Threadshitting - A civil discussion…

Go back to no reply/OP only threads in the trade forums. Problem solved

 

We are talking about people and using an internet forum. Add on top of that, we are talking about beer. These are all supposed to be fun things, hobbies and community. Most people on here have the ability to be reasonable, but just like anything else, no one will ever fully agree with everyone else. Threadshitting is a part of the process of regulation, but, again, just like anything else, there are different ways to do it. Some are helpful and educational while others are just trying to be dicks. Getting bent out of shape by the latter just fuels the dick threadshitter to do it more. Some people have an agenda, some people are just trying to be helpful. To say it is always one or the other is a crock, but there are posters who I have noticed do the agenda thing. I have completed well over 20 trades, either IP or through shipping, and none of my threads have been shit on or deleted. How did I learn? I read some threads, looked at other trades, and started by trading with guys that have been around for a bit. Sent BM's to other vets and asked what to do. To me, it seemed appropriate, but others might lack education, insight, or just have no clue.

Honestly, new posters should be required to post in a new member forum section that has stickied posts from veteran posters about how to trade, netiquette, and basic expectations. Most newer young people don't want to read the forum rules, they want to trade what they think is hot for something else they heard is hot. A forum I am on doesn't allow you to sell things until you have been active for over a year or have 100 quality posts not in other people's for sale thread. Perhaps limiting trades based on posts is needed to regulate. Crap, this was a longer post than I wanted....I suck.

 

I think there are productive ways to point people in the right direction without making them feel like idiots through threadshitting. I'm new to trading myself and spent time reading through the trade forum and only responded to ISO threads for stuff I knew I had or had access to...but I also have experience in trading other things, so I know generally how to go about making connections, building trust and so on.

But I can see someone who had no experience with trading coming on here and just being really excited...and maybe posting an ISO:FT thread that is completely ridiculous (though that said, that doesn't mean someone won't trade with them...Dark Lord is a rare treat if you have two bottles but probably a little less so if you somehow got a case)...and then getting run over the coals. Sure, there is a chance this makes them go back and read the rules and look into things a bit more...but there is also the chance that they decide that the trading community is full of jerks who aren't willing to civilly point them in the right direction and just don't bother.

Sure, seeing threads like "ISO: Kate the Great FT: Rogue Dead Guy" are maybe annoying to some and at the very least a touch silly...but if you're not going to help the n00b out in a constructive manner why even bother looking at the thread? I guess I don't understand going out of your way to make someone feel stupid...or being that annoyed or protective over your little piece of the interwebs.

I'm thankful to the people who helped me out and I'll do my best to help people in the future...Seems to me that's the best way to build a community and to make that community more widely accessible...which I think should be the goal since the point of trading is to get stuff you want to try/don't have access to and the more people trading increases the likelihood you'll be able to find what you want.

Just my two cents as a n00b.

 

As a person who's only ever done a handful of in-person easy trades and never gotten into trading via the forums I can say threadshitting would be an annoying and really offputting activity that would make want to stop posting in the forums altogether. I can understand the "wanting to help the noobs" angle, but why not send a beer mail instead of publicly turning off someone who just might want to take my offer but will now reconsider because you've proclaimed I'm asking too much. If you want to help me, send me a beer mail so I know why my deal doesn't get accepted, but if it does get accepted why should you care?

 

My phrase is, just because I am new to the forum, doesn't mean I am new to the planet. Where would you go in person as a new member and then just start running off your mouth or doing silly things without expecting to have consequences? Either social isolation or someone verbally challenging you will happen. Any car meet or social function I've been new to attend, I've wanted to feel things out and get to know some of the people. Enthusiasm can come off as idiocy quite easily on the web, which is why I don't think newer members should be able to trade during their grace period.

 

Interesting observation: very few of the people who have commented as "pro" threadshitting actually threadshit often.

 

Well, I'm not disagreeing about a grace period since I think that would ensure that those trading are solid members of the community (and thus more trustworthy) but I disagree about threadshitting. I guess I fail to see the point, outside of to put someone in their place...If their thread receives no replies they'll likely come to the realization that something is wrong with their trade all on their own...I guess I just don't see the point of being overly critical when you can just ignore it...no one is forcing you to read that thread...

