California Beers and Freshness

Grossman's book is only a few years old and was written long after SN had coast to coast distribution. The quote, to me at least, does not read as if Ken is only discussing SN's own local Chico-area self-distribution ("...more than a few hours...").

Perhaps @sierranevadabill could elaborate?

 

I don't pretend to claim I know the range of Mr. Grossman's comments, I take his words at face value. I am though a first person witness to how things are done locally.

Current information direct from Sierra would be most welcome.

 

I've had dfh 90 min. that was about 4-5 months old and it tasted fresh but i think it was stored in the fridge. Pineapple Sculpin, actually all Sculpin doesn't hold up well over time... Stored at room temp. they go down hill fast. I've notice that lighter bodied, lighter colored ipas like Azacca or Luponic Distortion fade faster than heavier or darker colored ipas. Union Jack, Space Dust, Dfh 90 are not light in body or color and they seem to hold up just a little longer. They are also all above 7.5% abv. Not sure if that makes any difference, but Session ipas dont hold up over time at all.

 

Thanks both.

Those reefer trucks I sometimes see on the highways and figured they were long hauling something temperature sensitive. But for local deliveries from the distributor to the retailer...? Noap. Usually just standard trucks packed with cases of beer. Which is pretty consistent with Grossman's comment about transport. Long haul, refrigerate.

As for the beer sitting around in a warm place before it gets to the retailer I guess it's been too long since I had to cope with that. In PA there are two types of distributorships, the importing and/or wholesale distributor that gets the shipment from the brewery, and the retail distributor who buys from the wholesale distributor. The retailers then resell to the general publicm, but until very recently it had to be a whole case as packed by the brewery. (Recently they've been allowed to sell 12 packs from the brewery which does increase the price per beer. )

For years most of my beer was purchased either from a bar with fresh kegs or by the case. In many of the retail distributorships the beer can sit around for months and there is neither heating nor air-conditioning--a warehouse in itself. So my habit is to not worry much about storage and to buy only dated beer that is fresh or is a seasonal known to be fresh. My favorite retailer is committed to getting me "fresh beer only" when I order a case sometimes he won't order me the case I want because he can't get it fresh himself. So in the summer, I tend to favor local beers but if they are not fresh, no buy. That long standing habit carries over to the very few bottle shops in the area, no date, no buy unless I know it is a fresh new release of seasonal and so close to its bottling date. The three places I shop all have cold cases and in one cold case each has a special section for "new beers." I seldom look at any other cold case except to buy something with a long shelf life. Again no date, no buy. Beer too old, no buy.

So effectively the beers I buy are close to the date of being bottled\canned, e.g., my most recent case of DFH 90 min was in my house 5 days after the bottling date. This all contributes to minimizing the effects of poor handling.

 

I second/third the handling issue being as or more important than age. Stone actually has it figured out: their Enjoy By beers are all that sees my local store shelves in under a month since the distributor is motivated to push this out. However the freshest Firestone Walker I see is around a month and a half to 2 months.

That said, if I choose a store that keeps the west coast bottles/cans refrigerated, there is not a huge drop off in quality from months 1-6. Also I make sure to choose the canned option when available, as some of the fridges have insanely bright light which can't be good for the beer.

 

I am on a freshness crusade right now. As we speak I am at war with the stores and the distributors in my area, mainly Crest, its Green Flash's Distro and it is a horribly run business who is trying to monopolize craft beer distribution in San Diego. I'm making a lot of noise and holding them accountable and they hate me for it. All I'm really doing is pointing out the fact that we live 5 miles from the brewery so we shouldn't be drinking 5 month old Alpine in San Diego. I'm getting alot backlash and getting treated badly all the way up from store employees who argue with me in front of other customers to store managers who tell me i don't know what i'm talking about. I spoke to the District manager of the stores where i shop and I pointed out the overall carelessness that is going on at every level and he is understanding what i'm saying. He acts like he actually cares and takes pride in the product that they put on the shelf. He is going to compensate me quite nicely for the old Hoppy birthday that i bought and he said he will take out all of the Alpine beer that is nearing the best by date and get a fresh supply... I told him about how they're not properly training their employees to check dates at the time of receiving and Crest Distro knows this, so they are easily slipping in their older beer. He said he will address the issues.
I don't know why I'm getting so much backlash and being treated like i'm the enemy when i'm really helping them. But I finally got to speak to the right guy and i think he wants to fix this problem. Standing up for freshness is not easy but its actually working. And i'm not gonna stop. The free beer and gift cards might shut me up for right now, but i'm going to be all over them for the rest of their lives... Checking dates. I jus thought i should tell somebody in case i end up mysteriously dead or something, it was most likely Green Flash, Crest distributor, or bevmo who had something to do with it...

 

Thread hijack. Sorry / Not Sorry

Well, there has been a lot of chatter about absolutes in the handling of beer by distribs, so I guess that's my cue to step in with the contrarian point of view. Brewers absolutely have control over how their beer is shipped, stored, and ultimately delivered. All distribs have contracts with their brewers which set forth such handling standards, but not all brewers take advantage of the leverage afforded by this option.

