Collectors vs Brewers?

Homebrewers without a ton of experience can make a beer comparable to heady. It's not that hard. The information is out there. Do the right things and after a few attempts you'll get in the ball park and might end up with something you like more than heady.

 

IMO, it's kind of crazy to attempt cloning a beer before you have tasted it. A generic recipe might get you in the ballpark but upon tasting the real thing you will learn stuff that words and recipes cannot convey... you need that knowledge to really get close.

 

It's not easy but you'd be surprised what some homebrewers can do.

 

I've never been a collector. Over the past few years I've amassed a modest cellar (~3 cases worth) of more or less everyday stuff I plan to drink, but I'm curious to see what happens with some age on it. For a while, I was into the 'thrill of the hunt' but now, I don't want to chase. The three rarest beers I've gotten (BBA Bigfoot, KBS and Cantillon Gueuze) have been the result of being on a store's email list. Twice, I've emailed and put in a reservation when I saw the email - and it just happened to work. For the KBS, I just walked in after work and asked if there was any left. There was. Trying to be in the right place at the right time, waiting in line, etc. has lost it's appeal. And I'd rather spend the money on brewing supplies anyway. There are a few I'll still buy to put away (Bigfoot, BCBS, Curmudgeon (which is absolutely fucking fantastic with 9-12 months on it)), but beer's for drinking. Sometimes it just takes a little longer.

When it comes to brewing, I intentionally brew a lot of session ales, because a) I really like them, and b) there aren't many available (session IPAs don't fucking count). And by session ales, I mean 4% and under. I've tried one barley wine, and that didn't go as planned. I'll do another one eventually, but probably not before I do a BDSA. I'm probably good for one Double IPA a year. Mostly though, I brew and drink mid-range (5%-7%) beers. I don't care much about making an exact facsimile of Heady or anything else, because while that and others are excellent beers, drawing on them for inspiration without sweating the exact hop additions/proportions, etc will still probably yield pretty damn good beer as long as your process is down.

 

I do both. I don't know if I call myself a collector, though I do have some pretty heavy duty walez down in my cellar.
I don't really brew a huge amount, maybe once every 2 - 3 months - space, and the patience of SWMBO tend to limit things.
I probably have 30 or so cases down there, probably 2/3 commercial and 1/3 homebrew.
We do plan to move later this year, and I got permission for a keezer and dedicated brew area, so I will probably brew more - it is a drag dragging everything out and breaking it down every time I brew.

 

I'm not a collector, but I have vast quantities of store bought and homebrewed beer on hand. People give me beer, I used to have new employees bring me their local beers(I pay them well for the beer they bring) but now I have so much beer and no time to drink so it just piles up. Also friends and family give me beer for gifts, and also probably to help clean out their excess beers, so that adds up.
I love to brew, but can't drink the beer as fast as I brew it so I have a couple of brewing partners I split 10 gallon batches with. And I can't say Iv'e never been inspired by a particular beer enough to try to brew something like it, but I don't even try to clone my own homebrews so there's no way I'll worry about cloning something commercial. I'll keep buying Rochefort 10 even though I brew a fairly decent Belgian quad.

 

I was a serious collector who started homebrewing specifically to replace my constant collecting / trading / beer travel for special releases. After doing 200 trades in 2 years, I did the math and reflected on just how much $$$ I was spending. Also felt like I took collecting / trading / whale hunting pretty much as far as it could go. Decided to start working towards gaining the ability to make world class brews. Certainly nowhere near there yet, but enjoying the journey so far!

 

Homebrew all the way. Trading beer I have found is dumb. Distro has gotten descent down in SoFl to the point where if I can't find it on the shelf, I'll brew what I'm craving. Lately my fridge sees SNPA cans, Pils Urquell, and the occassional Jolly Pumpkin bomber (JP is where its at!) + homebrew kegs.

 

Bullshit. If it were that simple, don't you think other brewers would make a beer that good? I think the "I can make something close to Heady" people have low standards for what they consider "close." I'm a homebrewer too, and a pretty damn good one, and while yes, making a beer that tastes similar to Heady is not that hard, making a beer with a similar flavor, aroma, and mouthfeel is not.

A reliable water profile for homebrewing Heady is NOT out there. That fact alone shoots a great big hole in your claim.

 

Interesting. Well, I think the "I can't make anything close to Heady" people have poor brewing skills.

It's not that difficult to clone most commercial beers. It might take a few tries, even working from an existing clone recipe. You're going to have to make adjustments for your system, the water, play with the fermentation temp, try different brands of malt, whatever, but if you're willing to give to stick with it and make those adjustments, there's no reason it can't be done. If you know what you're doing.

