Why does Germany = Beer?

German wine is pretty fine as well. One hundred years ago it had a reputation which equaled France. Today German wine is a good as ever. Only its reputation hasn't kept up.

 

Exactly, my Scottish brother. In their zeal to profess the admittedly fine aspects of German beer, folks tend to dismiss the Teutonic wines. World class, also.

 

You're probably right on that point, but I've learned to never underestimate the EU's willingness to over legislate and regulate...

 

Yes. Agreed. My post was not meant to disparage German wine but simply to make a [hopefully] fun point.

 

My German friend Gunter said more than once, "in France they drink the crap and export the good stuff, in Germany we export the crap and drink the good stuff".

 

The USA and Australia both make better wine than Germany and France. The USA makes much better beer than Germany. Haven't been to the UK so I can't comment on their beer or wine.

 

How many times have you been to Germany; where, specifically, have you been; and, most importantly, what beers did you drink at the source while you were there? Just trying to get an idea of how you developed such authority as to be able to state something so definitively.

 

What is your definition of "better"?

 

The only true part of this post is the last phrase. Is the other part an attempt at humour?

 

Been all over Germany Munich, Cologne, Doseldorf, Nuremberg, Schwangau part of Barvaria, and honestly nothing aside from Ayinger was even memorable although there was one other really good Dopplebock that I can't remember the name of. Not saying German beer is bad, it's not just that the USA is better. Kopi Luwak, Heady, Pliny the Edler(haven't had the chance to try the Younger yet),BA Plead the 5th, BCBS, Darklord, Dragons Milk, Double Crooked Tree, CBS, FIS, Bigfoot, Marshall Zhukov, Rumpkin I could go on and on.

 

If this isn't simply a troll/joke, then I'd just say that you're comparing apples to oranges and that beer is not a competition.

 

Bigger=Better. Right, carry on.

 

Not a joke if I offered you one of those beers or a German beer what would you pick? I get annoyed when people equate Germany and beer it's completely disrespectful to the American brews that are better. In a way beer sort of is a competition all the breweries are competing for your beer dollars at the store right?

 

I've had most of the beers you listed. Of course they are all well-made beers (except Dark Lord...and, well, Dragon's Milk could use some refining). However -- to quote Michael Jackson -- "such muscle has limited application." Personally, I am more into actual beer drinking than thrill seeking, so I'd almost invariably choose the German ones. As for competing for my dollars, I can typically get nearly a case of Spaten Helles for the price of a 4-pack of BCBS, so going with the German beer again here. Thrill seeking, collecting, and trading beer probably do all involve some aspect of competition, which I see as ultimately detracting from the development of a viable U.S. "craft" beer culture. As for me, Spaten #4 is just as good as #6 or #12 -- no competition.

 

...also, more than half the beers you listed are all but unobtainable for anyone with little interest in chasing trucks, waiting in lines, and/or illegally shipping beer across state borders (not to mention all the juvenile BS that comes with participating in the trading forums).

I realize this is a big part of the "thrill" for many people, but I personally much prefer to simply walk into a tavern/pub/beer garden, order my beer (#s 1-???), settle in and enjoy.

 

German Beer is not all great but their national and regional macro brands are for the most part heads and tails better than American Macro's, shoot I would put many German exports up against the best American craft beer. My point is their everyday beers are a notch above anything we mass produce.

 

I second this. Widmer has some other good stuff, but their hefe is crap, IMO.

 

One reason. Name the best beers in these categories:
Hefeweizen
Munich Helles
German Pilsner
Doppelbock
Helles/Mai Bock
Munich Dunkel
Weizenbock
Bock
Kolsch

Honestly, on my end I can say that at least the top 2 are all German in every category.

 

Hundreds, probably (if not thousands). The use adjuncts only took off when US lager beer brewers tried unsuccessfully to duplicate the so-called Bohemian/Pilsen type of lager beer using 6-row, in the last quarter of the 19th century. Before and after that, many brewers made a number of different styles of German and other central European styles of lager, many of which continued to be all-malt, including the most popular, the Bavarian style lagers, of which George Ehret (the #1 US brewer in the 1870-80s) wrote in 1890s:

It was only after the beer drinking public overwhelming choose the brewers' pilsner brands that that style - and adjunct usage - became ubiquitous in the US.

As Adolphus Busch told Congress during the Pure Food Hearing in 1902:

Many German-founded lager breweries continued to brew all-malt lager styles (bock, Wiener, Kapunziner, Muinchener, Kulmbacher, Wuerzburger,Dortmunder) in most - but not all - cases, in addition to their more popular adjunct "pilsner" style lagers, up to Prohibition and even after Repeal - US All Malt Beers.

 

Do you have any record of those brewers calling the use of 6-row and/or rice an "innovative twist" on a conventional style?