Brewery: "We do not serve fascists."

Sure. Although I don't have to go back that far. How about:

"I could have gone to 1600 Pennsylvania and killed the real bird with one stone" (John Kerry about Bush II)

Or:

“They asked me would I like to debate this gentleman, and I said no. I said, ‘If we were in high school, I’d take him behind the gym and beat the Hell out of him.” (Biden about Trump)

Or:

“Trump is a guy who you understand he hurts you, and my testosterone sometimes makes me want to feel like punching him, which would be bad for this elderly, out-of-shape man that he is if I did that. This physically weak specimen.” (Corey Booker)

Again, this is unabashed whataboutism, and I'm not denying it. Trump's manner and name-calling isn't acceptable discourse. I'm just saying, the pearl-clutching about what he says in light of what's come before (and in some cases, in light of what is happening in parallel) is a bit too precious.

 

Well, clearly we need to modify BA so that all of our usernames are preceded by a color scale that indicates our self-identified level of liberal v. conservative bent. That way no one else has to worry about making the mistake of "liking" a beer-related comment or post by some vile member of the "other" political viewpoint. In fact, perhaps we should lobby for a blue version of BA and a red version of BA so that we don't get defiled by inadvertent interaction with those who voted for "the other".

 

Where has anyone sane thought that the people we've elected to the Oval Office are saints?

Say what you will about any candidate prior to Trump, but they at least seemed to care about the United States. Like, even candidates beset with corruption (Harding, Grant, Bush Jr.) at least seemed upset over being swindled and at least seemed like they were trying to put the US in a better place.

Trump has given no indication he cares whatsoever about the United States.

Ignoring everything I've posted before (such as Trump colluding with an enemy of the United States to interfere in the 2016 election) that indicates a level of callousness and cruelty that would make Ursula shiver.... (like seriously, imagine another US President who would deliberate hoard masks and PPE to ensure that more citizens in Democratic states die, because that's exactly what Trump and Kushner did at the beginning of the COVID outbreak)

Can you name a single US President who discovers that another country has enacted a bounty over our soldiers and DELIBERATELY hides it and does nothing to stop it? In short, he did nothing to stop our soldiers from being hunted and killed despite knowing about it for months.

I mean, you talk about Japanese internment as Donald Trump is rounding up legal US citizens because they're of Latino descent and putting them in concentration camps.

I'm sorry, but this self-admitted "whataboutism" just reeks of enlightened centrism where "both sides bad", as if that's supposed to mean something.

Look at Joe Biden. Biden will call people asking if they're doing ok. Biden will send personal cards empathizing with someone's loss. Is Biden a saint? Nowhere close. Will he be a good US president? No idea.

But he at least cares about this country and at least cares about its citizens. What has Trump done to show he cares about anyone other than himself?

 

Sounds good. Just keep on L-I-V-I-N

 

Hm. First, I hope you are enjoying a brew while discussing. I actually have friends I can "brew" with and talk about these things, even if we disagree.

But, respectfully, if Trump is a dictator/autocrat he is a shitty one. COVID-19 and the BLM/Antifa/and yes, alt-right-agitator protests that burned a number of American cities over the summer and early fall of 2020 offered up a golden opportunity for the Bad Orange Man to be the dictator his enemies said he wanted to be. He could overrule the Cuomos, Pritzkers, Newsomes, and so forth and require them to "open up" their states and crack down on protestors. But then something weird happened. He didn't. Did he try to use his bully pulpit to sway public opinion in the hopes of convincing the public to pressure those governors? Yes he did. Did he do so in typically mouthy and inarticulate fashion? Yes he did. Did he send federal personnel into cities when federal courthouse were threatened. Yes he did. But he didn't order anyone to do anything. He has let each state's governor make the call on what to do about COVID and what to do about the unrest. Donald J. Trump, boorish bag of dicks that he is, has let the states each decide how to deal with COVID and political unrest. That's not an autocrat.

(Full disclosure--I actually thought he was going to do all of the things his opponents said he would do--so he surprised me).

As for "social regimentation" and "forcible suppression of opposition" that's what I care about more than who is haunting the Oval Office for the next 4 years. Go read some articles by Matt Tlaibbi (Rolling Stone), Glenn Greenwald (The Intercept), and other very liberal, but not leftist, writers. Tlaibbi and Greenwald are die-hard liberals who would never vote for Trump in a million years. But they and other true liberals have been "cancelled" by the far-left for suggesting that the leftists present a greater threat to the Republic than the Bad Orange Man does. In fact, Greenwald got cancelled by the publication he founded (the Intercept) for suggesting the media should dig in and ask questions about Biden and other Democrats, just as they were (rightfully) asking questions and digging into Trump and his background.

Or better yet, sit down with my daughter. She's a Presidential Scholar. That means she was one of the top two high school scholars from her state. She never got anything other than an "A" in her life. And she's a much better person than I will ever be. During her senior year, she got her first taste of having to keep her "head down" to get the "A" she had earned. You see, her professor (from a college-credit class) made it clear my daughter didn't have the correct political opinions. (She is a big LGBTQ supporter, for example but apparently still wasn't pure enough). Fortunately, my daughter toned her opinions down and got an A, even though she hated herself for compromising her beliefs.

