English Ale appreciation

Discussion in 'The Bar' started by HorseheadsHophead, Nov 16, 2021.

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  1. steveh

    steveh Grand Pooh-Bah (4,174) Oct 8, 2003 Illinois
    Society Pooh-Bah

    Great foresight there, mate. :grin:
     
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  2. Bitterbill

    Bitterbill Grand High Pooh-Bah (7,036) Sep 14, 2002 Wyoming
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah

    Well, at least I got to drink this beauty:

    [​IMG]
     
  3. AlcahueteJ

    AlcahueteJ Grand Pooh-Bah (3,242) Dec 4, 2004 Massachusetts
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    I really hope it happens this spring...

    That being said, as much as I ADORE Germany styles, I may love English ales (especially on cask) even more.

    While I don't think there will be a resurgence, I do think you'll see "more" of them. Only because there's so many breweries now, and I see all kinds of styles at tap rooms these days. Even English ales.
     
  4. AlcahueteJ

    AlcahueteJ Grand Pooh-Bah (3,242) Dec 4, 2004 Massachusetts
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    Greed got the best of me. I wanted to be an expert in both English and US beer styles, so I decided to be born in NEW England.

    All I got was IPAs...and they're not even English IPAs.
     
  5. EmperorBevis

    EmperorBevis Grand High Pooh-Bah (9,338) Sep 25, 2011 England
    Mod Team Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    I live a short bus from Robbo’s brewery in Stockport & have never seen this :open_mouth:
     
    #45 EmperorBevis, Nov 17, 2021
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2021
  6. EmperorBevis

    EmperorBevis Grand High Pooh-Bah (9,338) Sep 25, 2011 England
    Mod Team Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    Notes from a small island, a brief summary of The UK brewing scene & some thoughts on English styles.

    Now in the interest of transparency I have a lot of friends who are small batch brewers & am fairly grounded to Manchester(it’s like Seattle, always raining, a big deal in comparison to the nearby locale only & has a lot of people that are so underground they can tell you what the Earth’s core is up to)


    Started at Charle’s Well’s in London (I have had cask pints when brewed at Eagle brewery there), in 2006 they merged with Young’s, 2007 they took over Courage then in 2017 Marston’s swallowed them up hence production going to Wychwood (I am online acquittances with head brewer) who make a really good if not world class level of beer. Though I did really cringe at then PM Cameron giving Obama bottled Hobgoblin, probably bought last minute from Treasury supermarket loyalty points.
    Marston’s has now sold out to Carlsberg, so far Marston’s I think had done more disruption with places like Thwaites, but it’s still early days.


    Funnily enough Greene King has looked after it fairly well cask has noticeably diminished, but guess who had cask pints brewed at Morland lol.
    If you like regular Old Hen then all the varieties are of equal good stock but always keep an eye out for the bottle conditioned variation - Hen’s Tooth.

    Robinson’s
    keep going and maybe something had happened in the background in the boardroom but I have nothing official, cask Old Tom is still magnificent stuff but nearly everything else from a handpump lives up to the ‘Twig Water’ nickname.
    Bottled, well its all pasteurised and forced carbonated & it’s like bread, you’ve got Wonderbread levels of consistency & durability but when you’ve tasted an artisanal hand baked loaf.
    That goes for the bottles & cans for all regionals now, Theakston’s, Holts, JW Lee’s etc

    There are a number of smaller than regionals slightly bigger than most microbreweries, that give a balance but & I know I am biased but its the smaller brewers that are keeping the quality & heritage of most English styles.
    So if you have a local small batch brewer making English styles, I think that should be your number one port of call.

    If anyone is still awake after that load of olde codswallop, & has any questions on any English styles or beers I will endeavour to answer them to the best of my ability.
     
  7. Celtics76

    Celtics76 Pooh-Bah (1,781) Sep 5, 2011 Rhode Island
    Pooh-Bah

    I'm really hoping haze fatigue sets in at some point (taking long enough) and we start to see more local breweries brew English styles. I have definitely seen more ESBs over the last year or so, so that's a good sign.
     
