Reasons for Not Patronizing a Brewery

Are these places the same? It would be fitting lol

 

Nope the Trump bar got in trouble for serving underage kids The brewery that snapped my ID in half is a NJ place.

 

Yeah that sounds about right Par for the course I suppose

 

Maybe a slightly different reason, but I generally don't visit breweries with tap lists that are more than half IPA or Pastry Stouts/Sours. I need a lot of convincing to go to a brewery like that. Or breweries that focus on pumping out "hype" beer that is all limited release or one time.

 

I really only goto one brewery at this point for the most part. I have so much beer to get to (I’m very lucky and fortunate). I used to make it almost a job going to all of the breweries. Then I got a brewery membership and did a zillion trades and got stocked up.

I agree, it takes a lot for me to want to go to a brewery at this point.

 

I'm with ya on this. Some friends and I went down to Seattle for a Mariners game a few years ago, and we hit a few breweries before the game. After a couple Big beers, I was ready for just a simple 'beer beer', a Pale Ale or Lager. Stopped at a highly thought of Seattle brewery, and their taplist was evenly split between Murkbombs and fruited kettle sours. I had a couple glasses of water while my friends did taster trays.

 

Oh, you had a minor criminal case. This is a big pet peeve of mine. Among many.

Little known fact.
No bar, not anywhere, is obligated or authorized to confiscate an ID. For good reason too.

1, It is your personal property. Not theirs. If they take your personal property it is simply theft. Fake or not, it is a theft of property. Guess what, the door guy is not the police, and the door guy must respect your 4th Ammendment rights. Not doing so is criminal, pretty serious too.


2, The bar may decline service, but they are not the police. In other words, only law enforcement can charge anyone with impersonation, and only then can the DA present this to a court, and only then can a judge make a determination.

3, If the door holds your real ID, challenge. " Call the Police. Go ahead. I'll wait. Or hand it back immediately. You so certain now?" Trust me, door man will think twice.. Just don't be obnoxious or drunk.

4, Poorly trained staff think they are the law. Properly trained staff know enough to merely suggest consequences. The rest follows. Once the word gets out, fake IDs are a thing of the past

OTOH, fake ID? Cut your losses. Go home junior.

Here is the caveat.
5, Go ahead and argue. An experienced door will simply say "I'm not sure, this looks fake, or maybe stolen, so I am going to ask the PD to investigate. Wait here." Problem solved. That under age patron is gone, and they did not wait to collect their ID.

Point being, the door does not have to let you drink. But they do not get to hold your ID.

Cheers

Edit
Bonus

Most states do not prohibit minors from being in the bar. The prohibition is under age consumption. Think restaurants with a bar. So it is perfectly legal to be there, just not OK to drink. If your business is primaraly alcohol, you prohibit under age from entering, because 1, they are a risk and 2, they don't have any potential sales. Also 3, that 19 year old will end up with a Wild Turkey at some point, no matter his buddy/mom/brother said.

 

I am very liberal but I do not want MSNBC televised at any bar I visit. Sports, please.

I drink almost all my beer at home while watching sports or a movie, never politics.

If I knew, I would certainly boycott a brewery that supported Trump or any other sociopaths, including Democrats. However, I never do any research when I purchase a singleton from Trader Joe's, so I usually have no idea what my $1 or $2 is supporting.

About beer itself, breweries can certainly be mixed. I love Hoegaarden and hate Shock Top and I still have never tasted Bud Light.

Edited to add: I forgot about Pete Coors being so conservative. Coors donated $5,000 to Trump in 2016. No more Blue Moons for me.

 

Yeah, all that is good advice. He just snapped my ID in half, and escalating the situation was not something I was trying to do. Ruined my Saturday afternoon though (and the following Saturday lol).

 

So many places like this, sadly. Can't stand it.

 

Wrong. In WA, we are encouraged to take any ID we think is fake, and call the cops or LCB. They'll come and look at it, and if they determine it to be fake they take it, and arrest the person trying to use it. In real life, since the cops have better things to do, is when you say you have to hold it until the cops come, if it's fake, the person will just leave, and now it's abandoned property.

And in WA, we are obligated to confiscate fakes and turn them into the authorities. And, we're supposed to try to keep the person on premises until they show up. Most bar owners will reward their bartenders/door people with $50-100 for every fake they catch.

We have a group of bar/store/restaurant owners/employees in my town, and we have monthly meetings to go over issues. One day the cops/LCB brought in a bunch of fakes to look at. Most were easily recognizable as fakes. Some were pretty good. They passed around an Arizona ID. We all thought it was real. Nope. Had all the hidden security features and everything. They had bought it on-line for about $400. The reason it was Arizona? A drivers license/ID is good for 25 years down there. They told us that they ever found someone that had one of those in our bars, they wouldn't write us up, since they could barely tell it from a real one.

"Most states do not prohibit minors from being in the bar. The prohibition is under age consumption. Think restaurants with a bar. So it is perfectly legal to be there, just not OK to drink"

Well, at least you added 'most' here. Again, here in WA, no underage person can be in the bar area. They can be in the restaurant, but the bar is 21+ only. Got a new born baby and want to grab a growler from the brew pub? Can't bring it up to the bar to get the fill, legally. Most places will let it slide if you're just there for a minute, but, a cranky LCB dude could write them up if they see it.

 

So, what you are saying is that if you can’t tell if an ID is fake or real, and the cops don’t show up, you can just take it?


What you have just described is theft.

 

It differs state by state as I understand it, but please know that what bars encourage employees to do may not be legal.

ServSafe compiled a handy list of states that allow for confiscation and states that do not… Washington is listed as a state that does not allow for confiscation (however, I’m not an attorney in WA and I can’t find the citation for this, so make of it what you will).

“Licensees may not confiscate an ID they believe to be false. Licensees are urged to call local law enforcement officials or their local liquor agents and advise them of the situation”

https://intellicheck.com/found-fake-id/

 

Which is what I posted.

 

No, you posted that they are encouraged to confiscate the ID in addition to the above. The source I posted explicitly lists WA under a state in which it is unlawful for bars to confiscate the ID (the previous sentence you omitted). This is the key distinction I meant to draw (again, based on my limited knowledge of the statute).

 

We can hold it until the authorities show up, at which point we hand it over to them. If when we say we're calling the authorities to inspect it, and the person leaves, then it becomes abandoned property.

If it's a really good fake (has the security features, feels right, etc), looks good under the black light, usually the door guy will let the person in. Now, if the authorities show up and start spot-checking IDs, and they find that fake, the bar and door person are at risk of getting ticketed.

 

Maybe I used confiscate wrong. We are not intending to keep it, just hold it until the cops show up. If it's real, the person should be on the phone to the cops before we are. How often do you see that happening?

 

I think you certainly used “confiscate” wrong, yes. You can try holding it as long as the patron gives it to you, sure. But if they ask for it back, you better give it back if you want to comply with the letter of the law (as far as what it sounds like to me). Confiscation is explicitly disallowed, apparently. In the meantime, you’re asked to tell law enforcement about the situation.

Whether it’s real or not, you can’t confiscate it (even temporarily) i.e. deprive the patron of possession of it without their permission.

 

That is not what LCB and the local cops tell us.

 

It would hardly be the first time an LCB or local cops made a policy of misinterpreting a clear directive (especially in favor of more excessive enforcement)… but I also 100% understand bar employees wanting to follow their directives and not some random guy on the internet’s lol.

I’m definitely not surprised or doubtful that they would tell you something other than what the law appears to say.