Bad Trader - mendvicdog

I think the proof lies in the pudding on this one, would love to see the beer mails, that would make it very clear to all of us where the fault is here.

 

I was just about to zoom into the same phrase @NiceBeerCans addressed as well so I won't emphasize the communication point, but...

It seems to me that he did not want the IP option, added to the fact that the first friend couldn't help you (and not sure if you clearly communicated to him that you are trying to find other friends who can), it really should be his preference on how the replacements could be done, not yours. UPS shipping should have been used right away at this point. Was that option suggested? It's pretty much common knowledge that you shouldn't ship FedEx to VT. I do think that he could've been better in emphasizing his preference without threatening negative feedback, though. He also said that he gave you the option of just pay money for the cost of the beer + his shipping cost. This route would've been a no-brainer for me, though that depends on your financial situation.

 

I really don't understand. The OP stated he would accept a c & s for $$ he was out and that would be the end of it. If @mendvicdog is worried about shipping again, is waiting on friends to hand deliver when he doesn't know when they can do that, can't get the original beers agreed on, and both parties can't seem to agree on fair replacements, isn't writing a check the best and easiest solution to this problem?

 

Yes, I think it's reasonable to wait a few weeks. If I was on the other end, yes I would definitely wait to ensure safety of beer. Assuming - the OP didn't need the beers for a special event? And communication is satisfactory.

I'm sure you would also compensate him for an extra beer or two for waiting longer.

Anyways, I hope it works out overall!

 

Just to clear some things up.

I said my communication could have been better. Not that I think it was insufficient.

I didn't see the message about just paying him for the beer before he left bad feedback. If I had seen that message, I certainly would have discussed it further with him. In my discussions with him currently I offered to pay for the beer or get him the bottles via hand off or delivery. He said he preferred the bottles, which I understand.

My plan was to ship UPS if I couldn't deliver them to him. We had discussed this.

 

While I don't think publicly posting the PM's is necessary can we get confirmation from the mod team @F2brewers @blue-dream @dmbforever that what @mendvicdog is saying is true about his communication

 

A private citizen cannot ship beer across state lines without a license. That is where the murky waters come into play and by that stance they shouldn't be sending it back to the customer if it is again crossing state lines. Within state that is a different manner, but again unless you're licensed and DECLARE that you're shipping alcohol you're violating their policies.

 

Someone had their box "Transferred to Governement Warehouse" after it was discovered: http://www.beeradvocate.com/community/threads/scanned-fedex-box-anybody-ever.99797/ . I believe there is a procedure for the content to be destroyed if it's regulated goods. FedEx doesn't confiscate per se, but they probably send it to "the government" to handle.

That said, I had one returned to me by FedEx in VT after it was shown "On Vehicle for Delivery". The trader told me that he had no problem receiving boxes from FedEx. I'm not sure when and who at FedEx decides which box gets "destroyed" and which gets returned to sender.

 

You have a citation for this?

My understanding is alcohol shipping laws are up to individual states, and those laws differ significantly from state to state. Whether or not the alcohol is being sold (to you or by you) usually also comes into play.

 

I don't feel like @mendvicdog deserves a bad trader tag from what I've seen so far. I would certainly be taken aback if I had an entire shipment confiscated, and it might take me some time to get a replacement together. Furthermore, I'd probably want to do an IP option to avoid this happening again.

 

A few more comments on this.

The two concerned parties are discussing ways to resolve this which is, ultimately, what we all want.

I've seen the BM conversation as provided by @nolinenowait and everything he said appears to be supported by that conversation. @mendvicdog...not so much. If there are other conversations I haven't seen, please let me know. I suspect there may are and that what I've seen is the start of a "new" conversation. My comments are based on what I've seen.

@mendvicdog your concern about leaving bad feedback less than a month after shipping may be justified in some instances...provided there is adequate communication. You gave positive feedback to the OP on April 6th. I'm not sure exactly when the box arrived or when your box was shipped and/or confiscated.

In the convo, your communication is sparse (as you admitted). Your first mention of a friend potentially visiting came on the 22nd. Was there other communication between the day your box was lost and then? If so, please provide it.

@nolinenowait was open about the terms for replacement beers and asked what worked best for you the same day. That doesn't match up with your claims that the beers he requested were above "what you thought was fair".

