De Garde in LA?

Discussion in 'Pacific' started by Dansac, Dec 13, 2014.

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  1. BeerMoto

    BeerMoto Initiate (0) Jul 26, 2014 California
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    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_burn_centers_in_the_United_States
     
    #81 BeerMoto, Dec 18, 2014
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  2. BeerMoto

    BeerMoto Initiate (0) Jul 26, 2014 California
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    The concept of Economies of Scale would like to have a talk with you. :wink:
     
    #82 BeerMoto, Dec 18, 2014
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  3. Dansac

    Dansac Pundit (912) Dec 6, 2014 California
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    I was reporting prices from LA, so unless you know where I was shopping I think you're not entitled to correct me about pricing.

    Sour in the Rye may be highly rated. I think it is gross. We can get into the specifics of the beer itself if you like, but that's a bit off topic. I also think Great Divide IPAs are terrible. I also think Firestone Walker Union/Double Jack are meh. I think Sculpin is insanely overpriced and really lame. I think Dogfish stuff is mostly mediocre...

    What's my point? I have a take of my own on the beers I try. I report on the basis of what I think. I went ahead and specified it was in my opinion. That means, I don't necessarily agree with ratings, or with the majority opinion. Everyone in the world but me could say SitR is top notch and I would still find it defective. So what? People here rate beers as they see them. I do the same. To ridicule me or accuse me of trolling because I happen to think a highly rated beer is mediocre is a silly variant of peer pressuring. Yes, I think $20.00 for SitR, considering other wild ale / sour offerings of similar or superior quality abound, is just excessive. I said that, and I stand by it. So what?

    I mistyped barrelworks. I've been to the SB site. I had Bretta Rose and feral Vinifera also. I didn't want to type everthing I had. They were all great. I granted FW is top tier. I think De Garde's stuff is better in the sour turf.

    Anyway, I'm leaving the forum. Not a pleasant experience.
     
    #83 Dansac, Dec 18, 2014
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  4. DCLAguy11

    DCLAguy11 Initiate (0) Feb 28, 2014 California

    I wasn't arguing that there is no difference, but more that it's not as simple as DG sells it for so cheap therefor Cascade is a complete rip off.
    Sure, have it call me and then I'll ask for their business plan and what their statement of purpose is. Is it to be a small local brewery with very limited availability or a much larger operation looking to make a nice profit for a quality product that gets distributed out of state?

    In the end that's not what DG wants to do (obviously stated previously by them) and Cascade's sales in CA are probably suffering a bit because they are priced too high.
     
    #84 DCLAguy11, Dec 18, 2014
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  5. HopHead84

    HopHead84 Grand Pooh-Bah (3,268) Nov 29, 2006 California
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Please, get into the specifics. As descriptive as you've already been, could you expand on "gross"?
     
    #85 HopHead84, Dec 18, 2014
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  6. TheeWalrusHunter

    TheeWalrusHunter Initiate (0) Aug 23, 2013 Oregon

    You should move to a different state so you can participate in a different regional forum. Some of these guys are a bit rough, and quite frankly, assholes. That being said, you kind of stepped into it by bashing the Bruery. You should have been more aware of your environment and see the multiple posts about people circle jerking to get into the Bruery's Hoarder society - a fine pissing contest if you ask me.

    Sorry to say it, but you won't be missed. No one here cares about your free-thinking, "dont give a shit about the ratings," "I have a different opinion than you" bull shit. People here want to rub and be rubbed... if you catch my drift.

    So I hope you find what you are looking for, whether it be a moderately priced sub 8% sour or another hyped up brewery whose beer you want shove your mouth hole over.
     
    #86 TheeWalrusHunter, Dec 18, 2014
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  7. anteater

    anteater Pooh-Bah (1,936) Sep 10, 2012 Oregon
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Wow, I thought Beaucoup was good but kind of 'middle of the road' for de Garde. Get your hands on some Bu Stone!
     
    #87 anteater, Dec 18, 2014
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  8. StGabe

    StGabe Initiate (0) Jul 31, 2009 California

    Look at you guys thinking your opinions are so precious.

    Bottom line is that the subjective statement "I think beer X is gross" is not a justification for the objective statement "beer X is overpriced". This could be a car forum and if someone said "car X looks stupid" and then used that as justification to say "car X is overpriced" then no one would take them seriously. It has nothing to do with how many people are fanboys of the Bruery (and it's far more fashionable to bash the Bruery on here these days).
     
    #88 StGabe, Dec 18, 2014
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  9. ac24

    ac24 Zealot (696) Nov 17, 2014 California
    Trader

    i want to be rubbed.
     
    #89 ac24, Dec 18, 2014
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  10. DCLAguy11

    DCLAguy11 Initiate (0) Feb 28, 2014 California

    no love for the tug
     
    #90 DCLAguy11, Dec 18, 2014
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  11. Zhiguli

    Zhiguli Initiate (0) Jul 12, 2012 California

    Favorite beer of the year for me.
     
    #91 Zhiguli, Dec 18, 2014
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  12. ac24

    ac24 Zealot (696) Nov 17, 2014 California
    Trader

    Better tone down that free thinking you have going on! We don't like free thinkers in the pacific forum. You only like Bruery beers and your only goal is to become a Hoarders member, got it?!?
     
    #92 ac24, Dec 18, 2014
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  13. Dansac

    Dansac Pundit (912) Dec 6, 2014 California
    Trader

    Well this is one fine bipolar pendulum oscillating between good sense and douchebaggery.
     