Warning: The following information regards the business practices on a Macro scale. While you may not like the majority brewer in play...the same high standards also benefit the 22 craft brewers we distribute as well.

I know it's hot in the South, but I'd hazard a guess that it's just a warm in Southern California and Phoenix, the two markets with which I'm most familiar.

The picture below is a portion of our 500,000 sq. ft. warehouse in SoCal. The temperature set points are 46°F in the winter and up to 60° F in the summer.. The not-so-funny misconception is that, while beer stored colder is better, packaging that is too cold will 'sweat' on the delivery trucks and can cause cardboard packaging to fail (especially with cans). A well thought out temperature range is helpful in combating that.




Here is a shot of our keg box. I'm fairly certain it's refrigeration is more than adequate. This is one of eight different monitoring stations in the cold box.






If you really want to geek out on AB Warehouse temp control, this is a fascinating read. ↓↓

By the way, the standards reported in this article also apply to all of the ABI wholesalers nationwide.

Link: https://trend-americas.com/en-US/projects/Industrial/Case Studies/MK-TR-ANHEUSER.pdf


Most craft brewers could not have expanded across the US without piggy-backing on the distribution network built by the big guys...and not only are the goods being delivered, they're being done so with nothing but quality in mind.

 

Have never had a Stone beer that I'd consider "past its prime". That's partly due to the quality of the beer and also the commitment the company has made to keeping their beer fresh on the shelves. I've had 4 month old Stone IPA and it's still fantastic.

Sierra Nevada is the same thing.

But I personally think "freshness" is in the eyes, or tastebuds. of the beholder.

 

If distributors are delivering beer that is not close to the bottling date then it doesn't really matter to me how cold they've kept it. If its already 2-3 months old by the time it even gets to the store, then its still not fresh.

 

No brewer has a get-out-of-jail-free card when it comes to hoppy beers fading.

However, those large breweries in California have great QC standards, and might be a smidge ahead of some others in terms of packaging and ridding oxygen from the bottles.

Also, those breweries are using "old school" brewing methods, and actually putting most of their hops into the boil, rather than just dry hopping everything to high hell. I'm not sure exactly what that means in terms of hop flavor degradation as either way oils and compounds are released into the beer and act as antioxidants.

 

Concur.

Then again...not only do we not deliver expired product, we pick up and exchange all out of code beer in the trade.

 

Did you just pat yourself on the back for not delivering expired products? OK thank you for not delivering expired products.. but do you really think theres a difference between a 5 1/2 month old beer and a 6 month old expired beer? Not expired isn't the same thing as fresh...

 

Um...I'm not sure where you are going with this...but I don't work for Crest. The bulk of our packaged product has a 110 day shelf life and draught beer is 45 days, so I guaran-freaking-tee that we don't deliver beer that's 5½ months old.

#imnotthedroidyouarelookingfor

 

They just got a new shipment of Alpine Hoppy birthday in this week at bevmo and it expires on June 10th... Theres nothing anybody can say to me to justify that... The brewery is 5 miles away... This is going to stop..atleast where I shop at it is...

 

Again...We don't distribute Alpine and, for that matter we don't deliver to San Diego.

#pleasebackoffimreallynotyourguy

 

I gotcha man... you're cool i'm not directing anything towards you...and i should probably stop thinking that all distributor are bad but its just alot of bs that i'm dealing with, all just because i like fresh beer.

 

Some wholesalers are little more than logistics companies...others support world-class beer with world-class service.

/hijack

#letsgogetsomeexponentialhoppinessatobriens

 

Same problem here with Oskar Blues stuff. It's brewed in NC and it's nowhere on tap I've ever seen , it's 6-8 months old on the shelf - quite common. Why is this? It's not OBs fault I'm sure, it's the third wheel that buggers it up; Shitty poorly run distributors who could care less except push out beer. It's not the retailers fault if they order a beer abnd the distributor delivers 4 month old stock, but it is the job of the retailer to know this and tell them to take it back and refuse the shipment.

 

Firstly, let me thank you for fighting the good fight!

You stated: "I don't know why I'm getting so much backlash and being treated like i'm the enemy when i'm really helping them." The only response I can think of is that the business(es) prefer the status quo. Managing 'old' product takes effort and I suspect that the business(es) prefer to not do what it takes to ensure that fresh(er) product is being sold.

I hope that you continue with your efforts here. It is only by consumers like yourself who politely but insistently let their demands be known concerning only wanting to purchase fresh(er) product that change will take place.

Cheers to you!

@RobH

 

When Ive see local beer aged out , I've sent the brewery emails . They're always responsive, they don't want crappy beer out there ruining their reputation. It's why Old Mecklenburg pulled back on expansion, nc law dictates when you exceed a certain barrel amount YOU MUST HAVE A THIRD PARTY DISTRIBUTOR . OMB said no thanks we'll do it ourselves and we won't expand, we'll pull back distro to Charlotte. OMB and Red Oak want their stuff be kept cold or they won't deliver you their beer, more should do this.