So the only "suppression" I've seen is happening from the far left.

I respect true liberals/moderate Democrats and moderate Republicans, despite not fitting in neatly with either group. I suspect you are one of those. But If you are worried about fascists or dictators, worry about the left wing of the Democrat party, not Donald Trump.

 

Well written but bullshit. i think we are all creatures of our environment. You being SD me being Oregon. And in The Valley. I see far more danger from the likes of Tom Cotton than from AOC..who i find reminds me of my young days..Cotton and most extreme republicans are fascists.
I think a strong left brings the US into the 21st century

 

Pretty gutsy but NJ voted very much against The Annoying Orange..so i doubt they lose anything

 

Is this a publicity stunt to gain some free press or was the Instagram post just a joke.

Referend Bier Blendery doesn't have the Instagram post on their website. If you like Lambics and Berliner Weisse this might be a brewery worth checking out for non-fascist, spontaneous fermentation fans. I can drink at their "Lawn Seating Area" if I wanted to, I don't talk politics or religion while drinking. And maybe I don't want to drink around people who label Republicans as fascist, racists and white supremist, that's what a bigot would do. Cheers.

 

.

Brevity is the soul of wit, so if that's the rubric, you win, I suppose. But the real bullshit is you deciding you know me based solely on where I'm from. (Is that any better than judging someone based on pigment, gender, etc?) You don't know a damn thing about me. I live in SD, but I'm not from here. And I don't fit many of the stereotypes that people reserve for folks from here. (I.e., I'm a former metal-band member, have a professional degree, am part Native-American, shall I go on?) Although I do own multiple firearms, so I guess you can use that to justify writing me off.

Tom Cotton is pretty extreme for sure. The fact you don't realize how extreme AOC and the far left are is a pity. Perhaps you and I don't agree on what "the left" means. I'm fine with liberals/progressives. They have principles and fixed morals. Leftists care for nothing other than power, and that's where the American left finds itself today.

 

Well stated, I would like to add that the extremist from both sides are the biggest problem. Communist/Socialist against Fascists/Religious Right, idiots killing each other. Sorry about that crap your daughter had to deal with, I've met several professors that impose their beliefs on the students.

 

Exactly. No brewery ever told me I needed to prove that I voted for Biden in order to purchase online or pick up beer at the brewery. If they did, I have no issues taking my business elsewhere.

And wasn't it Biden himself yesterday say that we are not enemies?

 

I was a communist in my younger days..so maybe you are right about AOC and the squad. I find them refreshing...I am far left here but moderate in Scotland. But come on dude SD is far right as even as the US is.
And you live in that environment
We all pick up signals from where we are.
Would SD vote to decriminalize all user sized drugs?//yu guys even have weed? So from were i am..background and Oregon you are right wing

 

We are enemies..despite losing Trump will call up his minions, luckily we had armed left wing militias to protect me here in the PNW

 

The fact that AOC is considered extreme Left shows how far off the scale the Right has gone. And, for practical purposes, Biden is a Republican. Nixon would be called a Leftist Wingnut by today's Republican party.

 

I don't know about all drugs, but just a few days ago SD voted to legalize both medical and recreational marijuana. (I voted "yes" on both of those by the way. Criminalizing marijuana use is a waste of effort.) SD is a "live and let live" state, by and large. So yes, we have quite a bit of weed (and more meth than we probably should have as well, FWIW).

 

So why do they vote far right? Religion is not live and let live

 

I just think there is gonna be a war. Trump and the militias will never except a Biden presidency.
I am armed. Trumpers think lefty's are unarmed..haha

 

Like @Reidrover I am a Scot. And like him/her my politics are probably considered firmly left wing here, whereas in Scotland / most of Europe they would be considered pretty standard just-left-of-centre fare.

I try to be as open minded as possible. But someone needs to explain to me (without telling me to google or sending a Breitbart url) how AOC/Sanders, etc are considered hard left / dangerous / the clear dictatorship threat to democracy. I genuinely am interested to hear, in plain/non-inflammatory terms. Advocating for free healthcare, higher min. wage, better overall social safety nets, along with higher taxes on the wealthy, and better representation of the working class etc - this is hardly revolutionary stuff. And Biden himself has been tarred with the Communist/left label throughout this election cycle. That is laughable. Even Biden 2.0 would be considered firmly right/conservative in most other countries.

Yet at the same time there are comments in here like “lol you need to google what fascist means” in reference to those claims about Trump, as if it’s moronic to make that connection. I mean did nobody watch his address a few hours ago? Have people been sleeping the last 4 years? It’s like the guy has been playing straight from the Facism for Dummies playbook. I respect that people have different opinions - and I’m not going to write off 70mm people with broad brush strokes, despite being so disheartened that such a large % of the country support him. But this is not a partisan position. It is based on facts and precedent. All of my European friends and family (from across the political spectrum - I truly mean its entirety) have been watching recent events absolutely horrified.

Mental times. One side note - I had most of the regular posters’ political leanings pegged, but damn there are a few surprises in here (in both directions)!

 

I am happy now live here in the west coast..one of my once punk/ska buddies from the 90s in GA has gone totally weird Christian..Trump..i hate him now

 

Hey Rozz where in Scotland do ye come frae?