Going Legit :D

Discussion in 'Homebrewing' started by ThomasJoseph315, Aug 5, 2016.

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  1. ThomasJoseph315

    ThomasJoseph315 Initiate (0) Jun 6, 2016 Washington

    Where is the best place to have a discussion (category?) and/or resources for going legal. I'm VERY interested in learning the legalities of opening a Tap Room in Washington State! :grinning:
     
  2. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    I know nothing about Washington State's brewing laws.

    This is going to sound negative, but at the risk of bringing you down from your well earned euphoria, you are not remotely ready to go pro after one batch of homebrew. Nobody is. Some (maybe most) of the worst craft beers I have ever tasted were at brewpubs opened by home brewers with limited experience. The market is too crowded for that kind of startup to succeed these days.

    I would recommend getting a lot of experience under your belt, entering a lot of competitions (multiple competitions per beer) to get unbiased feedback, looking for the repeated trends in the comments, and improving your beers until you are killing it with every batch. Don't rely on what friends and acquaintances are telling you. Then, look into what it takes (financially and personally) to open and run a brewery. At that point, if you still love brewing and understand how doing it professionally will be different, go for it.

    All that said, there a some members of this forum who have gone pro or are preparing to, so you'll probably get lots of good advice.
     
  3. ThomasJoseph315

    ThomasJoseph315 Initiate (0) Jun 6, 2016 Washington

    Oh I totally get it, there are many, many factors to consider here, but the conversation needs to start somewhere. I totally agree that winning competitions is a really good idea and that will be my next step. I've actually begun to look around for some in the southwest, if anyone knows any please list them. In the mean time, I need to improve my home set up and process, I know I have a few things to change.
    There are also many personal reasons why I feel this may be a good idea. I have an old high school acquaintance that has successfully started his own microbrewery and is going strong. He actually just broke ground on his first major expansion and is giving advice on where to buy large equipment. Also, my GF has big ties in the California wine industry, her grandparents own a vinyard that sell grapes to some of the largest winery's in Sonoma County, CA. So I am surrounded by various industry individuals, but I am not a wine maker, I drink wine, but my heart is in beer making.
    Very much appreciate the conversation. :grinning:
     
  4. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    I like your confidence. But the next step might be entering competitions. Winning usually comes later.

    Here's the best source of competition dates...
    http://www.bjcp.org/apps/comp_schedule/competition_schedule.php
     
  5. ThomasJoseph315

    ThomasJoseph315 Initiate (0) Jun 6, 2016 Washington

    Confidence? If your glass is half empty, go to the tap and fill it back up! :wink:

    Thanks for the schedule! Much appreciated!
     
  6. ThomasJoseph315

    ThomasJoseph315 Initiate (0) Jun 6, 2016 Washington

    The beer master at the micro brewery I visited yesterday is actually a judge for BJCP. :slight_smile:
     
  7. SD_Transplant

    SD_Transplant Initiate (0) Mar 2, 2016 Colorado

    Commenting to bookmark this. Want to open a brewpub one day so any advice would be appreciated.
     
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  8. PapaGoose03

    PapaGoose03 Grand High Pooh-Bah (6,057) May 30, 2005 Michigan
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah

    What you heard from @Vikeman above is good advice, and it probably will also be mentioned a few times at probrewer.com which is a site that usually gets mentioned during discussions like this. It's never too early to begin thinking about becoming a pro, so reading opinions will lay some foundation for your future planning. I have never looked at the probrewer site to be able to endorse it, I'm merely putting it in front of you as a suggestion that may be of value to you. There have been previous threads on this topic in the past, so do a search to see if you can find them for additional reading.
     
    ThomasJoseph315 likes this.
  9. hopfenunmaltz

    hopfenunmaltz Pooh-Bah (2,635) Jun 8, 2005 Michigan
    Pooh-Bah

    That just means he sat down for the test and passed. :-) Some in the industry are Master level and above, others are Recognized. Be impressed if the brewer was the former and not the later.

    Studying for the BJCP exam makes one a better Brewer, as you learn to recognize flavor defects in beers. Once you can recognize defects in your beers you can then correct them. It also ruins the experience at many places, as you pick out things that are not good brewing practice in the beers.

    If you really want to go pro, get as much hands on training and brewing science study as you can.

    Me? Why ruin a good hobby?
     
  10. NiceFly

    NiceFly Initiate (0) Dec 22, 2011 Tajikistan

    The Brewing Network did a series of podcasts a few years ago with Jamil and others describing the process. Worth a listen..

    And I agree why ruin a good hobby. All the damn beer snobs and such fuck that.
     
  11. pweis909

    pweis909 Grand Pooh-Bah (3,250) Aug 13, 2005 Wisconsin
    Pooh-Bah

    I suggest working for a brewpub or brewery. Get to know the business. Ask the owner about the laws and licenses, business plans, financial considerations and concerns. Simultaneously, keep homebrewing.
     
