Acidulated malt..

Discussion in 'Homebrewing' started by AAwald, Apr 30, 2021.

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  1. AAwald

    AAwald Initiate (0) Sep 12, 2020 Canada (MB)

    Is there a significant difference in using lactic acid/phosphoric or Acidulated malt.. and what would be cheaper doing a 5 gal batch??
     
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  2. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    Differences:
    - Acid malt is more traditional (see the German purity laws)
    - Lactic (or Phosphoric) acid is a more precise way to control pH, because the acid contribution of acid malt is fairly variable.

    For a single (once and done) batch, it would be cheaper to buy a little bit of acid malt. But for multiple batches, Lactic Acid would be cheaper, because a single small bottle is good for many batches. I'm not as familiar with phosphoric acid prices.
     
  3. SFACRKnight

    SFACRKnight Grand Pooh-Bah (3,348) Jan 20, 2012 Colorado
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    FWIW I have used both and prefer the malt.
     
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  4. The_Modern_Brewhouse

    The_Modern_Brewhouse Initiate (195) Sep 25, 2020 Minnesota

    Acid malt uses malt sprayed with sauergut. Sauergut is a pillar of the German beer flavor. If you are making German beer, you need to have the proper pillars. Making your own sauergut is even better! Did I mention sauergut?
     
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  5. AAwald

    AAwald Initiate (0) Sep 12, 2020 Canada (MB)

    Well normally I adjust my strike water not my Mash... and I have a problem getting my PH down to 5.2 it takes me an hour I wonder if Acidulated malt is going to make a difference..
     
  6. wasatchback

    wasatchback Pooh-Bah (1,574) Jan 12, 2014 Tajikistan
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Explain this... You should be adjusting your strike water for the mash but it’s a bit more complicated than that. It all depends on the buffering capacity of your water.
     
  7. AAwald

    AAwald Initiate (0) Sep 12, 2020 Canada (MB)

    Normally my pH is around the 7.5 to 8.. I bring it down to 5.5 I mesh in and then I check it 10 minutes into the mash..
     
  8. AAwald

    AAwald Initiate (0) Sep 12, 2020 Canada (MB)

    I use Reverse Osmosis water... and it goes through a charcoal filter...
     
  9. utahbeerdude

    utahbeerdude Maven (1,374) May 2, 2006 Utah

    The pH of your strike water, especially if it is RO, is irrelevant. Let me say that again, it is irrelevant. If using RO water, the acidity and buffering capacity of the malt is everything. In order to hit the desired mash pH, you typically need to add some acid and/or calcium/magnesium. If brewing a darker beer with lots of roast and/or dark crystal malts, you might not need additional acid. It all depends upon the malt bill.

    A very good approach to dealing with mash water chemistry is discussed in a talk given by @VikeMan, to which he has posted a link at times on this forum. You can search around for it, or perhaps he’ll be kind enough to post it again here.

    Cheers!
     
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  10. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    The .pdf presentation, "Intro to Brewing Water Treatment" can be viewed or downloaded here:
    http://sonsofalchemy.org/library/

    Slide 9 has a step-by-step approach to building from distilled/RO water.
     
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  11. wasatchback

    wasatchback Pooh-Bah (1,574) Jan 12, 2014 Tajikistan
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    As has been discussed RO water has no buffering power. So you’re adding a tiny amount of acid which then can’t lower the pH of the malt (which will normally be around 5.8-6.0 depending). You just need more acid. Plenty of water calculators available online.
     
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  12. AAwald

    AAwald Initiate (0) Sep 12, 2020 Canada (MB)

    This isvery helpful... Thanks alot...
    Thanks for the info.. Very helpful..
     
  13. AAwald

    AAwald Initiate (0) Sep 12, 2020 Canada (MB)

    Well normally when I start I check my pH..than I add my salts gypsum calcium in Epsom salt and then I adjust my pH... Once my pH is adjust I mash in.. Then I check my pH again after 10 mins... It stay around the 5.5 to 6.0 mark...
     
  14. AAwald

    AAwald Initiate (0) Sep 12, 2020 Canada (MB)

    So you guys are saying adjust pH just during Mash...?
     
  15. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    You should estimate what you need to add, given your starting water and your grain bill, to hit your desired mash pH. There is no point at all in targeting a specific water pH.
     
  16. AAwald

    AAwald Initiate (0) Sep 12, 2020 Canada (MB)

    Correct me if I am wrong...I'll check my pH throw in my salts... Mash in... check my pH in 5 to 10 minutes into the mash and then start adjusting my pH.... I'll try using a program to figure out my salts my water and my Grains..
     
  17. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    There's no point in measuring the water's pH. Just enter the starting water profile in the software. Since you're using RO water, just enter zeros for everything. If the software also asks you for your water's starting pH, you can enter 7.0 for RO. (Or enter 6.0. It won't really matter for mash pH.) You can't accurately measure the pH of RO water with your pH meter anyway.

    But yes, add your salts to the water, i.e. the salts that you have already entered into the program, along with the grain bill, starting water profile, and any acid additions needed to predict your target mash pH.

    Checking the pH mid-mash is a good idea, but if you have followed the process above, you've already adjusted the mash pH. It's really too late to adjust it further at this point, IMO. Checking serves to see how close you are to the software's prediction, and if off by very much, try to figure out what went wrong and/or how to adjust the next time.
     
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  18. AAwald

    AAwald Initiate (0) Sep 12, 2020 Canada (MB)

    Checking my PH at mid Mash... Can I check it with my probe at Mash temperature? And what if I can't get it down to the desired PH in one hour?
     
  19. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    I wouldn't. It makes the probe wear out faster. And even if the meter has automatic temperature correction (which compensates for the temperature of the probe (not the liquid), you'd still have to adjust the reading for the fact that the wort itself is a different pH at different temperatures. And there's no precise standard adjustment for that.

    Enjoy your beer, and live and learn.
     
  20. AAwald

    AAwald Initiate (0) Sep 12, 2020 Canada (MB)

    What kind of program would you guys to recommend..?
     
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