What beers do you wish would return?

The Lion Brewery sold the Stegmaier labels a couple of months ago to Susquehanna Brewing Co., which is owned by descendants of Charles Stegmaier.

Maybe they'll bring the old Stegmaier Porter back for a while? I never had Stegmaier Porter that was brewed with Porterine, and would love to try it.

 

Sounds good - but I'm outside the likely distribution area. I might have to schedule a rare excursion west. Are you sure that the older Steg. Porter was brewed with "porterine"? I had a taste of the early 70s bottled Steg. Porter, and I thought it had a strong taste of roasted malt/barley. For a while after the Lion got hold of it, it was probably a clone of Gibbons Porter. My tastebuds thought that Gibbons Porter (and the Lion's Steg. Porter) were a pale beer brewed with caramel (or porterine). In recent years the Lion's Steg. Porter has probably been upgraded. Details lost in the mists of time . . . . Calling Jesskidden.

 

Never heard anyone refer positively to brewers using Porterine - for example, the text from ads from Kaiers and Sunshine (below left).


Even Stegmaier (top right) claimed they used "caramelized malts".

What Steg Porter, both from Stegmaier and The Lion, was somewhat notorious for was having a heavy hand with the licorice, which was a common additive for porters- Nugey's Beer Formulas noted "Oft-times a small amount of licorice is used." The Lion's brewmaster in the '70s, even noted their usage of it (lower right).

I remember thinking The Lion's Steg Porter was kinda inauthentic/artificial because of the licorice - but years later after it was gone, I missed it.

 

I stand corrected. I read about the licorice flavor and an article from the 1970s in which Dick Yuengling Sr. said that most porter in the US was made by adding syrup to ale, which I took as him throwing shade in the direction of Stegmaier/Lion. So I thought that he was indicating that Steg Porter was made with Porterine. I read too much into that. Don Mudrick would have known how Steg Porter was made, especially after 1974.

Regardless of how it was made, I'd love to try Steg Porter the way it was made in the 1970s and earlier.

 

I thought that in the early 70s Steg. Porter was very good. I had a few others including Yuengling and Mt. Carbon which were milder. I only had Narragansett and Krueger Porters, once each on tap in the late 70s (probably the same) and thought they were pretty good. Having searched for good beer in the "old days", I considered beer the same way you're supposed to evaluate sausage: Taste the product, but don't look too closely at the production process. Adjuncts? Lager masquerading as ale? Porterine? Maybe. But if the beer tastes good, that's enough for me. Most of the time when going out to a bar or restaurant, the selection would be limited to Bud or Coors anyway.

 

I drank it the 6 weeks I could buy it in single cans at gas stations. I liked it, tasty, good balance of hops and malt. A pleasant American Ale. I wish I could still buy it.

 

II sold King and Barnes ales in the late 90s. I loved them. They were a hard sale here then, but there were pockets where it always sold through. The regular ale ( I cannot remember the exact name) but it was malty rich, reddish in color, and quite hoppy and not sweet. A very satisfying beer....

 

Stone Smoked Porter, Stone RIS, Stone Old Guardian, Stone Ruination, Stone Levitation.

Eric

 

Coors? In the 70s? Had Coors reached Pennsylvania and New York by then?

 

No. Coors entered NY and NJ in 1987, PA in 1988.

But based on previous posts @moodenba spent time on the west coast and that last line should likely simply be read as "...the selection would be limited to macros and large regional AALs anyway", with an emphasis on "limited", too - not many bars had more than 3-6 taps.

 

I picked up Narragansett Porter whenever I saw it (rarely) in trips to New England in the '70s- originally it was sold similar to Stegmaier Porter, only available in returnable bottles by the case (unless a retailer choose to sell singles, which some NJ stores did). Later, during the early Great Beer Revival days of the late '70s, Falstaff updated the label and was putting it in throw-away bottles. It was pretty nice stuff, certainly better than a lot of US "dark beers".

