Statistical Data Additions

Talk Discussion in 'BeerAdvocate Talk' started by SLeffler27, Apr 26, 2021.

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  1. SLeffler27

    SLeffler27 Grand Pooh-Bah (4,906) Feb 24, 2008 New York
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    Are there any statistical data folks would like to see added to the site?

    My thoughts...
    1 - Add total beers rated to various lists. Each style
    2 - Add average rating to various lists. Each style

    Total ratings would demonstrate rarity.
    Avg. value would help put ratings in context with specific style, and each style in context with all beers.
     
  2. BBThunderbolt

    BBThunderbolt Grand High Pooh-Bah (7,846) Sep 24, 2007 Kiribati
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Why is rarity important?
     
  3. SLeffler27

    SLeffler27 Grand Pooh-Bah (4,906) Feb 24, 2008 New York
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    Rarity is a lesser point.

    Some of the styles seem to be less good, unfairly so, simply because there are fewer of them in the total. Check how many of the Best of Style score below 90. Anecdotally they also seem to be less frequently brewed. (With some notable exceptions.)

    Besides, seeing which styles are waning, might help protect them from extinction. While all is fair with market forces, future tastes will shift and the loss would be unfortunate, especially if a style is lost simply to passing trends. Think of Witbier.
     
  4. BBThunderbolt

    BBThunderbolt Grand High Pooh-Bah (7,846) Sep 24, 2007 Kiribati
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Huh?

    Just because certain users rate certain styles in certain ways, based on personal preference, does not diminish the quality of any other style.

    Rarity, or perceived value, should not be a part of a beers score.
     
  5. JimmieFrisbee

    JimmieFrisbee Zealot (564) May 21, 2008 Massachusetts
    Trader

    Don't want to speak for the OP, but I think it would be useful to see average rating for styles because of grade inflation. There are 50 NE IPAs with a score above 4.5, but no Altbiers with a score above 4.25. Having these stats readily available (maybe along with median score), in addition to total entries for a given style, can help put a beer with a rating of 4.1 into better context.

    Similarly, knowing a beer is the 150th ranked beer for a style might be helpful (I don't believe that is displayed currently), and further, knowing a beer is 150th ranked out of 150 beers of a style versus 150th out of 1,500 beers. There are lots of good reasons for not keeping rank beyond top 100 for a given style, as well, but I could see that information being useful or desirable to some.
     
  6. SLeffler27

    SLeffler27 Grand Pooh-Bah (4,906) Feb 24, 2008 New York
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    Rarity should NOT be part of a beers score, agreed. And I don’t think it is.

    As for personal perceptions, vs. quality of the beer... Tell that to Faro. Sure, the beer is great, yet if someone is just looking at the ratings, they might think otherwise, and “That’s the best this style has to offer? PASS!”

    https://www.beeradvocate.com/beer/profile/388/7761/

    The highest ranked version of Faro is rated 86, with 17,358 beers supposedly better. And the style only has ten slots in it’s top 100 list.
     
  7. BBThunderbolt

    BBThunderbolt Grand High Pooh-Bah (7,846) Sep 24, 2007 Kiribati
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Is that on the beer, or on us?

    Who was a better football player, Wayne Gretzky or Babe Ruth?
     
    Whyteboar likes this.
  8. BBThunderbolt

    BBThunderbolt Grand High Pooh-Bah (7,846) Sep 24, 2007 Kiribati
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Yet, you made a point of highlighting it in your OP:

    "Total ratings would demonstrate rarity."
     
    Whyteboar likes this.
  9. unlikelyspiderperson

    unlikelyspiderperson Grand Pooh-Bah (3,966) Mar 12, 2013 California
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    I think they were talking about rarity of a given style, I guess so that you could see how common/uncommon styles really were. They mentioned using it as a tool to target " endangered" styles, and possibly using it to inform your interpretation of the ratings (maybe a rarer style is more likely to have poor ratings from people who don't know what to expect?).
     
  10. BBThunderbolt

    BBThunderbolt Grand High Pooh-Bah (7,846) Sep 24, 2007 Kiribati
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Or, being the cynical bastard I am, OP is trying to narrow shit down to his view.

    I've been wrong before though.
     
  11. unlikelyspiderperson

    unlikelyspiderperson Grand Pooh-Bah (3,966) Mar 12, 2013 California
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    I'm not sure what you're suspecting? How would the relative rarity of a style being numerically represented cause a problem? Or be misused?
     
  12. BBThunderbolt

    BBThunderbolt Grand High Pooh-Bah (7,846) Sep 24, 2007 Kiribati
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    He seems to imply that rarity should carry extra weight is the scores.
     
  13. unlikelyspiderperson

    unlikelyspiderperson Grand Pooh-Bah (3,966) Mar 12, 2013 California
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Hmm I didn't get that. I thought they were saying that many of the beer styles that have a low rated "top rated" beer are often very rarely brewed. My interpretation was that knowing how uncommon a style is would help you frame the ratings appropriately. Super common styles are likely well understood and thus ratings are probably accurate. Rarely brewed styles are likely to be little understood, and so low ratings might be a result of misunderstanding vs actually being poor examples. That's my interpretation, hopefully they'll clarify I guess
     
    Whyteboar, Harrison8 and SLeffler27 like this.
  14. SLeffler27

    SLeffler27 Grand Pooh-Bah (4,906) Feb 24, 2008 New York
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    Correct
     
  15. SLeffler27

    SLeffler27 Grand Pooh-Bah (4,906) Feb 24, 2008 New York
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    You don’t know me, or seem to be interested in the conversation. You are wrong about my intentions, and may be right about your intentions.
     
  16. SLeffler27

    SLeffler27 Grand Pooh-Bah (4,906) Feb 24, 2008 New York
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    Nope. That is something you inferred.
     
  17. SLeffler27

    SLeffler27 Grand Pooh-Bah (4,906) Feb 24, 2008 New York
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    Exactly. You have framed my views well.
     
  18. SLeffler27

    SLeffler27 Grand Pooh-Bah (4,906) Feb 24, 2008 New York
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    It is on us. And I’m suggesting how we might mitigate the issue.

    A more accurate analogy is a comparison between Patrick Mahomes and Aaron Donald. Two very different positions, BOTH still football.
     
    Whyteboar likes this.
  19. SLeffler27

    SLeffler27 Grand Pooh-Bah (4,906) Feb 24, 2008 New York
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    Yes.

    “help” being the key word here. And: It’s not just about the beers we think are good. The same applies to beers we think are poor.

    In a fantasy world, everyone would have perfect knowledge of each style and only score to style for Look, Smell, Taste, and Feel, leaving Overall for personal preferences.
     
  20. SLeffler27

    SLeffler27 Grand Pooh-Bah (4,906) Feb 24, 2008 New York
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    @BBThunderbolt : But this isn’t about you or me. It is about an idea.
    Prost!
     
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