    #93 Dansac, Dec 18, 2014
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2014
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  14. Dansac

    Dansac Pundit (912) Dec 6, 2014 California
    Trader

    I agree in that calling something gross is not sufficient. I was not trying to justify my claim. But since I have been prompted to, I will.

    I had the 2013 and 2014 bottles. I will limit myself to commenting on the latter, since this is way off topic anyhow. There was a very prominent vinegar quality in the nose, some apple and caramel, and obvious brett funkiness. I don't need to describe its looks. In the pallate, it's very tart, a bit acetone and vinous, with very distinct cherry notes. Texture is slightly grainy, carbonation is medium-soft. It is backed by a heavy malt, and sourdough which brings some prominent sweetness in and heaviness. It's a fairly heavy sour beer, but the oak makes it quite astringent, and its just too sour forward. Abrasive.

    It's just not a balanced beer and tries to do too many things at once.

    Ps - I have similar recurring problems with the sours from the Bruery. I do love their big beers though. I had Mash yesterday, and enjoyed it quite a bit! White Chocolate and Black Tuesday are some of my favorite bourbon barrel aged beers around too. But their sour stuff is a bit too intense. The exception is Tart of Darkness, which I think is really great.
     
    #94 Dansac, Dec 18, 2014
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  15. DCLAguy11

    DCLAguy11 Initiate (0) Feb 28, 2014 California

    TLDR
     
    #95 DCLAguy11, Dec 18, 2014
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  16. SpecialAgentDaleCooper

    SpecialAgentDaleCooper Initiate (0) Aug 27, 2013 California

    This made me laugh
     
    #96 SpecialAgentDaleCooper, Dec 19, 2014
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  17. StGabe

    StGabe Initiate (0) Jul 31, 2009 California

    All fair and good for you (it sounds to me like you just have a different taste for sours, many of the words you use are positives for me and the "vinegar" flavor you mention is only something I've gotten off of rather old bottles of SITR).

    Now let's turn the tables. You seem to be a big SARA fan and yet I've been rather disappointed with them. Example: West Ashley. I've had it twice and, despite being very excited to have it, both times I've been very disappointed. I got very little fruit flavor, a modest amount of funk/tart, not a lot of complexity and some off-flavors that turned me off. I've seen that validated with a couple blind taste tests where West Ashley came in at the bottom of the heap against other apricot sours. Filmishmish, Cascade Apricot, Recoulte du Bois Apricot, Valley of the Heart's Delight and De Garde Apricot Bu are all way better IMO.

    But that's just me. People seem to like the beer so maybe there's something I'm missing. I also don't think West Ashley is overpriced just because IMO it's a boring, overrated beer (to be fair, I don't even know what they charge for it). I'm also willing to admit that I haven't haven't had a lot of other SARA stuff and there might well be stuff that I do like from them.

    It didn't help that you compared SITR to a bunch of solidly mediocre beers (both by my personal judgement and the judgement of BA reviews) and then another beer which is more expensive per ounce.
     
    #97 StGabe, Dec 19, 2014
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2014
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  18. StGabe

    StGabe Initiate (0) Jul 31, 2009 California

    I also feel the need to reply to this.

    Wittgenstein has a body of work far exceeding the stuff he published in his lifetime and much of our understanding of his work is derived from the unpublished stuff (he radically changed his views over his career). From Wikipedia: "Wittgenstein left a voluminous archive of unpublished papers, including 83 manuscripts, 46 typescripts and 11 dictations, amounting to an estimated 20,000 pages". He spent over a decade doing good work and running circles around the likes of Bertrand Russell (who is otherwise one of the more prodigious and influential philosophers of the century). On top of that we've had 70 years to appreciate his work and the fact that it still holds up to and challenges work being done today.

    TLDR: a terrible analogy.
     
    #98 StGabe, Dec 19, 2014
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  19. Dansac

    Dansac Pundit (912) Dec 6, 2014 California
    Trader

    Aye, true it is. So not a very good analogy indeed, although to be fair had he only published the Tractatus and the Investigations he would have been likely as consequential.
     
    #99 Dansac, Dec 19, 2014
  20. Dansac

    Dansac Pundit (912) Dec 6, 2014 California
    Trader

    I think West Ashley is not one of their strongest beers, so I'll grant you that it's not exceptional in that regard. Not everything they make is gold: Little Quibble is also pretty meh, I think. But they have made a hefty amount of top tier stuff too. You also pair WA with a whole roster of breweries that I think are top tier. So I wouldn't be surprised to see it coming at the bottom in a few tests.

    About the comparisons I made to 'a bunch of solidly mediocre beers', I'd like to know which ones you think these are. I'll grant Birthday Suit, Gypsy, and Daliesque are hardly world class. I think Daliesque is better than SitR, but the other two are notably meh as well. But they are also pretty decently priced, at least in relation to SitR. As per a more pricey beer, I suppose you are referring to Supplication? I think the latter is miles ahead of SitR, and it's not too far off from the price. I was asked to include beers that were similarly priced, not necessarily cheaper. So I think it's a warranted inclusion.

    I don't think Love Buzz or the Boon are mediocre beers by any stretch. I could have easily included a bunch of Lambics and Gueuze's (De Ranke comes to mind...), but they might be thought as exceptions. But it makes a point. The Bruery's Rueuze also goes for 20 odd bucks, and it's a few notches below even the regular Boon, which goes for 11.99 in some stores.

    So, yeah.

    By the way, thanks for your civil disagreement. I have no problem with debating or being told I'm wrong, but some people here were straight up hostile. You have made very good points in a civil manner.
     
    #100 Dansac, Dec 19, 2014
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