Rice vs. Corn Syrup in Beer

Discussion in 'Beer Talk' started by JackHorzempa, Feb 4, 2019.

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  1. jesskidden

    jesskidden Grand Pooh-Bah (3,145) Aug 10, 2005 New Jersey
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    MillerCoors uses dextrose or maltose for adjuncts in their flagship brands - those are not HFCS. The only HFCS I've seen listed on either the AB "Tap Into Your Beer" page or the MillerCoors pdf (where the below image is from) are in their FMBs and other flavored beers, obviously used as a sweetener, not a fermentable.
    [​IMG]
     
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  2. miniditka77

    miniditka77 Pundit (953) May 21, 2015 Illinois
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    Maybe it increases the yeast obesity rate?
     
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  3. zid

    zid Grand Pooh-Bah (3,132) Feb 15, 2010 New York
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  4. steveh

    steveh Grand Pooh-Bah (4,174) Oct 8, 2003 Illinois
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    Wow. Talk about stepping far from the original brewing process to create beer.
     
  5. steveh

    steveh Grand Pooh-Bah (4,174) Oct 8, 2003 Illinois
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    More taste? (assuming that would mean "flavor," of course) That's pretty arguable.

    Makes you wonder... is this where BMC starts to attack each other, implode, and leave the good beer to the rest of us? :grin:
     
  6. Bitterbill

    Bitterbill Grand High Pooh-Bah (7,036) Sep 14, 2002 Wyoming
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    I'll take a Miller Lite over the Bud Light any day of the week. When I'm in the mood for a light, which ain't very often.
     
  7. steveh

    steveh Grand Pooh-Bah (4,174) Oct 8, 2003 Illinois
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    As I've been cutting back for Dry January into "wet" February, I'm surprised that Heineken Light tastes pretty good -- for a 3.3 ABV beer. I can't compare it to Miller or Bud Light(s) because I can't remember the last time I tried them (Bud Light maybe never), but I'm surprised that it tastes much better than non-alcohol beers I've tried.
     
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  8. Bitterbill

    Bitterbill Grand High Pooh-Bah (7,036) Sep 14, 2002 Wyoming
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    I don't remember seeing that though it was(is) probably there.
     
  9. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    From the MillerCoors blog linked in post #103:

    “Miller Lite. Coors Light. Sierra Nevada Pale Ale. Russian River Brewing’s Pliny the Elder double IPA. Corona Extra. Busch Light. Natural Light. Bon & Viv Spiked Seltzer. The list of beers goes on and on.

    Each use a corn-derived sugar or corn syrup called dextrose.”

    And:

    “And other craft breweries that bottle condition their beer, or allow the beer to ferment and carbonate naturally in the can or bottle, use corn-derived dextrose and other sugars during that process. That includes craft stalwart Sierra Nevada Pale Ale.”

    If you go to the Sierra Nevada website there is no mention of corn sugar (dextrose) in the ingredient list for Sierra Nevada Pale Ale:

    “Ingredients

    Yeast Ale yeast

    Bittering Hops Cascade

    Finishing Hops Cascade

    Malts Two-row Pale, Caramel”

    https://sierranevada.com/beer/year-round/pale-ale

    Terence (@SierraTerence), is dextrose used as an ingredient in the production of Sierra Nevada Pale Ale? Is some dextrose added during the bottle conditioning phase?

    Cheers!

    @BillManley
     
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  10. zid

    zid Grand Pooh-Bah (3,132) Feb 15, 2010 New York
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    Both Sierra Nevada and MillerCoors are broadly claiming that SN uses "sugar."
     
  11. jesskidden

    jesskidden Grand Pooh-Bah (3,145) Aug 10, 2005 New Jersey
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    Yeah, while, it was obvious that some brewers in the US used some form of corn syrup (dextrose, glucose, grape sugar, etc.) by looking through industry publications and reading ads and labels of other brewers which proclaimed they didn't (perhaps the longest-lived one --- or maybe just my favorite?), AB's Busch Beer was one of the first beers I'd ever read about where the brewery itself admitted it.