Brewing is a process, and that process can be replicated by anyone who understands it. It's not a magic trick. It's not as if the guys at Alchemist know something nobody else knows, or have access to ingredients nobody else has, or have a mash tun that works on different principles than everybody else's. They're making beer with the same ingredients and processes as everyone else, and anybody who really wanted to could copy their beers--assuming they knew what they were doing.

The idea that there's something incredibly unique about this or that beer is just hype, plain and simple. Homebrewers usually understand that. Collectors don't.

 

Actually, they have access to 2 ingredients nobody else has - their water and their yeast. There's a good reason that water ends up being the most secretive part of most brewers' recipes. And I have yet to come across a clone recipe that provides any decent guidance on how to build a proper water profile for cloning Heady. People have guesses, sure, but if it's easy to do, you can't tell that when you try to find recipes. Take a look at the BYO clone recipe, for example - there's nothing but guesswork as to how to build a water profile. The yeast you can culture, but is that the same yeast they use for fermentation? Does anybody know?

I'm a homebrewer myself. I'm currently trying to clone Edward. After a few iterations, I feel like I'm pretty close, but my beer is just not quite as good and I don't think it ever will be. And it will never be so exact a copy that I won't go for the real thing when I have the chance. "Close enough" might be a fine standard for most people, and that's fine. It's just not for me.

 

Not true. Everyone who buys a bottle of their beer has access to their yeast. Many people have cultured it. It'll probably be available commercially soon, if it's not already. As for water, you can build any water you want if you know what you're doing.

 

So, you know the water profile used by Alchemist in brewing Heady? I'm all ears. You are certain that the yeast you find in a can is exclusively the yeast used during fermentation?

 

ECY and YB sell the Heady Topper strain... Shh... Don't tell nobody tho...

 

I don't know the water profile. But I know it can be duplicated. If I was going to try to do this, I would first check to see what information is available: some brewers will tell you exactly what their water profile is, others will give hints. If I couldn't get any info, I would start with the Burton water profile and make adjustments.

I have never cultured their yeast myself, but there are lots of people who claim have done so with good results. And I believe it's available from a couple of different commercial sources, though again I have not checked this out myself.

 

not sure where "comparable to Heady" turned into "Clone of Heady" but whatever.

Put me in the column of "I make great beer, better than much of what I can buy" - beyond that, who gives a shit.

cheers--
--Michael

 

That doesn't make anyone less of a brewer nor mean it's not possible for many people to brew IIPAs of that caliber. Most people are trying to make the next Heady Topper and many are in the same ball park but they don't brand as well, get hyped, or are as limited. Also, most US breweries don't use more expensive english malts like Heady but they could if they weren't being such cheapskates.

 

As I said, I've never tasted Heady, so I can't comment on its clone-ability. That said, I seldom have a desire to clone a commercial beer - if I can buy it, why would I bother making it? That said, there are characteristics of commercial beers that I clone all the time ...successfully, I might add. If a commercial beer blows me away, I decide exactly what it is I like about it and build a recipe around those characteristics. My homebrews are virtually always better than commercial beers - from my perspective (if they weren't, why bother?). But I get much of my inspiration from the creative minds behind the commercial beers I love.

 

I often homebrew beers that I can’t buy; either the beer is not distributed in my area or is not commercially brewed.

In the context of ‘clones’, I have homebrewed a couple of batches of Simcoe/Amarillo IPA which was ‘inspired’ by Alpine Duet. I can’t genuinely claim I am brewing a clone since the only thing my beer and Alpine Duet really have in common is the same hops are used. I know the beer buyer of a local beer store/restaurant who I share my homebrewed beers with. I gave him some of my Simcoe/Amarillo IPA and made mention that it was inspired by Alpine Duet. Somehow he got me a bottle of Alpine Duet (he traded for it?). I was able to do a taste test with this bottle and I actually preferred my homebrewed version better (maybe a function of beer freshness?).

Below is a list of some of the unique beers I have homebrewed in the past 6-9 months; beers that I can’t buy (or readily buy):

· Galaxy hopped IPA

· Cranberry Belgian Pale Ae

· Grodziskie

· Tmavý Ležák (Czech Dark Lager)

· Classic American Pilsner

· Sticke Altbier

· Smoky Brown Ale

· Harvest Ale (Wet hopped with homegrown hops_

· Etc.

Cheers!

 

“My homebrews are virtually always better than commercial beers - from my perspective (if they weren't, why bother?). But I get much of my inspiration from the creative minds behind the commercial beers I love.” That is very consistent with the Alpine Duet inspired IPA that I homebrew.

Cheers!