Gose vs Wild Ale

My understanding is that a Gose does not have to have Brett or be funky/wild. On the other hand a wild ale has to have noticeable Brett funk, but not necessarily any sourness.

 

I've tried many times it like Westbrook Gose, but I just don't. It tastes like lemonade with seawater in it.. Super sour and salty, can't imagine I'd drink a whole can, more like a sip or two and I'm done.

 

Level of sourness has nothing to do with what makes one a wild ale. A gose can be wild but any attempt to be traditional with the style won't be.

 

The gose I've tasted have never really hada brett funk and I dont think they were brewed with brett

 

The sourness in gose comes from kettle souring, which is done by lactobacillus. The lacto is killed by a short boil or sometimes just heating above 170 degress for a while without actually boiling. Not all gose has Brett, and traditionally most didn't intentionally have it but probably picked it up from barrels. Brett can add a light acidity to beer in the right conditions but it won't sour beer, it's more well known for the funk. A wild ale has acidity from a combination of lacto, pediococcus, and brett with other native wild yeast and bacteria, but the majority is from lacto.

 

Science disagrees with this. Brett is funky and doesn't really have any sour qualities, just fruitiness and what could be perceived as tartness.

Lactobaccillus is actually the sour bacteria and causes that yogurty lemony flavor so prominent in American Wild Ales. Pediococcus is another that creates intense sourness in a similar vein. Lastly, acetobacter creates vinegary sourness.

Goses are generally kettle-soured with bacteria (usually lacto) rather than spontaneously fermented and as such can vary wildly in tartness/sourness based on the brewer's wishes. They usually do not/did not have Brett. What sets them apart from AWAs is the salt and coriander.

 

Try it with some fruit jam/preserves or fruit/berry syrup. Damn you lactic acid!!!

 

@Urk1127 this is your Answer!

 

I don't know but I do like Jester King....

 

I would consider gose a part of the "wild ale" family (as currently commonly understood) as it has an acidic flavor, but it is one of the traditional sour wheat beers of Central Europe, which is really its own stylistic family altogether. And it's a specific version of that family that has saline and coriander character as it's defining attributes.

But ya, "wild ale" isn't really a style but a description for beers that display Brettanomyces or acidic character and in that respect its kind of a wide open mess of different styles that can be very disparate. And there's really nothing "wild" about most of them anyway so it's somewhat of a misnomer.

 

Also, gose wouldn't have traditionally been kettle soured as that's a new technique that wasn't used when gose was actually a popular beer style, but if you are just going for lactobacillus acidity, it really doesn't matter a whole lot if it's a regular fermentation or a kettle-souring.

 

Yeah just to reiterate Brett does not produce sourness. Lactobacillus and Pediococcus produce sourness. And most Gose's only get their sourness from lacto. On the other hand; many gose's could be called wild ales- the ones that have live Brett and bacteria in them, but most gose's are only kettle soured and then pasteurized of their bacteria like many have said. Once pasteurized, the sourness remains in the beer but the bacteria is all killed.

Kettle soured beers are great for producing a fast sour beer that doesn't infect your brewing equipment, but the downsides are limited funk, and a less stable packaged beer. (Real wild ales will prevent oxygenation and develop more in the package because of their living organisms)

Traditionally, back when Gose first became a style, they were likely all wild ales
Containing Brett and bacteria in the finished product. The style seems to have changed to accommodate modern brewing practices.

 

It's funny as to me, the term "wild" ale has always implied beers that are somehow spontaneously imbued with yeast like Brett or bugs like lacto and pedio. In other words, some kind of spontaneous fermentation with a coolship or barrels that might have the bugs already in them.

But any more, the term has come to mean any beer that contains brett, lacto or pedio, even though there are many brewers now who carefully inoculate their beer with the desired bugs rather than letting them run "wild".

Wild ales aren't necessarily sour since, as noted, Brett beers are often considered "wild" in spite of not really being sour. It's more of a catchall term. Similar to strong ale (but not quite the same, obviously).

 

Kettle souring may have not been invented back then but mash souring was, which is very similar to kettle souring. In fact it's what kettle souring was inspired by.

 

You might enjoy the Sixpoint gose http://www.beeradvocate.com/beer/profile/10607/169237/

It wasn't my favorite but a mildly sour example with a lot of the traditional gose characteristics. I much prefer the overly lactic "Americanized" gose like the Westbrook. Gose Gone Wild may have been my favorite beer of 2014.

Maybe go for an actual German version, though few are commercially available. Here's one that I haven't had in a long time but remember as an early eye opener to the style http://www.beeradvocate.com/beer/profile/4909/10683/

 

Well they weren't mash souring either, and I've actually never seen mash souring in any texts on historical beer styles for that matter.

 

you should see if you can get some Lost Nation Gose, so much milder in its sourness but still with a little tartness. Its night and day from Westbrook and it was the first gose I really liked I also found victory's kirsch gose pretty palatable with a dialed down sourness. I also like the sour ones but I see where you are coming from.

 

I've always known Gose to be salty. You don't really get that in Wilds.