Being helpful and nice to n00bs costs very little and can make someone who is just getting their feet wet feel welcome...and I say this as someone who has spent 5 years as a moderator in a trading community and deals with n00bs who don't read the rules and so on on a very regular basis.

 

We hope, but there are always those that don't and then the site has multiple posts on the same crap or bump city starts happening.

I get how people can be turned off by comments, but, again, I look at it from a real life perspective. If I am in public and someone is talking loudly or about something that is totally off, I have a choice. I can say nothing and self regulate, or I can interject. If I interject, I know that I can do it nicely--"I overheard you say....and from my experience...." or you can be a dick. I may get a conversation out of it that was helpful to both parties. Hell, the person with that guy/girl might actually have something to add to your comment. Remember how people communicated way back in the '90's?? I might also get a backlash and defensiveness to my comment too. I take the risk doing things in public to have someone approach me. Trade threads aren't much different. Intent and presentation are the key factors when responding. My guess, though, is that people who are discussing in this thread aren't the people that are starting up questionable trade threads.

 

There has been no real definitions given for threadshitting that work. Here is a FT from a noob.

http://beeradvocate.com/community/threads/ft-2009-deschutes-mirror-mirror-iso-bcbs.14103/

Would it be threadshitting if I replied that many bottles of 2009 Mirror Mirror had infection issues? Probably it would doom the trade (but maybe not, thinking of Matilda here).

If that isn't threadshitting, but a public service to help out a noob and the community with knowledge many may not know, what makes it different from other replies many would consider threadshitting?

If that is threadshitting, than couldn't it be said that threadshitting can have an important and helpful purpose?

 

Did MarkIntihar just punch that horse out???

 

You bet your ass I did!

 

With this you would take away a valuable learning tool for new traders. Personally I think it would be greatly helpful to see deals get done in public threads instead of BMs. Otherwise you won't know what lands what unless you make a thread asking the "worth" or your beer, or what it takes to get X and then the threadshitting commences.

It's really all cyclical.

 

Unrealistic trade offers relate to whales. What's with the increase in labeling recent-release beer trades as unrealistic? Seems like a lot of people are trying to extrapolate speedwayjim's whale list so that it's 100 pages long...

 

Not a threadshit. A friendly PSA saved my ass from trading a potentially infected bottle of Churchills (2010, IIRC). In fact, both parties had no idea.

The notion that all replies in an ISOFT are threadshits is poppycock. You're on the internet, grow a pair. A politely worded "this trade is probably not going to happen" is good advice, whereas "JUST LET HIM TRADE HIS BEER" is probably bad advice if the the ISOFT is lopsided.

 

That poor child.

 

One of the through lines of this thread relates to the internet as a whole: Millions of pieces of information and no way to get at any of it precisely or concisely. (Which is exacerbated by the purging of the old trade forums and all the information in them.) If anyone ever wanted a good blog idea, a peer-reviewed trading blog others could point to would be a good one.

 

does it really kill her/his chances? while there may be a small subset of BCBS traders who have never heard of mirror mirror and just checked reviews upon seeing the ISO, i would guess the vast majority of people who would be interested in that beer in the first place (and are looking to trade BCBS) are aware of the risk.

also, if any observers think that poster is unaware of the mirror mirror 09 issues, they could always private message him/her.

honestly, i would be immediately suspicious of anyone who would contribute to or edit such a blog. i would find it hard to believe that they're not just trying to manipulate value for their own gain... otherwise, it seems weird to me that they would find such a site necessary in the first place (in light of, for example, the points shogo brings up).

 

I do...many people call "thread shitting" things that aren't, its almost like inconveniencing the ISO is a sin. Have you seen how many people ask 1:1? sorry don't mean to thread shit or I don't mean to thread shit but "facts about the beers in the ISO/FT." I think people asking legit questions and posting facts aren't thread shitters except for the fact that they're saying I don't mean to thread shit but or its variables which makes people look for the unbalanced side of trades. I'm the type that I don't give a fuck what other people wanna think, if I think something is useful for the whole community to see, especially newbies I'll post it and if its more opinion based I'll BM it. A lot of people feel the need to include these clauses for fear of back lash because they're thread shitting...that's equally they're fault for being spine less and not having tough skin and the community's fault for looking down on even things that aren't really thread shitting.