. Maybe somebody has a cold and isn't drinking that weekend, but sees somebody else post a beer that he's had before, and pipes in with his view on that beer. That's participation, even without a new review.

 

Can I ask what the issue is with participation? Some threads are short, some are long. Does it matter whether 10 people or 40 people participate in NBW for some reason? I know nobody has brought up the subject of eliminating the thread (thankfully) and I am pretty sure that was not Todd's intent, but the idea of participation seems to be a recurring theme and I'm not sure I understand the importance. Obviously we'd love to have more people dive in the weekend pool and I think the vibe is pretty welcoming to anyone who can abide by the simple concept behind the thread.

I did poke back through but not with any metrics in mind - just looking at my own posts and the general feel of things. But I completely agree with this regarding dicsussions about the beers being...ummm...discussed:

The discussion is what drives the thread, really, as I said in one of my earlier posts here. Otherwise it is just a collection of reviews. Same could be said for the "off topic" material - it adds the human element. And I can see where some people may not care for the little glimpses into someone else's life - for me, I enjoyed the talk about dogs, music, food, etc that popped up. But if that's not someone's bag, they can skim to the "beer part".

As this continues to rumble around in the empty space in my head, the thought occurred to me that one of the "perks" of NBW for users is it is like a collection - all the beers are new to the drinker beers with first time impressions all in one place. That is quite unlike WBAYDN where you see tons of repeats and a sprinkling of new beers, I think that focus adds value to the faithful regardless of the allotted time. I usually do my reviews after the fact so I don't link them - NBW is usually my first, raw impression that I'll dress up a bit for the actual review and rating. But I have noticed more linked reviews of late and to me that is a minor detraction. Certainly not a deterrent, and not hard to deal with since there's the back button, but kinda changes the flow a bit.

The level of response here and civility of the discussion seems to show that people care about this topic. But it is almost like subjective versus objective scoring of a beer - there's something there that is probably captured in all of these replies that sets the NBW thread aside and makes it seem special to people, yet we can't quite put our finger on exactly what that "something" might be. Like this beer isn't objectively all that great, but subjectively I dig it because there's "something" about it.

 

I agree 100% here. If there is no (or limited) discussion and just simply a review of a beer why not just post your review? Yes, a distinction could be this is a new beer you never had before but NBS should be more than just a collection of reviews IMO.

Well for me having 40 folks participate is a 'better' sense of community vs. 10 people just posting multiple posts but that is just my opinion here.

Cheers!

 

I think some of us may be looking at this as killing the goose that laid the golden egg. I disagree with this. Not because I don't think NBS/W is valuable to the site. It obviously is valuable I don't want to aggrandize it above its value, but I also don't think trying to make it better is killing it, Honest reviews done by people who care enough to learn to taste and review beer well are the main asset of this site, (someone please correct me if this is wrong) Why shouldn't we all be invested in trying to figure a way to make it do that even better? Anyway, it isn't like the thread hasn't changed. It has changed quite a lot.

Since having a host, but not a dedicated host, seems to be a reasonable compromise, why not figure a way to have some kind of game or other attractive activity to try and pick who the host(s) is/are next week, with the proviso being no one gets to do it more than x time(s) per y. Maybe strangest beer fact one week, best beer story under 200 words another week, Voted on with likes. Maybe some kind of contest, or other idea that could be engaged in every W/E or Sunday (as this ends up to be). Maybe advertise in WBAYDN or other areas of the site. Some reasonable alternative that could give less of an impromptu/poorly prepared thing going on every week while also being something fun to engage folks in wanting to join the thread and review.

Anyway, with all the great minds here I'm sure there are other and better ideas for increasing participation here and the concomitant amount/quality of reviews added to the database.

 

I was thinking more in terms of some impact on the site (resources, mods, etc) that would be adversely affected by a low number of participants or post count? I don't see why NBW would be any different than any other thread in that sense. Is there some point where a thread is somehow untenable to maintain? So...to the extreme - when it is just me and you posting in NBW does it get shutdown because it is a resource drain? (It could, after all, be any other thread that was just you and me posting). NBW would just break up into individual "hey, I tried this" with a bunch of @<insert name> shorter threads.