You responded on the 25th that you were still trying to figure out whether you could honor the original terms of the trade and indicated that your friend could be in town the 29th. You already knew that the OP would be out of the country (Montreal) that weekend, but OP told you (also on the 25th) that he would be around that morning and said he would be available to meet...Friday was the 29th. He also requested updates on the 26th, 27th and 28th. He also requested (on the 27th) that you send one of his options by UPS if the meet up didn't work out.

You responded on the 28th that your friend had jury duty and couldn't make the trip on the 29th, but might be available the next week and asked if OP would be around. He repeated the ship request, but not in a nasty way nor was there any mention of negative feedback.

On May 1st, he asked again if your friend would be up that week and then asked again on the 2nd and 3rd, offering an alternative shipping address as well or the option to just pay for the beers he sent/shipping cost. He notified you that if you didn't respond by the 4th, he would leave negative feedback.

Above you claim you were intimidated by his "constant" threats, but there is only one mention of actually leaving feedback. A prior mention said he *DID NOT WANT TO LEAVE NEGATIVE FEEDBACK*. That's not intimidating and doesn't jive with what you said.

After April 28th, there's no response from you at all. OP left negative feedback on May 5th in keeping with what he said he would do.

This morning (in this thread) you said your plan was to ship UPS if the friend visiting option didn't work out, but yesterday (same thread) you said you were scared to ship again and have another box confiscated. That doesn't add up. Which was (is?) it?

I don't see any reference to an offer to buy him a beer the next time you were up in Montpelier either.

So, your last response to him was on April 28th. He left bad feedback on May 5th, but you never said anything about it then or let him know that you weren't on in the timeframe he specified and asked him to reconsider. If you thought it was unfair, you could always contact one of us as well. At a minimum, you should have at least said something to him...if you two could work it out, he could always modify his feedback.

From what I've seen, you didn't respond until you were tagged in this thread on May 11th.

I find it hard to see how you still think you were in good standing with the OP after not communicating with him for almost two weeks? You said you were working things out in your mind, but without communicating, how would he know that?

Something's still not making sense here...the bad trader tag stays until we see something more to justify removing it.

 

Thanks @F2brewers this definitely shines a different light on the entire situation. Hope you guys get it figured out, but my support @mendvicdog is waning to say the least as a result of the clarification to the situation. In the end I hope it all is resolved, but I think we've all learned something from this

 

As far as I'm concerned, I'm done giving @mendvicdog the benefit of the doubt. @F2brewers has clarified the whole situation. @mendvicdog, you need to stop posturing and start apologizing to @nolinenowait and to this thread. I think many of us wanted to believe you since you have 61 trades under your belt while the OP has 20. Goes to show that some traders think they are above good trading practices as their total number of trades increase. You need to drop the attitude and start taking responsibility for your multiple misstatements. You haven't gained anything from not speaking the truth. You should make it up to @nolinenowait asap in such a way that he can say something nice about you. And no, your communication was insufficient. Own it and change.

 

I dont believe it shined a different light at all...Its as the OP said, according to the bm F2 brewer read.... I just hope this gets resolved..

 

Perhaps "shines a different light" meant "changes where my support lies"; that post gives those on the fence a good reason to lean toward OP and those already leaning the other way are likely at least now on the fence if not also leaning toward OP.

 

I got a call from FedEx on a box I shipped to FL. I was told it contained alcohol and they would be sending it back. I asked if the guy could pick it up and was told I had several options.

1. They could send it back
2. The person could pick it up at a local place
3. I could send them another label with the "adult signature required" option and they would deliver it. The person even gave me their email address to send the label to. They said they would put the label on the box and send it along

I was told that (at least in FL) it's not against the rules to send beer/whiskey (had two bottles of whiskey in there) but the sender needed to have an adult sign for the box on the receiving end

 

Right, but shipping across state lines is likely a different issue. And, it's against Fedex's rules, right? Fedex as a private company can make a wide variety of rules that have nothing to do with laws. For example, they can also open a package whenever they'd like to inspect its contents. It's just not a cut and dry thing.

 

That's interesting one of my only confiscated boxes happened in Florida I called as soon as I got the exception alert and they told me there was alcohol in it and it was going to be disposed because I had shipped alcohol