Bad Trader: @Kevin-1989

This is the fourth longest running debate on BA.

To me it's neutral feedback. No beer was lost, somebody didn't not replace a broken bottle, or had to be publicly shamed to follow through on a trade. But still, if I was going to set up a trade with this person, I'd want to know that they don't always follow through & drink bottles already promised to someone else.

The only unfortunate thing is that neutral feedback doesn't ding a person's 100% rating, but that just means we should all be scanning all feedback before trading.

 

OK, now I'm curious! What's in your top three longest??

 

Assuming the feedback system thread is up to date, neither is appropriate:

 

Leave neutral. He's a scumbag. While most might not read feedback and only notice 100% I do and don't care about 100% if yo comments flawed.

Read the shit (feedback)

 

Negative. As soon as someone accepts a trade, if they don't actually follow through on their end of the deal and circumstances warrant, negative feedback is fair game.

He drank your beer, had poor communication, this is a negative trade and people need to be aware of people like this.

 

I definitely agree with @jrnyc that *negative* is warranted and IMO should be the appropriate feedback left for the trader.

No disrespect to the peeps that said "nuetral", but an agreement was made and broken. Purely based on *principle* alone, the trader breached the contract and should get what they rightfully deserve, irregardless if any beers were exchanged or not.

Add to the mix, that the agreed upon beer for trade after an agreement was made...was drank....R U KIDDING ME???C'mon.

Communication was sketchy...

No urgency or desire to get a replacement...

Doesn't care that they had an *agreement* through the trade system...

Do I need to go any further???

Also, our trade system is not perfect by all means, but we need to use it to our advantage.

If he leaves nuetral, the trader still has 100% feedback, even if he leaves the appropriate feedback in the commentary. C'mon...I'm embarrassed to say this BA will have the same 100% feedback as myself and many others who strive to do what's right to maintain the integrity of the system and make trading fun.

If he leaves *negative*, with appropriate feedback in the commentary, chances are he won't pull this BS again, and at the very least....clearly warns others, as his feedback won't be 100%.

Just my 2 cents

Cheers!

 

In that case, can we get this thread updated https://www.beeradvocate.com/community/threads/beer-trading-feedback-system-explained.185895/. See my post upthread.

 

Rules need to consider IP trades which as you point out are not accounted for.

 

Well, If I was to follow "our rules" by the letter, this was an IP trade with no beer needing to be shipped in order to leave feedback.

The OP is free to leave whatever feedback he chooses, since our rules have no bearing on IP trades.

 

Negative. The nonchalance & attitude displayed by the bad trader, after brazenly reneging on the trade & drinking the promised beer, is -as the OP noted- shitty. In my world shitty isn't neutral.

Formally accepting a trade request on BA is a serious commitment. Refusing to honor that commitment deserves negative fb which will warn others & help to preserve the integrity of the trade system.

 

@TheTruth you should tag him in this thread. If/when you do @dmbforever can move it to the bad trader forum.

If warned, I suspect that many members would prefer to avoid this guy. Trading has enough unavoidable risks. Out this BA. For those that read here he'll be an avoidable risk.

 

I agree with Java. This seems to be an open-and-shut case of you leaving negative feedback saying something like "Drank the beer he/she agreed to trade with me. When asked to make it right, went radio silent" Simple as that. Pressing that button is extremely important and the more we let crap like this slide, the less useful the feedback system becomes.

 

@TheTruth

Hey there,

To change feedback, simply follow the steps below.

(1) *Click* on your trade *stats*
(2) Go to top of page where your feedback says *sent*
(3) *Click* on sent and look for the trade feedback you left for the trader
(4) At end of feedback is an *edit* button

BM me if you need further assistance,
Cheers!
Dave

 

Amazing how that works, isn't it? His behavior confirms what many suspected all along, not someone most of us would want to trade with.

 

@TheTruth Please BM the traders name. I would like to follow along and make sure he leaves positive feedback for you.

Thank you!

 

Upon seeing a neutral rating, most potential traders, I would think, would be intrigued enough to investigate why it wasn't positive since positives are the norm.

Since the rating system only has three choices, anything other than positive would throw up a red flag. In this case, as others have mentioned, no beer was exchanged. To play Devil's Advocate; with regard to the outcome where this nonchalant, seemingly jerky person is holding the same rating as good traders, would we deem it appropriate to give this fellow the same grade as the KBBS "refoiler" or many, many other asshats that thoroughly screwed their trade partner? To me it seems excessive to lump someone into that crowd despite nobody actually shipping. Maybe there needs to be a fourth rating - call it "difficult and/or misfire through jerkiness"

The OP seems very communicative and persistent to a fault. I'll have to admit, after getting the "we drank it" message, I would have washed my hands of this trade and looked elsewhere. My thoughts would be that no good could come from pursuing further.

 

Respectfully disagree with these points. First off, yes, when I'm about to start a trade with a new person I read through all their feedback to see if there are neutral ratings. But not all traders do this and the system is designed to protect the trading community. Additionally, I've traded with people who have 200+ logged BA trades and scanning their feedback can be a bit tedious. Second, the KBBS re-waxer and others that stoop to such low levels of douchebaggery get banned. To say that negative feedback should only be reserved for infractions of that caliber or even a notch or two under would make the negative score virtually useless since a bad trader thread would always need to be made and/or the action of Mods would always be required. There's no need for a fourth score. Negative feedback is simply for people who did not hold up their end of the trade. Whether beer was lost or not shouldn't matter in this case. In fact, I'll bet when this guy was pondering drinking the bottle in question, something to the effect of "Well, he didn't send/give me any beer yet, so I'm gonna drink this" was going through his head. Lastly, you may be fine with having an open trade hanging in your trading stats until it gets purged, but I would find it annoying and borderline offensive to log in every day and go "Oh yeah, that dickhole that never followed through with the trade." My idea of "washing my hands" would be to give the deserved negative feedback and moving on.

The worst that's going to happen to this guy is people are going to ask him to ship first for a while until his percentage starts going back up. Giving neutral feedback would imply that "Expectations were met...but," however expectations were not met. OP gave dude 5, count 'em, 5 extra chances to complete the trade and dude just shrugged him off. I believe he'll think twice about being solid on a trade before he pushes the "Accept" button again.