Porter or Stout?

(Grabs popcorn...)

You’ll probably want to Google it anyway. For every ten replies you have 19 different things that determine which is which. Original gravity? Roasted barley versus black malt? The history is actually a fun read, if you’re into geeky stuff like word origins. And you asked, so I’d wager you are at least a little interested.

 

In today's craft beer scene it is what ever the commercial brewer chooses to label their beers. Some prefer to label them as Stouts while others prefer to label them as Porters.

Some folks will opine that a Stout must include Black Roasted Barley in the grain bill. I personally do not buy into this.

Call your homebrewed beers whatever you like.

Cheers!

 

Yep.

To the OP, remember too that the entire idea of beer styles and style guidelines is something that came around a few decades ago. In terms of brewing history, last week. It is interesting history but most of use around here caution against getting too caught up in guidelines. Very few styles are historically precise.

Brewers brewed what they could with what they had to sell to the local clientele. They were interested in selling and making profit. So the Dubliners were never going to see a Pilsner and likewise the Czechs were never going to be drinking a proper Stout. If the kiln in London was fired to 400 degrees and the kiln in York was fired to 350F nobody knew or cared all that much either. They labeled the beer and hoped it sold well. If the beer down the road was selling out they tried to copy it as best as possible. (Pirated it even. Brewing history is filled with flat out stolen branding).

Cheers.

 

There's no fuckin difference.

 

Do you ever add specialty grains? I think a beer like a stout or porter can really benefit from using some roasted grains when using extract.

 

Agree with all comments ranging from it's blurred to it isn't important anyways.

Although no means absolute, I think comparing IPA to DIPA is similar to comparing Porter to Stout; Stout is a more intense bigger version of Porter. I believe originally Stout was in fact referred to as Porter Stout or a more stout version of Porter. Although beer history is ofter miss-recorded. In particular Stout should have more more dark roast and a little astringency, whereas I think of Porter as smoother.

 

Some issues are black and white. This issue is black and black... so its impossible to see where the line is drawn.

 

My personal take is that a Porter will generally be lower ABV, lighter body & slightly higher carbonation. Perhaps less toasty, but not necessarily.

But yeah, whatever...

 

I used to think stouts were stronger, bolder type beer. Then I had a few Baltic porters which I found to be fantastic, bold and strong. So I don't know, or care.

and I like using black patent and roasted barley sin some beers amd usually call them stouts. could b wrong , but again don't care

 

It's complicated, innit.

Historically (like 18th-19th Century), porter was porter and stout porter was strong porter. So stout is a form of porter, but normally at the top end of a brewery's range ABV-wise.

For modern British trad brewers, the two are essentially indistinguishable - I think Martyn Cornell did some number crunching on the beer listings from CAMRA's Good Beer guide and couldn't find any distinguishing factor in the ABVs or tasting notes.

IIRC, the BJCP list several variations on stout and porter, some of which are rooted in real styles (Dry Stout, Sweet Stout, Baltic Porter) and some of which they freely admit to having made up (Brown Porter, Robust Porter), but both of them cover such a range that it's hard to think of something that links all the porter styles and makes them distinct from all the stout styles.

So yeah, I think "no fuckin difference" is probably a fair summary.

 

My 2 cents... Porters and Stouts can have some overlap, even within (BJCP) guidelines. But I wouldn't go so far as to call them the same. Taking American Porter and American Stout for example...you can make a winning American Porter that would likely not score great if entered as an American Stout and vice versa.

Having said that, I wouldn't put too much faith in what any particular commercial brewer calls their beer. Most, but certainly not all commercial brewers I know don't give a rat's a$$ about BJCP or BA guidelines. They're free to call their beers whatever they want.

You could make an argument that (sticking with American for this example) that American Porter and American Stout could/should be combined into one wider substyle. I wouldn't necessarily object to that, but given that there are about 87 IPA substyles (maybe a slight exaggeration), I think the split is valid and probably has enough historic justification.

IIRC from another post, you've been brewing for many years. Do you always use just extract? If so, I think you'd be in for a pleasant surprise if you got into partial mash or especially all grain.

 

im surre your beer if fine, but, steeping a specialty grain or 2 in a stout can yield some great flavors and not take up too much time

 

I brewed the AP American stout and entered it into a comp and got a 32.5. @PortLargo (meant to message you about this, but never got around to it) was a judge and suggested it might do better as a porter. So I entered it as both in another comp about a month later and received a 40 as a porter and 38 as a stout. I will admit my efficiency was off that brew day for some reason and the final abv ended up at 5.8% vs the recipe 6.5%. Also made a minor (IMO) hop substitution. Not sure if the lower gravity had something to do with outcome or some other factor.
Obviously this is just one small data point. And maybe @PortLargo and his ilk can’t tell the difference between what is obviously a stout and a porter (I kid).

 

For all intents and purposes you received the same score in both categories. Sounds like you brewed a high quality beer.

Cheers to you!

 

Personal preference really.
I go by if it's a smooth roast, it's porter, if it's a somewhat harsher roast, it's a stout. But the smooth or harsh decision is completely arbitrary on my part.