Krueger Old Surrey Porter, draught only, coming out of the same Falstaff Cranston RI brewery was quite different, tho' (and supposedly was also marketed as Ballantine Porter and sometimes just labeled "Porter" on tap handles), It was very hoppy - the brewery claimed it was dry-hopped - and, to me, showed a very strong "family relationship" with that brewery's ales - Ballantine XXX, Croft, Pickwick, etc. I did wonder if it was one of their ales w/Porterine added.

I'd guess some might say it was too hoppy for porter but, at the time, it made sense to me - since ales in the US were by tradition higher hopped than a brewer's lager beer, why wouldn't their top-fermented porter be hoppier than their dark beers?

 

Is / was “pay to play” a big deal nationally outside of Chicago?

Many of our bars at least in the 1980s (likely earlier, just not old enough to know the inner workings as a kid in the 60s/70s) were tied houses.

Miller and Old Style held the largest shares here, one of the few American markets (outside of their Milwaukee home) where Miller pwned Budweiser. I believe Old Style also outsold Budweiser into sometime in the 1990s. You started seeing Bud Light on draft into the 1990s, but Miller Lite still dominated most handles beyond the AB tied bars. Doubt “Budweiser Light” even made it here prior to the rebranding beyond perhaps a few tied house test taps.

You would get a few ethnic taverns carrying Polish or German brands, and every Irish bar had a Guinness Nitro tap and system, paid for of course by the distributor. Distributors of the AALs also paid of most draft systems in the tied houses, and bounties for tap handles for split houses.

Such limited options were why I was primarily a whiskey/bourbon drinker, beyond Guinness or the occasional Budweiser or Heineken at a Summer outdoor event. Had to bring my own as just about everyone else drank Miller Lite. They still do, though they also now run with the Claw.

A lot of this still goes on here, regardless of legalities. They (Red/Blue Houses & Bars) work around or disregard the law.

 

Well, and I'm sure you're well aware of it, the true "Tied House" was outlawed after Prohibition but those complicated so-called "Tied House regulations" had lots of loop-holes and were often dependent/applied only when similar state regulations agreed. But, yeah, lots of violations on the local and national scenes, "that's just the way it's done/look the other way" deals, etc -the defacto tied house, I guess you'd say.

Lots of people always point to Schlitz's downfall as being beer quality related but they had lots of legal problems in 1970s like 747 indictments by a federal grand jury for paying off or offering free services/products (glassware, draught systems) to large venues - stadiums, convention centers, casinos, race tracks hotel and restaurant chains - all over the country. They were even charged with helping an Alabama Schlitz distributor sell Schlitz to "bootleggers" that sold beer to unlicensed stores in dry counties.

AB and Ballantine also ran into trouble for TH violations but, then, the regulations vary to so greatly from state to state, it's likely every brewery and distributor did something "illegal" in one state that was allowed next door.

------ My favorite was NJ prohibited brewery clocks (!) - neons, signs, posters were all OK - although if the dollar-value was over a certain limit, they were merely "loaned" to the retailer (which is why the neon transformers were all embossed "Property of _____ Brewing Co.". But clocks were illegal.

Jimmy, finishes beer, thinks to himself:
"Gee, I should probably be gettin' home. What time is it, anyway. (Looks at clock). Damn 9:45... Wait - what's that say "Schaefer is the One Beer to Have If You're Having More than One". Damn, that sounds good!"
Out loud: "Hey, Joe, gimme another Schaefer, will ya?"

So, the regulators realized that was stupid, and allowed brewery clocks. And around the same time, banned brewery coasters! I mean, when Jimmy finished that beer and knew he should get home, but then saw "Rheingold Extra Dry" on that coaster as he put the empty glass on the bar, well... we all know what came next.

(But the cool thing was, bars were allowed to use the coasters they already had in stock, so they went down to the cellar and found all sorts of obsolete gems - that's how I got my Schaefer Braunslager coaster!)

