SYNEK (draft system): looking to replace growlers?

And there's your answers about price point... It's a luxury product.

A growler is typically $5-10 and has unlimited usage. I fully expect to see this in SkyMall...

I like the "Green" argument as well, because a reusable glass growler is less green than a 1 time use box and most likely un-recyclable bag.

They're also asking the brewer's/servers to create special pricing at the 128oz level. Good luck with that and whatever adapter you need to get these filled.

Cool product, adoption is going to be tough, and I think the price point will be very prohibitive to adoption. I can buy a kegerator, for $500. If you want to be a subscription-like service (meaning pay per bag usage), you should be charging almost nothing for the machine and make your profit of of the box/bags and licensing. Few consumers are going to enter the market at $400, and again adoption is key. If I walk into Revolution or whomever with this thing and give them the adapter, they're going to look at me funny and tell me I can buy a growler.

 

This product and the one someone recently posted that stores beer underground has further proven to me that craft beer has become quite attractive to people that are very wealthy. Businesses know this and are responding as expected.

 

"Only" $399 for the dispenser? And you need to buy new bags constantly? Umm, no thanks.

You can put your own kegerator together for half that, and save more money on the free (deposit) kegs and cheaper beer inside them to boot.

I can't imagine this will have a market larger than those few folks who have run out of luxury items to spend their too much money on.

 

Commodity based cultures and hobbies (which is what craft beer is turning into) are always attractive to wealthy people

 

Sure are. I just hoped we could hide in the dark corner a little longer. It's been slowly showing up (limited release club memberships was a warning sign), but now it's full fledged!

 

Well, as much as I'm not a fan of these types of business models, it is a proven model that helps gauge customer loyalty and new business. Investors love "subscription" models or models that keep people coming back to them to purchase consumable items. It's not much different than Keurig / Soda Stream in that sense... Practical for beer? We shall wait and see..

Well, it isn't for most of us, but a majority of people aren't that responsible with their growlers... I've brainstormed solutions with co-workers before, and this is the most logical step to make it sanitary.. there may be a market for it, how big is yet to be seen.

 

Have us used the TapIT Cap?

I live minutes from Kuhnhenns, if I can find some reviews of the product I will have a growler of DRIPA in my fridge at all times, or well at least until the expand.

 

Yeah, this looks destined to fail, but I hope it works out for the company! As noted by others, for the price point, I'd just invest in a kegerator.

 

I agree, this looks like an ideal SkyMall product. I noticed the photo's on the manufacturer's site look like they were taken in a fairly high end kitchen, certainly more upscale than mine anyway. It does look like a cool product. It has the advantage over a growler if it indeed keeps the beer pressurized until you finish it. The primary drawbacks I see are price point and the places willing to provide the beer to end customers this format.

 

Again, thank you for the comments and interest. A few clarity points:

• SYNEK will retail for under $399, meaning we will likely launch with at $299 model. Cheaper than a kegerator and no additional tanks, cleaning lines, taps to purchase like with a Kegerator. Our hope is that if SYNEK is successful at launch, that price point will come down in future models for a wider audience.
• We will be releasing a 3rd party sustainability report that shows the major green impact SYNEK will have.

SYNEK may sound taboo to some, expensive to others, but we can probably all agree that beer is meant to be easily shared with the world - and that is what we strive to achieve. We know that introducing a new technology into a traditional industry is difficult, but we are willing to fight for it and hope that you can support our mission.

As you will see from the Kickstarter video we will release on June 16th, we have the support from breweries across the world who are waiting to package through SYNEK, but we cannot help support them without your support first.

Keep the feedback coming!

Cheers,
The SYNEK Team

 

How does it deal with foaming on filling (since it looks like a sealed system), how many ounces are lost during a practical 128 oz fill in both a draft and a production line setting (keeping in mind that no employee anywhere will spend 5 minutes waiting for foam to die down multiple times)?

Your site and video doesn't do much to clarify if the bags can be used without the dispenser system, though they make me think it's not possible (w/o a hack). So the only market for beers packed in the 'cartridge' is limited to those with a 200+ dollar dispenser, unlike universally usable, portable boxed wine. Also a novel item unlike a Keurig, which is more an upsell of an e-coffee maker, for which a large market already exists. Refrigerator and less so kegerator must make up 99% of the beer storage market...So how will you convince a bar, much less a brewery to stock filling equipment (even if Synek supplies it) and invest capital in bags with such infrequent use?