  12. pweis909

    pweis909 Grand Pooh-Bah (3,250) Aug 13, 2005 Wisconsin
    Pooh-Bah

    Jamil said that for years, before going pro and then doing a bunch of podcasts about going pro.

    I think the appeal of going pro is that you get to clean out bigger fermenters. You get to climb in the manway! Pro Brewer = glorified janitor with a cult-following.
     
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  13. ThomasJoseph315

    ThomasJoseph315 Initiate (0) Jun 6, 2016 Washington

    Yea, I'm totally down with working at a small brewery, in fact I'd rather work at a small place then say Budweiser. I am 100% devoted to craft beer. The main reason I got into this is because I love beer, but I grew really tired of drinking the average commercial crap, I want variety.

    I don't mind cleaning out fermenters as long as they are from ones with good batches. If the Brew "Master" fucks up and makes Penicillin, then I think his punishment should be to clean that particular fermenter, I'll go clean kegs, LOL! But really, I used to work in Garages, I am used to getting my hands dirty, this is just way more fun and washes off a lot easier at the end of the day.

    From a business aspect side of this I really like the idea of being able to acquire small amounts of income from many sources. I have successfully started a few businesses now and sold them as turn key, but this is something I want to go the distance, I have real passion for this. I know Rome wasn't built in a day, but if you pay attention and make moves when/where you need to, good things can happen :slight_smile:


    Totally agree, I've been asking the local beer supplier how to look for specific tastes and how to fix things, so I'm sure as time goes on I I will get more and more familiar with things. I'd really like to know what that Master Brewer thinks, I am going back to the micro brewery again tomorrow so I'll see what is what.

    Oh here is the micro brewery if anyone was curious, great atmosphere and great crew!
    http://www.macleodale.com/
     
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  14. pweis909

    pweis909 Grand Pooh-Bah (3,250) Aug 13, 2005 Wisconsin
    Pooh-Bah

    You might try to volunteer initially, and don't expect more than minimum wage at the start of actual employment. If you were good enough to get a job with AB/InBev, it'd be worth considering. They probably have better pay and employee benefits (maybe you can opt out of the free 6-pack per week and pocket and extra $5 per pay period*). Some well-respected craft brewers worked for big beer companies (Mitch Steele, Dan Carey, to name two off the top of my head). If brewing beer is your ambition, you would probably not be wasting your time at a brewery job with big beer. There might be no better place to learn the fundamentals.

    *PS: I'm making up. I have no idea. I just recall an Anchor interview where they talked about the free beer benefit, and maybe at AB, that benie would not be as valuable to a lover of craft beer.
     
  15. suavo

    suavo Initiate (0) Oct 29, 2014

    Did Jennifer and Alastair make you sign a no compete contract?
     
  16. invertalon

    invertalon Pooh-Bah (2,249) Jan 27, 2009 Ohio
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Currently in the process myself to open a brewery/taproom, at the infancy stage though. Have the funds/investors lined up, my costs/profit projections and the equipment and suppliers all quoted and such, but it's all the other stuff that will take months and months to square away. A location, licenses/permits, legal stuff, business plan, etc... Slowly but surely, though.
     
  17. ThomasJoseph315

    ThomasJoseph315 Initiate (0) Jun 6, 2016 Washington

    I'd love to pick your brain sometime.
     
  18. invertalon

    invertalon Pooh-Bah (2,249) Jan 27, 2009 Ohio
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    I will admit, not much to pick at this time. Just doing a lot of research into all the legality and other non-fun stuff that goes along with it all as I start to write up my business plan.
     
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  19. ThomasJoseph315

    ThomasJoseph315 Initiate (0) Jun 6, 2016 Washington

    This should be a whole sub section on this forum.
     
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  20. teal

    teal Zealot (589) May 3, 2012 Wisconsin

    First post nailed it but I'd also add this. IMO too many craft beers are given a pass because they're craft and not BMC. That isn't going to last forever.

    Enter beers and really go over your feedback. Learn how to change process to achieve desired results. Keep track of your improvements. It's one thing to make up a killer porter, send samples to 7 contests and do well or win a few. It's a whole nother ball of wax to make seven batches of the same porter and get consistent returns from contests on them. Repeatability is everything to being a pro-brewer IMO and it separates the players from the fans. People want to come back to the same beer time and again. Your business can't survive inconsistent beer. There's simply too much good stuff out there to get a lot of second chances.

    GOOD BEER will help the most along with cash and business sense.

    PS - I'd also say that more than likely, in a pro sense, you can't just have one good beer, the portfolio needs to bet good with a couple of stand outs. Not one good one covering for the trash. Brew and do well with styles you do not like.
     
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