Yes - absolutely agreed that a larger community is better for the participants as it generates thoughts, ideas, drives interactions and understanding, etc. And I agree with @cavedave that the quality reviews drive the bus here and the more we can have on NBW the better. But not many new people are joining in and many regulars have left the thread and we're no closer to understanding why than we were six pages ago - at least not that I can see - but I stayed. And there have been only a handful of occasional new players even when it was NBS. Hell's bells, we're two pages longer than the average NBW just talking about NBW! From a pretty innocuous lead post, I might add - two days or one was the original question yeah?

Maybe there's a stigma that exists (warranted or not) that NBW is some sort of exclusive club for the elite tasters/reviewers. Me - I just dove in, but that's the way I am - if somebody didn't want me there, they could damn well "tell" me and explain why I wasn't worthy. I don't recall anybody on this site leaving me feeling intimidated or shy about participating - quite the opposite (well, there was that Overlord guy one time...) NBW regulars have always seemed welcoming in my opinion and more than happy to share. So what's scaring folks off?

And I think we have to consider that there are more people than we think who don't like to or are not comfortable with writing a review for whatever reason (plus the pure tickers). Again, I never cared - I read, learned, applied what I learned and I'm still not great at it but it won't stop me from trying. Plus - I will borrow the phrase - communication is Twitterized. It takes a few minutes and a little thought to write a review. That is true everywhere - not just here. TLDR has gone from a page to a paragraph to a complete sentence, seems to me, so Too Long To Write probably isn't far behind (if half sentence replies to my tech reports to my "manager" are any indication...)

If I kinda sum up all the things I've thought...

• One day or two - I don't care as long as it happens.
• Dedicated host - neutral. It was nice while it lasted, maybe it was time to move on.
• Technically off topic content (music, pics, whathaveyou) - I am generally in favor of but understand it should be self-limiting and maybe self-policed by the participants.
• Reviews or link to the review - essential.
• Pictures - almost essential, do the best you can. (My pictures suck, I don't care. But people who can compose a great pic have my respect).
• New to you beer - well, that's the whole point (unless responding directly to a post) so essential and preferably being consumed within a reasonable time window of posting.

 

I bolded a portion of that above statement since to me that is a critical consideration. A management decision was made to change things as regards NBS and I too have noticed that portions of the NBS community "have left the thread" and IMO that is a damn shame (i.e., a change not for the better).

I have continued to participate but frankly I was not a fan of this change being made. And to quote a statement that @thebeers made previously: "I was also frankly grumpy that the regulars and long-time hosts weren't really consulted." FWIW I resonate with that sentiment.

Forgive me for repeating myself (again) but the whole 'feel' has changed with the decision to go from NBS to NBW. I suppose somebody might post "don't cry over spilled milk" or something similar but...

Cheers!

 

Yes - it is a shame, and this discussion has brought up a lot of points about what people think, but I don't believe we're moved any closer to understanding why this is true.

I am not sure I agree that the feel changed only because of the one day to two day thing - it contributed and maybe diluted focus. I don't recall whether not having dedicated hosts happened first, after, or at the same time - another potential contributor. In my mind, whether it was done intentionally or implied, the "regimentation" of the thread was a huge factor - it was to me. I looked forward to seeing what other people were cooking or what @lordofthewiens dogs were up to. It seems to me if we're strictly posting a picture of a new beer and a review, then why not just do the review and skip the thread? We all have opinions about what's going on and that particular item is a big deal in my mind. I guess to me that made WBAYDN into spending the day with people versus a ten minute seat at the bar and was a real point of differentiation because of the added depth. I swear I posted a pretty sarcastic post in NBS (or maybe NBW by that time) with a "last great act of defiance" tune included but damned if I can find it.

 

Maybe you can conduct a 'second act' in this thread!?!

A tribute to NBS (act one) -> NBW (act two)?

Cheers!