Was the 128 oz size well thought out? Bar employee is tied up longer than pouring 64 oz; each fill eats a substantial gallon + waste of a 15.2 gallon or smaller keg; at bar prices, 128 oz will be a much, much pricier sell than 64/ 32 oz to-go and you won't talk bar owners into discounting a 'bag fill' if they get more profit a glass at a time; and how happy will bar customers and owners be when a keg kicks after filling half a bag? That's just lost product... new bag, wasted beer, wasted time.

A production brewery is efficient, automated, filling bags off a bright tank by hand is not. Why would a brewer invest in automating production of such a market-limited format (if such automation is available, tested, and competitively priced...). If it's adopted by breweries, that means retail, which means hoping to grab a larger stretch of refrigerated space than a smaller vol. bag for a product that has 0 market compared to 12/24 packs of equivalent package size.

Have you considered rolling this out in, say, SoCal exclusively to see if it can be popular with consumers in an environment where a larger density of breweries and bars are on board and supply some variety to owners? Otherwise won't most consumers realistically have no selection, at least once their local bar rejects them and their tubes?

Bagged beverages have great benefits, but you've got a long, expensive road ahead. Bag-in-ball hasn't yet been widely adopted stateside, despite frequently lower shipping costs, no cleaning, possibility of using existing production lines (some work with light modification, some require new lines); and that replaces capital-eating SS kegs, not cheap aluminum cans and glass like this product.

PS - Isn't advertising the "trading and shipping" advantage sort of a legal grey area

 

Sorry, I just can't stop...

but literally the only way a homebrewer can use the product as-intended is if they fill a bag from a keg or tap, which means they have kegging equipment and no need for your bag? Shouldn't you target "craft beer enthusiasts"?

I can't stop thinking about the sales numbers - You say you have breweries ready to use your system - why haven't they adopted already-in-production Draftmark, which has big AB accounts attached to it; has targeted major, beer-enthusiast cities; is sold on Amazon and in Target; is a fraction of the cost and portable; has a social media following; and seems to have shaky success, adoption, and availability regardless. AB must have working production lines filling their products; I presume Synek would have to R&D commercial scale production, even if it's relatively minor tweaks to current packaging facilities, which means major profits and capital to re-invest (*chirp chirp*) or another go at fund-raising?

Brewers might support you, but they're not putting POs in your hand without a proven customer base, right? and smart customers will want mucho breweries for selection? chicken-egg?

Availability, freshness, and distribution seem to be the big complaints for Draftmark; how could you possibly overcome those? Do you think AB distributors will "like" carrying your system if it directly competes with Draftmark, muchless pushing it to retailers? If Synek took off, why wouldn't AB take their existing deal with Draftmark and squash you? Why wouldn't craft brewers just license Draftmark if it takes off with AB?

What am I missing? You're selling an upscale model of a competing product that has limited market and AB as a partner?

 

As a guy who likes homebrewing but finds brewing and kegging 5 gallon batches (and hates bottling) I can certainly see the appeal of this product. And if craft brewers are willing to package their beers in this in the future it just might work.

As to the Draftmark system, Bud, Bass, Michelob, Shock Top, and GI just isn't a big enough appeal for me (only the GI would tempt me). Plus it is battery operated? Ouch!

If the price point is right it might work. Plus I give them credit for coming to market with a fairly innovative product.

 

That $5/bag price has got to come down, but you have a very clever product there. I do already have a kegerator with three taps, but I often want beer somewhere else, either elsewhere in my home/yard or at parties. Since I would be filling the cartridges myself, (I have seen that connector, works great on the right faucet/tube setup), many of the objections/complaints mentioned upthread would not apply to the way I would use it.

So, you drop a filled cartridge inside a sleeve in the unit which chills it and has some means to pressurize the outside of the cartridge to dispense beer. No beer contact with the air or mechanical pump? No need to drag CO2 into it? So, I fill up four cartridges and pack them in a big cooler and go somewhere that has electricity which would load me up with about 44 cold beers, have I got it?

Yeah, I can see this could be awkward filling at a busy bar that has growlers, but there are some growler only operations, and more of them on the way in upscale grocery stores, boutique liquor stores, etc that are still getting in on the ground floor of distributing fresh beer that might take a serious look at your setup and work with customers on the deal. They could also stock up on those cartridges buying enough of them to bring that price down per unit.

Good luck, might get one for myself....

 

I actually kinda like it

 

If 5 gallons is too much or portability is important - why haven't you invested in a 2-3 gallon keg plus a DIY jockey box? Or why haven't you bought into the 5 liter mini-keg systems that you could "keg" condition in (and thus works for "keggers" and "bottlers") and re-use? Those are also filled by Bell's, Rogue, Spaten, Bitburger, and other Euro and macro brewers. True, they might have stability issues if gravity feed rather than CO2, but cost less even at the top end, can be portable, and have existing market, variety, and a range of dispensers - from picnic-style to stylish mini-fridge, using gravity, chargers, or tanks. Who cares about a rechargeable battery in the Draftmark system - it works plugged in or take it charged up - the Synek system works "where there's an outlet," ie. in far fewer places outside the kitchen.

