Mashing Out

Yes, I just did my first all grain brew this past weekend with the two cooler set up. Used Beersmith to calculate the temps and volume needed for infusion and sparge.

 

You can either sparge with hotter water (after draining the first runnings) in order to reach a temperature close to 170F, or you can add hotter water to the tun before draining the first running (i.e. do a 'no sparge'). In either case, you're adding water of a different temperature to approach 170F.

In the first case, only the wort left in the grains after the first runnings has been mashed out, and the enzymes in first runnings will continue to break down dextrins/complex sugars into complex sugars/simple sugars until you get them sufficiently heated in the kettle.

In the second case, you have denatured most/all of the enzymes with the mashout addition, so the conversion stops quickly.

There are several calculators to figure out the exact temperature of the water you'll need to do a mashout. BrewCipher covers both scenarios above, and the calculation is integrated with everything else regarding your brewhouse and recipe.

 

More advanced technique, pull some of the mash and do a decoction. Save that one for later when you have the basics down.

 

You can just pull the thin part (mostly liquid) and boil. If you get some grains don't let them scorch, so stir it to prevent that.

 

I use a cooler for my MLT and regularly mash out. My ten gallon cooler can do two temperature steps and a mash out (five gallon batches). The mash out step mimics the first step in batch sparging, but I finish up with fly sparging. You really want to run your numbers for all of this through Brewcipher (or Brewers Friend or Beersmith) before you buy your new equipment. Use the highest amount of grain you'll ever use and see what is required for a single or double step mash/mashout. Check out green bay rackers calculator to compute capacity needed.

Under the "what it's worth" dept: I never liked using a cooler for a HLT. What I found much better was pressing my old extract boil kettle (6 gallons) into service as a HLT. If you are doing a mash out followed by a fly sparge (common steps) you will need two sources of hot water (obviously) but they will be at different temps. Here's where your brew kettle and ideally a secondary boil kettle (HLT) are useful. Typically these steps are only ten minutes apart so you'll have both going at the same time. This may be hard to picture, but you'll get the idea as you progress.

Oh yeah, converting a cooler to a mash tun is an easy DIY project, lots of sources for everything you need. You're gonna like all grain . . .

 

This is just the opposite of the advice I received on decoction. I've started a decoction thread to avoid being charged with a thread-jacking offense . . . would appreciate your input.

 

I don't bother to do a mashout step, never really seen the reason for it on the homebrew scale. With batch sparging, it only takes me maybe 10 minutes to get my first runnings into the kettle. You can begin heating them right away which would denature the enzymes in the kettle. A 5-10 minute rest after adding sparge water to let the grain bed set, and another 10 minutes to run that off to the kettle. So, even if I don't mash out, with the kettle runnings heating to 170+ and the sparge going into that, a 60 minute mash is maybe a 75 minute rest before denaturing? I've never tested it. When you are in a brewery and sparging for a good 90+ minutes to get your full volume and good extraction, I can understand the need for using a mashout.

EDIT: I also mash for 10 hours so there is really no good reason to worry about that 30 minutes for me as 630 minutes at X temp compared to 600 minutes really isn't an issue at all. But even when I did 1 hour mashes, I still didn't worry about it.

 

Read about decoctions. For lower temp steps you pull the thick part so as to not denature the enzymes. For the last step to mash out you pull the thin part as sacharifacation has completed.

 

Yes, that makes sense . . . as a substitute for a mash out. I had target-fixation on the first saccharification rest step.

 

I usually just fly sparge with 168F water and run out into the kettle where I am heating the wort to lower the lag to boil.

 

That's what I do, for 5 Gallon batch I heat some of the thick mash in 1 Gallon stock pot. Start boiling 5 minute before the end of the mash and add it before sparging.

 

The main reason to decoct the last step is on a big beer with a maxed out mash tun, no room for a final infusion of hot water.

 

Easiest way to do this is boil a few qts of your brewing water to boil on stove top and mix in and let rest 10 mins. In 'How to Brew' there is an equation for this.

Sparging I recommend either batch sparging, or if your doing continuous sparge my sparge water I aim for 168 F & pH 5.8 to decrease tannin extraction from grain.

 

There's an awful lot of 'measuring with a micrometer' mind-set in this thread when in fact it makes v.e.r.y little difference whether you mash-out or not.

Your sparge water temperature should be hot enough to raise the grain bed's temperature into the upper 160s.
If you're under by a few degrees...RDWHAHB.

Do yourself a favor and dont' get sucked into the OCB so often on display 'round here.
Home brewing isn't rocket science nor should it be.

 

It depends what your goal is. If you want to make beer to make beer then the details and increments of brewing theory aren't necessary. But if you aim to make a better product than anyone around, you bet your ass you want to know any and everything about every step in the brewing process.

 

I skip a mash out most times because once it's draining from my mash tun, I've got the heat on the kettle and I'm heating it up right away.

I can't recall having issues with beers and gravities ending up outside of the realm of where I anticipated them to be. For the time being, I'm using 10g coolers to mash in, so no worries, it can be done.

 

For a typical 5 gal batch. I pour the first half of my sparge water in boiling hot. I get the grainbed to about 168-171F that way. The other half is poured in (after lauter) at about 170F. It works fine.

 

No, it's not. It's brewing science. And it's science that you should pay attention to if you want to have the most control over the result. I have to ask though... If you don't care about the details, why come to this forum?

Really? If someone wants to mash out at 168F, they are just wasting their time by taking the 10 seconds to make sure that's the temperature they will hit? If you don't want them to do (or have a calculator do) the calculation, how would you suggest they hit "the upper 160's?"

ETA: Forgot to mention...why do you think mashing out makes very little difference? Would you say the same thing about mash temperature? Or about mash length? e.g. would you say a 75 minute mash doesn't make a different wort than a 60 minute mash?