Adding LME to all grain batch

I've done 10 gal batches on my 15 gal kettle. Use antifoam and keep the boil at a simmer. You'll get better hop utilization if you add the LME near the end of the boil. Maybe before you add your chiller and your whirlfloc.

 

I just ran some numbers, and it seems like you should be able to mash enough grain for a quad in a 15 gallon MLT.

Are you just getting particularly low efficiency?

 

Aww, I missed that it was a 15 gal mash tun, not brew kettle. Sorry about that. I still stand by what's been said. You may have to mash thick, but that's a good thing when doing such a heavy beer anyway. Take your time doughing in. You'll have an hour to kill anyway.

 

FWIW, I use a ten gallon mash tun. I typically do ten gallon batches of 'normal' gravity beers. I tend to do five gallon batches of heavy beers, partly because of the size of my mash tun, and partly because ten gallons is a lot of what typically turns out to be a slow moving beer (though the last part is only a minor consideration). If I really have my heart set on ten gallons, I have no problem using light DME to get me where I need to be. I add it near the end of the boil to minimize the effect on color and hop utilization.

 

How did you figure out he could brew the beer he wants to brew without knowing his intended gravities?

 

As a general rule I tend to add LME over the course of the boil, making sure it all gets at least a few good minutes of rolling boil (not that this is a huge concern*, but it makes me feel better).

If color is not an issue, add it whenever (and keep in mind that the malliard reactions that change the color of wort over a boil aren't especially pronounced either, so even then it's not a huge concern). Just make sure you don't dump so much in at once that it sinks to the bottom and kills the boil all at once, otherwise scorching could be an issue. I've found that if you add in portions and give it a stir, and you have a good heat source, this won't be any issue at all. Of course I have no particular preference for LME or DME as long as both have a reasonable assurance of being fresh**, and you handle them appropriately.

*I suspect LME has similar properties to things like jelly, in that the osmotic properties prevent bacteria from wreaking havoc, but I am not truly sure if this is so, so I always make sure everything that goes into my beer (boil) gets at least a few good minutes of rolling boil.

**freshness with DME and LME is not a matter of hyperventilation, it's a matter of being reasonable. LME that's 5 weeks out of manufacturer isn't "about to go bad," and DME stored properly can certainly last a long time. If anyone has any solid evidence as to the reasonable shelf-life of LME or DME, do tell. I have yet to obtain any of either that I could noticeably tell the dif as to its freshness, but then I have used sources that have a reasonable turn-over rate too.

 

I looked at the style guidelines.

 

So what if he wanted to exceed style guidelines? I think its pretentious to assume that someone is wrong without knowing what they intend to do.

 

I was trying to help him, as it seemed he was only adding LME because he believed he couldn't do a full mash. If it's pretension to take time out of my day to run numbers based on his equipment and the intended style guidelines, in an attempt to help him with his brew...I guess I'm pretentious.

I'm not exactly sure what's going on here, or why you have taken issue with what I've done.

 

I don't see much info on his system, and I see no info on the recipe he is going for at all. I take issue with the fact that you have next to zero information and somehow are telling the poor guy he is wrong. His question wasn't "hey, can I mash this?", it was"is it okay to use lme?". I wasn't suprised to find out that his system doesn't allow him to utilize the whole mash tun space for grain. Most of us on here know our systems well enough to know what we can and can't do. If he says it won't fit, why not just assume he knows his system and let it go intead of telling him he is wrong?

 

When did I tell him he was wrong?

This is what I said:

"I just ran some numbers, and it seems like you should be able to mash enough grain for a quad in a 15 gallon MLT.

Are you just getting particularly low efficiency?"

Not only did I not tell him he was wrong, I asked why I might be wrong, based on the information he provided. Then I asked a specific question as to why, with his equipment, he wan't able to. In fact, I asked a question that is usually the most likely reason.

He said he had a 15 Gallon MLT, and he explained the style of beer he wanted to make. So, I knew roughly the volume he had to work with, and the OG of the style he wanted to brew. So I plugged that in, when it looked like it could, possibly, maybe work, I asked him about it. Then after he explained that 3 gallons of the MLT is unavailable to him, I understood the issue...and left it at that.

 

I wouldn't expect over 75% efficiency with a large grain bill. It normally drops the bigger the beer gets. I would safely assume 60% efficiency with that grain bill and figure out what I needed on the fly. Until you've done a big beer and maxed your system, you haven't a clue where it'll go anyways. Trust me!

 

Give it a damn break.. Why the neck stomping?

There is always a seemingly endless amount of things that need to be known, which are unknown until asked around here.

The question brought up a good point that the OP doesn't have an idea where his efficiency will come out at. That alone would be good information for him to have, considering he thinks his efficiency will go up with a bigger beer. It's opposite.

 

BrewCipher does have a tab that will provide an estimated change in mash efficiency, based on grain bill size. (It works for single batch sparges and for no-sparges.) Just didn't want anyone to think they have to start with a guess.

 

Understandable- I don't think you have to exactly "guess" but, until you've done a really large beer, you won't know where you stand efficiency wise. Some people haven't played with BrewCipher yet, but it's good to know there's a tool there.

 

I'm feeling particularly argumentative lately, and maybe I am reading more into it as well, however I still don't see how it helps to arbitrarily run some numbers is going to help a guy out. There is a lot of misinformation that gets thrown around on this forum (myself being guilty of some of it I am sure of), and the off the cuff "number running" does absolutely NOTHING to help this guy out.
Unless we know his OG and mash tun volume we cant possibly tell anyone what they can and cannot mash.