The difference between Pale Ale and IPA

Wait, what?

Flyover IPA?

(Copyright pending...)

 

In my opinion there are two features which distinguish an APA from an IPA:

• A difference of ABV (i.e., APA will have a lower ABV than an IPA)
• A difference of hop intensity, in the older days all three phases: bitterness, flavor and aroma. In the contemporary days the the difference in hop intensity may be just flavor/aroma.

Cheers!

 

Well, I'm hardly an expert. But, you are correct in that I prefer a good APA to an AIPA.

To my taste, the APA is a better balanced beer. The hops aromas and flavors do not overwhelm the malts as they do in most APIAs. And, the finish is generally less bitter.

The APA is also a lower ABV beer (but, of course, there is overlap).

There are plenty of beers that push the boundaries while calling themselves APA. Zombie Dust is one. pseudoSue is another.

Trying to define hard boundaries in ABV, hop-forwardness, maltiness, etc., and apply it to any specific beer is futile. In general, though, the American pale ale is better balanced in aroma and flavor and lower ABV than the American IPA.

Truth be told, I prefer a well-done English-style pale ale to most American ones. The malts tend to be a larger component of the overall flavor than with American-style pale ales. It is just harder to find them actually from England in prime condition. It is why Summit EPA is among my most frequent purchases.

 

No, they're not. At least not most of them. Most of them have hardly any malt presence at all, hence the derisive term "hop water".

 

Interesting... you want him to continue with a self-destructive position.

 

Well maybe it's not widely known since you are questioning its existence () but I've seen the term used in these threads. In particular I think it has been used to classify Two Hearted since it doesn't quite fit West Coast IPA and 'IPA' is too generic or too plain for this great beer.

 

Huh. I had no problem calling Two Hearted an IPA. No problem drinking it either.

But I looked up Midwest IPA and it looks like it's somewhat of a "thing," but it -- like all the variants, is difficult to define. No surprise there.

 

Don't forget the ever so delicious (not) Milkshake.

 

Yeah, and it's also relative. Hop forward compared to what?

When you say "back before '96-97" perhaps you are referring to some sort of specific published style guide or competition criteria, but it seems that that doesn't really matter based on your post - If people were arguing about if SNPA or Liberty were APAs or IPAs in the early 90s then the concept already existed for them then.

Looking at Jackson's Beer Companion from '93, he has an "American IPA" section that specifically focuses on Ballantine, Bert Grant, and a handful of Pacific Northwest beers called IPA by the brewers with C-hops and aged on oak chips. In a different section, he has a chapter on "American ales" and that's where he talks about the wide spectrum of Ballantine, Genesee, Liberty, and SNPA.

In '97, Steve Johnson's "America's Best Brews" was published (I don't have it though) as a guide book for American craft beer at the time. In it he examined 77 beers in the American pale ale / IPA / amber / bitter family. Of those, 32 were "pale ales" and 12 were "IPAs." The IPAs had higher OG and IBU than the APAs on average. Note that I'm not saying that I subscribe to this as anything defining, I'm just presenting something as a snapshot from the time period.

 

Or, hop forward based on whose palate?

 

There is not a simple answer to this. But first, your usage of "IPA" needs a clarification. I assume that you mean the "traditional" American IPA (as traditional as a style can be that was mostly developed in the last 40 years). Because "IPA" is now almost a marketing term that brewers use because it sells, and all it means is some level of hoppiness. Session IPA, Double IPA, Hazy IPA, NE IPA, Milkshake IPA, Brut IPA, White IPA, Black IPA, etc. - these all would have a different comparison vs an American Pale Ale.

So in terms of American Pale vs American IPA it generally comes down to either balance or abv or usually (but not always) both. But it seems that brewers often make it about balance or abv within their own portfolio. So you have brewers like Three Floyds (Zombie Dust) and Lagunitas (Born Yesterday) calling their beers Pale Ales simply because they aren't as extreme as their own IPAs. Other brewers would have likely called the same beers an IPA. This is the same exact issue that often comes up with Porter vs Stout, where each brewer makes their own dividing line.

 

Personally, I agree with all the folks that say balance. I also think that it's mostly about what the brewer wants to call it, depending on how they feel about it, similar to the difference between porter and stout.

Since everyone is bringing up Zombie Dust, it's worth pointing out Alpha King by 3 Floyds. If you just look at the numbers, it's solidly in the IPA category. However, they label it as an APA, and always (to my knowledge) have. If you drink it, it's big, in all ways for the style, but balanced between hop profile and malt profile.

 

Agreed, for me the beauty of SNPA is the balance it exhibits - lots of piney, citrusy hops with a sturdy biscuit malt flavor for balance.

For ZD, the Citra hop is so dominant, especially when the beer is really fresh, that it overwhelms the malt flavor (which for me is a caramalt flavor) a bit, pushing it more toward IPA land.

 

"Hop Forward" is pretty much a euphemism for "dry hopped"

The concept generally exists in the wild, so to speak, before any official categorization occurs; that's just the general nature of these things. It's usually driven by the BJCP, GABF, etc. playing catchup to brewers.

In general I'd say that higher gravity does track with higher hopping rates out of necessity, which was a process that developed over time. But beers like Grant's, Liberty, and Celebration all started out at a fairly modest strength.

 

Have no fear. @beertunes is a mighty man.

 

What’s the difference between stout and porter next? This is a question that I’ve heard many times over years. Too much overlap, too much gray area. I don’t see there being a defined line especially in today’s beer industry.

I have my opinion whether that’s right or wrong. When I homebrew I get to pick what I call it.

 

IPA is that beer that looks and tastes like a Jumex right?

 

Wtf is a midwest ipa

 

Just like the pros.

 

I was thinking about this very question the other day while I was drinking a Pseudo Sue, and I came to no conclusion.