Disclaimer - Yeah, I know, the NJ bans above were likely related to bribery not excess drinking... but, really, coasters? Clocks?

Well, Miller grew phenomenally in the 1970s after Philip Morris bought them and took aim at challenging Anheuser-Busch - aided by, of course, and in ways contributing to, the collapse of Schlitz.
1970 - #7 - 5.3 M bbl. > 1980 - #2 - 37 M bbl.

But, yeah, Miller's success did vary regionally and they seems to gain market share especially in markets where Schlitz or large regionals were once was strongest, which included states like Texas (tied w/AB at ~27% market share), Louisiana (Miller #1 - 37% to AB's 32%) and even New England (in 1979 Miller tied with AB - 33% each). [Above stats from late '70s > early '80s.]

As for Wisconsin, Pabst was the big loser with the rise of Miller. As late as 1977, Pabst had 44% share of WI market, with AB, Schlitz and Miller all at or under 10%.

 

I remember purchasing Coors in the late 70's in a NJ store located at the junction of Route 1 and Route 18 where the movie theater is now; it was next to a flea market. I thought is was bland. What's was all the fuss about?

 

Yeah, lots of "gray market" Coors was around, distributors who went out of state, purchased it from distributors or retailers and brought it back and legally registered it with the state. In NY, Thomas Fatato* owned several NY distributorships and was being sued by Coors for "self-importing" Coors - in '78 he was having an unnamed Wyoming company ship him 2 - 4,000 cases a week, selling it wholesale for $10.25/cs. at a time (retailers charging $3-5/sixpack) when Bud retailed for about $2/sixpack/$8/cs.

* Fatato was also one of the owners/officers of the (notorious) Eastern Brewing Corp. of Hammonton, NJ.

Yeah, lots of disappointed drinkers who just paid twice as much for an even lighter beer than they regularly purchased. IIRC, one of Miller's "inspirations" for putting renewed effort into the "Lite Beer" label they purchased from Meister Brau was the fact that the very light Coors "America's Fine Light Beer" Beer was a big seller in many markets...

 

Love the historical perspective as always @jesskidden ! Never knew Miller was tied or ahead of Budweiser in other markets beyond Chicago and Milwaukee beyond Light Beer.

Funny how it’s deemed “pay to play” in the beer industry, whereas its chump change compared to what is spent to legally place soft drinks, chips and many other products with paid placements at grocery and big box stores.

Today, Blue House Reyes Distribution is much more vested in Constellation Brands Modelo and Corona than Miller Lite. Modelo is the top selling individual beer brand ($s, not volume) in several major markets, including Los Angeles and Chicago, and continues to grow.

https://vinepair.com/articles/rise-of-modelo/

 

Yeah, the Tied House regulations sure haven't kept up with modern retail capitalism, that's for sure. "What? We can't do that? But Coke, Campbells, Frito-Lays, Green Giant and Perdue can? WTF!" Blame the abuses that led up to Prohibition, I guess.

Yeah, it's mind blowing for me. How many ex-execs and former brewers of now-defunct AAL local, regional and national breweries look at the share of Mexican beer in the US beer market and think:
"Well, mother@#$!, we could have stayed in business if we could have sold our AALs for 50% more than the price of what AB was getting for Budweiser, too!"

 

AS I remember, more than forty years ago, it was expensive, more than Anchor Steam in Highland Park.

 

My wife and I had the Narragansett at an old bar in Cambridge, MA, seeking a respite from the a very hot summer afternoon. On a drive to Newark airport, I took a detour out of the Holland tunnel to visit a small bar in Bayonne, NJ to try the Krueger. Looks like my presumption that they were similar isn't correct. Looking back, I think I found those bars that served the porters in the "Bar Tourists of America" newsletters. I did attend 3 of the BTA bar tours.

 

In the 70s, the great majority of taverns and bars in the west had just one draft beer, others in bottles. As a rule, pizza parlors also offered a dark (inspired by Shakey's).