Discussing beer with people from other countries

I dealt with this type of European ignorance/snobbery regarding U.S. beers all the time when I lived in Germany. I used to think it was exclusive to them...until I found these boards, where many self-proclaimed beer advocates talk about how traditional, European beer is -- when compared to U.S. "craft" -- boring at best and stylistically "inherently inferior" at worst. In other words, goes both ways.

 

Most people across the pond (England) drink shit beer.

 

when I was in a London pub last month, someone commented about there only being bad American beer. I didn't really want to get into a debate but I did tell him that there's a whole difference scene. Not much of a point here, many foreigners don't know about the craft beer thing going on here.

 

One of the biggest mistakes I've made in my beer, wine and food journey is expecting all Europeans to be interested in beer, wine and food to the level I am as an American foodie. It ain't true. Sensual and curious people are a rarity in the universe.

 

I've been all over Europe for months at a time (I happen to be on a 3 month stint right now) and have found that with the exception of Italy, only the very, very few European beer connoisseurs know about the great things (beer-wise) going on in the United States. Italy is an exception because their craft culture is mostly imported, and much of that comes from the United States. Their beer bars serve almost as many US beers as they do Belgian beers. To say other European countries, especially Germany, are nationalistic in their preferences would be putting it lightly (anyone who tells you otherwise hasn't spent much time in Europe). And while this doesn't necessarily mean that traditional European beers are bad, it has undoubtedly limited their growth. I think the attitude of Europeans toward American beer results from this stunted growth: they don't have much interest in trying anything outside of what they consider standard, and standard American beer is BMC.

As far as a story: just the other night I was talking to a guy from Switzerland who works as the beer manager for a distribution company. We met over a bottle of Westy 12 and then 8 so there was at least a recognition that we both knew a little bit about what we were saying. His company distributes 368 beers, only craft, 4 of which were from the United States (the only one he specified was SN Pale Ale and he mentioned Brooklyn Brewery). When I told him everything he was missing out on he seemed very surprised, but also uninterested in expanding his American product. This is typical, a sort of "oh yeah, okay" kind of answer, with a hint of disbelief. Of the eight European countries I have frequented, Germany and Czech are only interested in their own beer (though Prague has a great Belgian beer bar), and all the other countries have Belgium on a pedestal (rightfully so, of course). I have never been to the UK, and realize that is a huge section of European beer culture I am leaving out of my analysis.

 

I don't think you need to qualify that statement. Unfortunately, most us folks on this side of the pond drink shit beer too. Only about 6% of domestic beer sales in the US is craft beer (source). I understand what you were saying though, don't think people are interested in craft anything just because they are from a certain place. \i agree with you there.

 

There is nothing I like better than treating a friend from Europe or South America to a Pacific Northwest crab feed and shitloads of Oregon craft beer. I have never ever heard a complaint that there was no Budweiser available.

 

Well said! As a foreign, I can definitively agree that it does go in all directions. That said however, when I snub my Brazilian friends saying that in matter of beer I am in one of the best locations in the world, I do get mostly the "yeah, go get your Budweiser" kind of answers...

 

Most people in all countries drink predominately adjunct or generally bland lagers (for example Heineken is all malt) but 15% of the UK beer volume is cask beer and a small amount is "craft" bottled beer. Then there is "smooth" which is basically quite reasonable ale ruined by being put into kegs and served by nitro.
Among those of us who take an interest in what we drink there is an awareness of the "other" America , for example CAMRA magazines have had many articles regarding your craft scene and US beers have been showcased in the Great British Beer Festival.
Remember too that we are exposed to MacDonalds and Starbucks! Do we think that our American friends live on stuff like that? I'm afraid America doesn't export its best image.Of course you have proper meat and coffee!

 

A week ago I witnessed this on a forum...

"Haha, beer... one of many things Americans will never get right!"

...naturally, without being a dillhole, I mentioned several craft breweries and how they're inspiring other countries to take craft brewing more seriously, and he didn't respond. Ignorance pisses me off sometimes.

inb4 "And YOU piss ME off ALL the time!"

 

It's strange that people who frequent this forum (or a craft beer distributor) think badly of American beers, but for the rest of the world one has to accept the levels of misinformation and lack of knowledge that regular people have on any random subject they're not obsessed or don't work with. Especially something niche as craft beer.

Just to make a point, I'm sure that if I randomly select 20 people who visited BA today for a movie night and tell them we should watch a couple of '60s French movies most of those 20 would say there could never be any good French movie, especially from the '60s and that we should watch some good old Hollywood movie.

 

I don't know what is going on in the rest of the world, but in South Africa 99,9% of people drink shitty maize flavoured lager...
There is little point trying to explain the difference between what they drink and what I drink, as it will inevitably be met by "all beer tastes the same anyway"...

 

Coming from the States and now living in Netherlands... I can say, the general consumer has no idea about craft beer. Everyone is fairly ignorant to the beer world. But offer them a beer that they might like, based on what they usually drink. Chances are, you will instantly open up there eyes

For the Belgians and Dutch, I offer them a malty IPA thats not to extremely hopped. Usually that will get them hooked on trying more. (Example of a fairly easy to find beer over here that fits nicely: http://beeradvocate.com/beer/profile/1534/42079)

 

In a bar at LAX last Dec., on my way to New Zealand for five months, I had a conversation with a Kiwi who currently lived in England and was returning home for a visit. He claimed all American beer was crappy, like Bud, etc. I explained about the craft beer scene and all the great beers available but he condecendingly maintained his opinion. I asked him if he enjoyed the great cask ales available in England and he said he only drank keg lager(forget which one) because they always taste the same. He didn't like cask ales because they were "always different". When I asked him what New Zealand beers he liked, he said Steinlager, which is the Kiwi Budweiser, and he repeated that it , too, always tastes the same. I asked him about several Kiwi craft brewerys like Emersons, Moa, and 8 Wired, and he hadn't heard of them or any other craft breweries from his own country. I hadn't yet set foot in New Zealand, but knew more about it's beer scene than he did.

It wasn't his lack of awareness that bothered me, rather his arrogant assurance that our beer was crap.

 

Isn't Stella Artois about the same price as Sam Adams?

 

I know several immigrants from Germany who like to berate American beer for being "unbalanced." Darn those hops!

 

Two stories-

In the early 80's some friends and me were at our local pub enjoying some beers when we met a couple of Irish engineers doing some work in silicon valley. When it was time for another round I bought a pitcher of Anchor Steam to show off our local beer. When we asked what they thought of Anchor they said it was ok but preferred Heineken! What? Not even Guinness or Harp? Nope, Heineken and the Heineken they drank in Ireland was far superior to the Heineken we get because the Heineken they drink is brewed in Ireland

About the same time my parents were hosting a Kiwi for a week as he studied how we were starting to use computers in education. My Mom asked me to pick up some New Zealand beer for our guest. I picked up a sixer of Steinlager, some Anchor and some Sierra Nevada. Brian, the Kiwi, ignored the Steinlager and enjoyed the Anchor and SN. Seeing as Brian was closer in age to me and my brother than my parents we invited him out to the pub the next night and had a great time what crafts they had along with various imports. We had such a good time we went back the next two nights

 

I just talk louder...ya know, so they understand.

 

Not sure what people mean when they claim Germany is "nationalistic" about its beer culture. Certainly, the Germans I've met think German beer is best, but the regional pride far surpasses any sense of national beer pride.

The best beer to these individuals is not merely German, it is from the specific region wherein said German resides.