Why, why would a craft brewer or bar invest in this if other similar systems haven't taken off after years on the market? Why would customers buy in w/o some differentiation? Those are lower priced appliances, selling macro beer to MACRO market, and still not able to make it big. If a million dollars worth of Synek dispensers sell, you've got 3k-ish units floating around - let's say I'm a top 10 craft brewery on the east coast with distro in every state east of the Miss, I still have next to no opportunity to sell my beer in your bag because it doesn't work w/o a dispenser which means MY sales rely on YOUR ability to get an expensive appliance to the masses. A brewer invests in your packaging, in updating or adding a production line, in QA testing and label approval for a new format; and distros and retailers tie capital and refrigerated space up for such a limited market? Again, why don't I just license into a system that can be used by more consumers, like mini-kegs or draftmark? Why not a growler-fill line? How many Synek dispensers do YOU need to sell before I have a customer base large enough to recoup my investment?

IF you convince bars to start filling these they've got the same issue with a very small consumer base in any given state or city + most bar customers come to drink, not to get beer to go + those bar "bag fills" are now competing, at high-margin bar prices, directly with bags in package stores. Oh, and I'm a bar so I have an on-premise Tavern License, not a growler-ready brewpub or brewer license, so I should invest in an off-premise license? Or Synek hopes lots of states will adopt legislation that broadens which licensees can sell growlers (and broaden the definition of a growler to include plastic bladders? minor wording, but massive headache I bet.).

Let's say those things happen, bars fill them up no problem - You're selling increased shelf life, CO2 displacement keeping things fresh, but what about bags that are filled from hasn't-been-cleaned-in-2-weeks bar line? Now you've got a customer who isn't happy with the quality of beer from a bar after a week, "but it was great on tap!," so who's getting the blame? The bar, the brewer, or Synek? Brewers really don't want to give crappy impressions of their product and won't be happy with accounts doing that.

Or what if your dispenser is just not 4-stars, then the whole system is brought down? unlike the multitude of products that dispense mini-kegs. Why tie my production to a single manufacturer's device?

Why will Synek succeed where others have not? I am being harsh - Synek is a good idea but not a business that will overcome the barriers to entry and success. I don't want to see enthusiastic people on Kickstarter get bilked into supporting this, nor do I want to see inventive people tied to a sinkhole product like this. Synek is not new technology, it's an iteration of a technology that hasn't caught on.

Why aren't you working with craft breweries to offer a cheap way that they can pack into 5L mini-kegs, presumably the most widespread large-format non-glass option (aluminum is "green" and cheaper to ship than glass, right?), and sell THOSE through an online retailer so the existing mini-keg user market can order nationwide and have craft beer delivered in a shipping-cost effective qty and format? Why compete with a market when you can instead leverage it to sell craft beer? Mobile 5L canning. There's a business that capitalizes on a missing niche. The mini-keg and online booze markets exist and could work for you, brewers know them; why try to sell a new product, new packaging method, create a new consumer base and production/ distro logistics all from scratch? Synek says beer should be easily shared, but you're taking suuuch a cumbersome path!

 

I already use 3 gallon kegs and from what I have read the 5l mini keg systems for homebrewers are not as good as their advertising (but do I admit that I haven't tried them).

From what my local distributor says craft beer in 5l mini kegs do not sell well so it would be just as risky to try and break into that market. Sometimes a new form of a technology that hasn't caught on (5l and Draftmark) might be enough to get over the hump the original ideas/products haven't been able to break.

 

Haha...they've been boxing wine forever...now we will have boxed beer. Either you keep it in a cardboard box in your fridge (yawn) or you buy the cooler that the bags go in? Buy bags...check, buy cooler...check, spend more money than you need...check.

Cool idea for serving a quantity of craft beer and kudos for the recycling aspect but in the end it comes down to cost verses convenience and until I see the cost I won't know how convenient it is.

 

If that distro is saying "5L craft mini kegs don't move", why will it ever say "maybe these 128L craft bladders will be a winner." Companies will look to other brewers/ distros/ packagers who have invested in a similar market and be discouraged by what they see. I just can't encourage this "system" (if that's not crystal by now).

And as for recycling, aluminium is about as efficient as it gets, glass is readily recycled because both are cheaper to recycle than produce; plastic has a very low consumer recycling rate in the US and is a low-profit recyclable. (and synek advertises single use bags [that you can re-use but shouldn't!])