    In the period 1978-1979, Anhueser-Busch changed their regional popular-priced brand Busch Bavarian's recipe--- "the reformulated brew – called lighter and and sweeter” by spokesmen - uses corn syrup instead of corn grits in the brewing process” (according to the St. Louis Post-Dispatch at the time) ---- and slowly reintroduced it as Busch Beer, as well as expanding it's marketing area to eventually become national brand.

    SN FAQ - What is bottle conditioning:
    Don't have the actual recipe, but I'm thinking it probably doesn't equal 30-40% of the total fermentables that it likely does for Miller Lite and Coors Light :grin:
     
    #111 jesskidden, Feb 5, 2019
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2019
  12. zid

    zid Grand Pooh-Bah (3,132) Feb 15, 2010 New York
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    I'm surprised that you're surprised.
     
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  13. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
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    Do you see that in the list of ingredients for Sierra Nevada Pale Ale on the Sierra Nevada website?

    Cheers!
     
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  14. zid

    zid Grand Pooh-Bah (3,132) Feb 15, 2010 New York
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    Nope. I don't remember seeing any brewer ever mention this on a list of ingredients with regard to bottle conditioning.

    Sierra Nevada FAQ:

     
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  15. FatBoyGotSwagger

    FatBoyGotSwagger Grand Pooh-Bah (3,999) Apr 4, 2009 Pennsylvania
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    I'm not very keen on the large scale farming of corn we do today in the United States. It was one of the main causes of the collapse of the Mayan civilization.

    "A major drought occurred about the time the Maya began to disappear. And at the time of their collapse, the Maya had cut down most of the trees across large swaths of the land to clear fields for growing corn to feed their burgeoning population. They also cut trees for firewood and for making building materials." - https://science.nasa.gov/science-news/science-at-nasa/2009/06oct_maya

    I mean I would hate to see the world burn because of such a worthless crop being over farmed. It basically makes a shit ton of soda, crappy beer, and animal feed. The human body doesn't process the stuff we just shit it out.
     
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  16. islay

    islay Savant (1,211) Jan 6, 2008 Minnesota

    Isn't Sierra Nevada Pale Ale bottle-conditioned? Isn't the use of priming sugar standard practice for bottle conditioning? Isn't dextrose the most common form of priming sugar? Isn't corn the most common source of dextrose, at least in brewing? What is surprising here?

    @jesskidden makes the good point that adding a little bit of priming sugar isn't quite the same thing as what the big AAL producers are doing with dextrose.
     
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  17. EmperorBatman

    EmperorBatman Zealot (741) Mar 16, 2018 Tennessee

    How do German brewers get away with bottle-conditioning Kellerbier and Weissbier if the traditions of the Reinheitsgebot exclude sugar? Do they simply add a small amount of addition malt after fermentation and before packaging?
     
  18. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
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    “Because they are restricted by the “German Beer Purity Law,” German brewers use a different technique for bottle conditioning. Rather than adding priming sugar, they add a precisely dosed blend of wort and yeast called “speise,” a word meaning “food.” The speise provides both the fermentable sugar (along with unfermentable wort sugars) and the yeast necessary to perform the refermentation.”

    Needless to say but there are a number of ways to bottle condition beer beyond using corn sugar (dextrose). As a homebrewer I bottle condition my beers to achieve carbonation and I do not use corn sugar (dextrose) to do this.

    Cheers!
     
  19. zid

    zid Grand Pooh-Bah (3,132) Feb 15, 2010 New York
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    Before I posted that link, I thought to myself: "Well, this is the first time I've seen marketing that grouped Miller Lite, SNPA, and Pliny together."
    Sorry, I didn't notice that you beat me to the punch.
     
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  20. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    Yup, an interesting trio. I am well familiar with Pliny the Elder since I periodically brew a version of this beer based upon the recipe that Vinnie Cilurzo published. Vinnie's recipe calls for 0.75 lbs. corn sugar (dextrose) as part of the fermentables (for a 5 gallon batch). I personally brew my version of Pliny the Elder as all malt (i.e., no corn sugar) since with my brewing process this beer comes out dry enough without the corn sugar. I made a batch of PtE last December and that beer is still drinking very nicely now; I have one case left.

    Cheers!
     
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