Schell's Response to the Brewer's Association

Discussion in 'Beer News' started by RKPStogie, Dec 15, 2012.

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  1. Groenebeor

    Groenebeor Initiate (0) Feb 14, 2009 California

    That bottle being light struck has to do with the crappy bar in a crappy state, not the fact that SA is a large craft brewery.

    Although, it's not doing craft beer any favors when that happens.
     
  2. rlcoffey

    rlcoffey Initiate (0) Apr 20, 2004 Kentucky

    More of an individual brew at a communal brewery. That is then served at the individual homes. Which I think is a fair point by you, although you will notice that the link you provided refers to "homebrewers".

    As far as me not being in Franconia, well, I guess I could call it zoigl-style or something, like people do with lambic-style or maybe pzoigl. But that is just silly, as a brewer that made a Burton Ale would understand.
     
  3. mdwalsh

    mdwalsh Initiate (0) Feb 1, 2009 Iowa

    Yes, you can pull that data, that is easy. I'm interested in seeing what part of BMC sales are Goose, Blue Moon, etc.
     
  4. rlcoffey

    rlcoffey Initiate (0) Apr 20, 2004 Kentucky

    Yeah, I doubt that is available. Although they are public companies, so maybe that is in the annual reports.
     
  5. jesskidden

    jesskidden Grand Pooh-Bah (3,071) Aug 10, 2005 New Jersey
    Pooh-Bah Society Trader

    For 2011:

    M-C was 59,625,000 bbl. (domestic and imports) and Blue Moon (all varieties) was 1,725,000 of that​

    AB was 98,500,000 bbl. (domestic and imports) and Goose Island was 127,000 bbl.​
     
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  6. RKPStogie

    RKPStogie Initiate (0) Nov 4, 2011 Minnesota

    I agree with your point about the 8 month old light stuck beer, but we'll have to agree to disagree about the Brewers Association discrediting itself. To me they are compelelty discredited. Schell's does not deserve to be included on this list.
     
  7. Tballz420

    Tballz420 Initiate (0) Mar 4, 2003 Minnesota

    Good response from Schell's but this whole labeling beer thing is way out of control. Everyone should quit trying to define what someone else is, or what their beer is, and drink it
     
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  8. cevafm

    cevafm Initiate (0) Mar 30, 2008 Pennsylvania

    I don't understand why the gentleman from Schell's was defending Straub and Yuengling. Neither are craft breweries or claim to be. That being said, Schell's is most definately a craft brewery.

    The problems with Yuengling is that they are following the BMC method of expanding and making more money while pretending not to be BMC. Go take a brewery tour and you will see how full of it they are. I went on one, and a beer noob asked a question as to why Yuengling only distributes to 13 states. The tour guide, who was not a new hire, stated that "Unlike Budweiser and Coors, some of our hand-crafted beers are too high in alcohol to be approved by the LBC in many states"

    Not only did the tour guide not stutter, but she rattled it off like she had it memorized.

    Does Lager taste better then a Budweiser or Coors. Subjective. I will purchase the Lord Chesterfield and Premium from time to time. The Porter is a joke of a dark beer and the Black and Tan is awful. Lager is just premium with porterine added to it, flavor profile is exactly the same. Refuse to pay 5 bucks a case more for it.

    Octoberfest and Bock are just variations on the Lager and are not as good.
     
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  9. jesskidden

    jesskidden Grand Pooh-Bah (3,071) Aug 10, 2005 New Jersey
    Pooh-Bah Society Trader

    I think because, regardless of what "type" of beer those two breweries produce (or the others on the "B.A. Non-Craft" blacklist) or which adjuncts are approved vs those found not acceptable by the Brewers Association, the organization essentially declared war on those breweries when the war should be against Anheueser Busch and MillerCoors. Those are the two breweries that control 75% of the US market, those are the companies making the "faux craft" brands like ShockTop and Blue Moon, those are the companies buying into craft breweries and distributing their brands through their extensive coast-to-coast wholesale networks.

    I think too many BA's in these threads are often missing the point - it's not whether Schell's is "craft" or not - it's being called out in that pdf, lumped in with AB and MC. Schell's knows the beers they brew, the beers their loyal customers have drank for generation and they know they use the dreaded adjunct - corn. They also are probably aware of Spoetzl's "exemption" and their use of some magic maize that enhances rather than lightens. (And the "magic" is probably due to the act of Gambrinus writing dues checks for their 3 US breweries from all indications). So, essentially apparently Schell is on that list because they've got the pride not hide behind that fiction?

    Don't like adjunct lagers? Don't drink 'em - Straub's or Miller Lite. Grain Belt or Bud. Yuengling Porter or Keystone. Putting Schell's and Straub and Yuengling (a Brewers Association member!) and the others on their list really helps no craft brewers and just makes the organization looks petty (or "more petty" considering the other moves they've made) as well as hypocritical (as I noted in the other thread).

