Thinking of trying this recipe

Discussion in 'Homebrewing' started by BigJoeC, Jan 4, 2013.

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  1. BigJoeC

    BigJoeC Zealot (551) Jan 22, 2011 New Jersey

    6# Light LME
    8oz crystal 80 steep
    8oz carapils steep

    Warrior 1oz at 60
    Amarillo 1/4oz at 45, 30, 15, 1
    Cascade 1/4oz at 60, 40, 20, 1
    Simcoe 1/2oz at 60, 30

    Any thoughts? I'm looking to make a hoppy, full bodied, smooth IPA here.

    I'm open for suggestions
     
  2. BigJoeC

    BigJoeC Zealot (551) Jan 22, 2011 New Jersey

    Wanted to "watch" post and get emails. Thanks guys
     
  3. Naugled

    Naugled Pooh-Bah (1,882) Sep 25, 2007 New York
    Pooh-Bah Society

    It looks like it will make a solid IPA to me as is. All very good hops.
    Is your OG target ~ 1.055 for 5 gal?

    Comments on your goals:
    Hoppy - It will definitely be hoppy but looks more bitter forward than flavor or aroma.
    Full bodied - Somewhat hard to determine, I think it will have good body as is, so I wouldn't change the malt bill
    Smooth - I'm assuming you want hop smoothness. In my opinion the hop bill is a bit complicated. I'd do something like 1 oz Warrior at 60 and then add all the other hops at 5 min. After flame out and while chilling the hops will continue to add flavor and some bitterness. This schedule will lower the bittering components and increase the flavoring and aroma components, which will result in a 'smoother' hop profile (to my palate at least).

    My 2 cents,
    Cheers!
     
  4. BigJoeC

    BigJoeC Zealot (551) Jan 22, 2011 New Jersey

    Great 2 cents. Thanks!

    I'm actually going to go with 9# LME and make it a bigger beer. More of a DIPA. I also went with 1# of crystal 90 rather than 8oz of 80. Even though I'm adding 50% more LME I may add the warrior a little later to cut the bitterness back. Also, instead of Amarillo I got Centenial since the shop was out of Amarillo.

    I may not use a starter and just pitch the WL yeast right in. So far I haven't notice a difference using a starter.

    Any other thoughts would be awesome.
     
  5. Naugled

    Naugled Pooh-Bah (1,882) Sep 25, 2007 New York
    Pooh-Bah Society

    If you're upping the OG I'd definitely make a starter. Especially since you'll have more invested in the batch now.

    It's too bad about the Amarillo, Centennial is a good hop too, but it's no Amarillo.
     
  6. scurvy311

    scurvy311 Savant (1,111) Dec 3, 2005 Louisiana

    If you haven't noticed a difference, you will after going through the work and expense of brewing a DIPA with all extract and 1# of C90, assuming you want it to finish below 1.020.
     
  7. ipas-for-life

    ipas-for-life Initiate (0) Feb 28, 2012 Virginia

    I would keep the 60 Min Warrior addition and leave the other hops for flavor and aroma additions(30 min or less). I would cut out the carapils with out a doubt. Most extracts are made with base malt and carapils already. As the others have said I would be worried about using one vial of liquid yeast without a starter.
     
  8. BigJoeC

    BigJoeC Zealot (551) Jan 22, 2011 New Jersey

    What would be the best way to make a starter? I've done a couple ways.
     
  9. scurvy311

    scurvy311 Savant (1,111) Dec 3, 2005 Louisiana

    1800ml aerated on a stir plate

    But more than that, their is a "rate of diminishing returns" just adding LME or DME to wort to make a stronger hoppy beer. You begin to take a DIPA all extract wort, especially with 1# of crystal, to a point that it can never be dry enough to be enjoyable (less than 1.014 IMO, better below 1.010) without making some changes to recipe, procedure, equipment, or otherwise.
     
  10. GreenKrusty101

    GreenKrusty101 Initiate (0) Dec 4, 2008 Nevada

    For a IIPA, I've had good luck making a Session IPA first (~1.040) and then make the IIPA by pitching on to the whole cake about 7-10 days later...caution...explosive 2nd fermentation possible : )
     
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  11. AlCaponeJunior

    AlCaponeJunior Grand Pooh-Bah (3,326) May 21, 2010 Texas
    Pooh-Bah Society

    If you are going to use 9# of extract, you won't need 1.5 lbs of crystal, or even one. I'd go with a half pound of crystal.

    On the hops I'd go with the warrior at 60. Then I'd toss the rest of them in late. There are a bzillion ways that you could do the late hopping, but the "add it all at 5" comment is probably the easiest.

    Or you could mix them all together and add some of the mix at 15, 10, 5, 1, FO. :grinning:

    Starters wise I use 100g of DME per quart of water. Leave it on the stir plate for at least a day, or shake frequently if you don't have a stir plate. Cover loosely with foil. Then you can either crash and decant, or just pitch it all, but if it's more than a quart I'd crash it and decant before pitching.
     
  12. mattsander

    mattsander Initiate (0) Feb 3, 2010 Canada (AB)

    I've save the Simcoe for flameout/dryhop.
     
  13. BigJoeC

    BigJoeC Zealot (551) Jan 22, 2011 New Jersey

    Thanks man! All awesome thoughts that I will consider. Unfortunately my 8oz of carapils and 1 lb of crystal 90 are crushed together. Maybe I'll just half it and see what happens. What would happen if I use it all? I'm looking for the smoothness and fullness from the crystal
     
  14. AlCaponeJunior

    AlCaponeJunior Grand Pooh-Bah (3,326) May 21, 2010 Texas
    Pooh-Bah Society

    I would use half of it then. You can use the rest in another recipe later, no problem. If you use it all you'll just wind up with too many unfermentable sugars and it will be too cloyingly sweet, plus your FG will be high. The extract will provide plenty of body without needing that much crystal malt.
     
  15. BigJoeC

    BigJoeC Zealot (551) Jan 22, 2011 New Jersey

    Wow! It amazes me that just 12 oz of steeping grains would make that difference.
     
  16. scurvy311

    scurvy311 Savant (1,111) Dec 3, 2005 Louisiana

    Brewing Classic Styles, which I do not have in front of me, for a DIPA of 6.5 gallons, I think, calls for only 0.5# of crystal 40 and several pounds of table sugar and a healthy large starter. I have brewed this recipe several times, and it is always difficult to get it to finish dry enough. You are starting with extract, which you have no control over its fermentability, a large amount by comparison of dark crystal/dextrin malt, and you could possibly not do a starter. You could possibly have more unfermentables than one would like and a less than ideal amount of yeast.

    You want to avoid having an overly sweet, like over 1.014 DIPA.
     
  17. BigJoeC

    BigJoeC Zealot (551) Jan 22, 2011 New Jersey

    Well, I appreciate everyone's input. I played with my recipe on beercalculus. This is what I got.

    http://hopville.com/recipe/1672288

    I'm showing an og of 1.069 and a fg of 1.016
    The IBU would be 89.2 (right about where I want it)
    The ABV would be 7.1% not quite the 9 I was hoping for....any ideas on how to increase?
    It would be a meal with 227 calories per 12oz bottle

    Any other input would be cool! Thanks again guys.
     
  18. samtallica

    samtallica Initiate (0) Jul 22, 2010 North Carolina

    That's assuming 76% attenuation, which is probably the best you can hope for using only extract. If you were to replace a pound or two of that LME with table sugar, you could probably get it to attenuate more.
     
  19. ipas-for-life

    ipas-for-life Initiate (0) Feb 28, 2012 Virginia

    Add sugar to the recipe but don't over do it. Research the percentage of sugar to extract to find out how much to use. I know you don't want to hear it but I would not use those steeping grains. If you do be ready to drink this beer fast because once you start losing hop flavor and aroma it is going to be all sweetness. It could end up being good but I would bet against it.
     
  20. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,043) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah Society

    I haven't checked the rest of your (or hopville's) math, but calculating the amount of table sugar to add to a 5 gallon batch to increase ABV by 1.9% (9% - 7.1%) is pretty straight forward.

    Tabe sugar is 100% fermentable, and it contributes 46 points per pound per gallon (PPG)
    So in a 5 gallon batch, it increases gravity by 9.2 points per pound (46 PPG / 5 Gallons)
    Thus the original gravity of just the sugar contribution of this one pound in 5 gallons is 1.0092, which would ferment (on its own) down to a final gravity of 1.0000 (ignoring difference between actual and apparent attenuation).
    Pop the OG and FG into this ABV formula... ABV% = 132.6 x (OG - FG) ... and you get...
    ABV% = 132.6 x (1.0092 - 1.0000) = 1.21992%
    So 1 lb of sugar adds about 1.21992% to the ABV of a 5 gallon batch.
    Since you need 1.9%...
    divide 1.9% by 1.21992% to get about 1.56 lbs sugar needed
     
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