    If the Brewers Association wants to battle AB and MC, then make a list of their imports and their brands, their faux crafts and the craft brewers they wholly or partially own. And leave the "other" US brewers out of it. Don't hide behind the "adjunct" technicality when the craft shelves are loaded with pumpkin ales, fruit flavored beers, artificially flavored beers, alcoholic iced teas, ciders, etc.

    I'm not sure where I quoted this today (but it bears repeating)- the Purpose Statement of the Brewers Association:

    "To promote and protect small and independent American brewers, their craft beers and the community of brewing enthusiasts."
     
  10. dauss

    dauss Pooh-Bah (1,730) Aug 9, 2003 Colorado
    Pooh-Bah Society

    Oh no, the price of corn is just too expensive. Too bad corn is the most heavily subsidized crop in the US. It is so incredibly cheap, regardless of the "drought", some form of corn derivative is in nearly all processed food products. Schell says that corn is more expensive than malt, however, they're probably doing what BMC has learned back in the 70s, use corn syrup. MillerCoors has tank cars of corn syrup delivered from Cargill.
     
  11. hopfenunmaltz

    hopfenunmaltz Pooh-Bah (2,611) Jun 8, 2005 Michigan
    Pooh-Bah Society

    Not sure if it is corn, sugar, or tobacco.

    AB used to have a big corn syrup plant in Lafayette IN. now owned by Tate.
     
  12. mdwalsh

    mdwalsh Initiate (0) Feb 1, 2009 Iowa

    Okay, now Micheloeb, Henry Weinharts, Shock Top, Leinenkugels, etc please, and put it in a pretty chart form? (or just site the source)
     
  13. MN_Beerticker

    MN_Beerticker Initiate (0) Jul 10, 2012 Minnesota

    I am not sure about any of the other BA's but I can think for myself. I cut my teeth on Grain Belt Premium and Schell's products. I am certainly not going to let a group tell me what to buy or not to buy. Bottom Line: The Marti's are craftsmen and continue to turn out a fine product.
     
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  14. jesskidden

    jesskidden Grand Pooh-Bah (3,071) Aug 10, 2005 New Jersey
    Pooh-Bah Society Trader

    Do you mean the 1970's? If so, I think you're about a century off. According to an article in The New York Times, Aug. 20, 1881 How Lager Beer is Made, quoting the United Lager Beer Brewers of New York City and Vicinity:

    Corn…in the form of corn-meal, corn starch, rice, grape sugar, and glucose are used [in some lager beers]. (Glucose is a liquid form of grape sugar.)


    And the Master Brewers Association of America's Practical Brewer (1946) noted that:




    (Note, I have no idea what form of corn Schell uses for their Deer Brand and Grain Belt adjunct lagers.)



     
  15. jesskidden

    jesskidden Grand Pooh-Bah (3,071) Aug 10, 2005 New Jersey
    Pooh-Bah Society Trader

    Ha! See, sometimes we beer geeks don't remember how good we have it now in the internet age.

    In the not-too-distant past (well, depending on one's age, I suppose) brewery tour guides were often the only source of misinformation about beer and the brewing industry. Well, them and the drunk down at the end of the bar whose brother-in-law once worked as a helper on a Schaefer Beer truck before he joined the Marines. ("Hey, kid, ever have bock beer? You know how they make that stuff, right?")

    Now, thanks to the internet, Wikipedia, beer blogs and forums we have access to a virtual tidal wave of myths, old wives tales, misinformation and information - some of it even accurate!
     
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  16. jesskidden

    jesskidden Grand Pooh-Bah (3,071) Aug 10, 2005 New Jersey
    Pooh-Bah Society Trader

    :grimacing: My sincere apologies, I must have accidentally forgot to add my footnote citing my sources (which is always done on the BA forums):


     
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  17. Stahlsturm

    Stahlsturm Initiate (0) Mar 21, 2005 Germany
    In Memoriam

    The Zoigl is located in the Upper Palatinate, not Franconia. Just a small geographical side note :slight_smile:
     
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  18. rlcoffey

    rlcoffey Initiate (0) Apr 20, 2004 Kentucky

    Thanks, I cant keep my german geography straight. I knew that at one time, but am always confused because the Upper and Lower Palatinate arent near each other. Doesnt the lower border France? While the upper borders Czech?
     
  19. mdwalsh

    mdwalsh Initiate (0) Feb 1, 2009 Iowa

    Didn't mean to have that come across snarky. I wanted to make the chart on my own!
     
  20. Chaz

    Chaz Grand Pooh-Bah (3,544) Feb 3, 2002 Minnesota
    Pooh-Bah Society Trader

    I'm glad to hear this. Just make sure that -when you've finished your chart- you share it with the group! :slight_smile:
     
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