  8. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    I had a conversation with the owner/manager of a local beer store a couple of years ago where I asked/advocated that the Juicy/Hazy trend was leveling off. He just smiled and shook his head and replied that his customers just asked for and wanted more of these sorts of beer. His store today is mostly comprised of Juicy/Hazy beers.

    Like you I really wish that "fatigue sets in" but I have been wishing for this the past couple of years. Yes, someday this will happen but it has had more 'staying power' than I would ever have guessed.

    I suppose I am 'off' here since for me beer should have some flavor aspects beyond a Juicy Juice box but it sure seems that the newer/younger craft beer drinkers think differently than me.

    Cheers to Bitter Ales!
     
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  9. M-Fox24

    M-Fox24 Grand Pooh-Bah (3,941) Mar 17, 2013 New Jersey
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Could potentially get more steam with the luxury & novelty of the mini/micro casks to go, which seemed to have been one of the few COVID benefits in the UK (keg) with some traction in the US (box). Of course, and as Dave Liechty put it: “cask beer to go is usually garbage.” So, theoretically and unfortunately not

    Fyne, as an example, utilizes mini-casks/kegs across styles with a bag cooler

    [​IMG]
     
  10. moodenba

    moodenba Pooh-Bah (2,502) Feb 2, 2015 New York
    Society Pooh-Bah

    Blue Point (Patchogue, NY) recently had its Cask Beer Festival. At my age, I'm not up for $50 worth of beer while navigating a large crowd. Maybe somebody who attended could make some comments on the beers in this thread? Any traditional British Styles there? We attended one several years ago when the fest took place on a chilly day in February, in a tent on the back lot of the River Avenue brewery. Kegs were set up on tables and served by gravity feed. They had homebrew, lagers, as well as ales, but most were too cold (ambient 40F) to appreciate. We did get glassware at the event but the year of the fest isn't inscribed.
     
  11. zid

    zid Grand Pooh-Bah (3,132) Feb 15, 2010 New York
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    I went in 2016. There were a sprinkling of beers with an English pub theme, but a clear majority of beers were what you'd get at a non-cask themed event (as far as beer style goes). Honestly, there wasn't even much about the beer (regarding the feel etc) that made me feel like I was at a cask fest regardless of style. If the beers were a different experience from keg, you couldn't really tell in the context of a large variety of small pours at a beer festival... except when it was evident that a brewer was too inexperienced with cask to get the carbonation at a servable level. I also went to a different cask fest at a brewery on the west coast once. That one was far smaller than Blue Point's and drew more of a niche crowd. The cask element of that fest was a bit more palpable, but not tremendously so.
     
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  12. HorseheadsHophead

    HorseheadsHophead Grand Pooh-Bah (3,732) Sep 15, 2014 Colorado
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    I think one of the most significant aspects of the experience is the beer being served on cask itself. I've had some good English beer styles before, but it wasn't until I had fresh dark mild on cask that the lightbulb really went on. But I think freshness is an important aspect, too. I've rarely been impressed by British imports because they're usually old and stale-tasting. Comparatively, you can find lots of fresh German style pilsners and other lagers made by American brewers, but English style ales not so much.
     
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  13. AlcahueteJ

    AlcahueteJ Grand Pooh-Bah (3,242) Dec 4, 2004 Massachusetts
    Society Pooh-Bah

    The only thing worse than no cask, is cask done poorly.
     
    #53 AlcahueteJ, Nov 18, 2021
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2021
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  14. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    Well, that is indeed the case in my area (Philly area). There are waaay more German style beers brewed by local craft breweries (e.g., German Pilsners, Helles, etc.) than English style beers.

    Ironically (is that the right word?) one of the earliest craft breweries in Philadelphia is Yards Brewing (opened in a small shed in the Manayunk neighborhood in 1994) and their flagship beer was ESA which was available on cask at local beer bars. For a decade+ I enjoyed drinking that beer on cask but over the past 10ish years they have seriously cut-back the brewing of ESA since that beer just simply did not sell well. It is still available on a small scale on 'regular' draft (no longer bottled) but it is nothing like it was in the recent (decade+ ago) past.

    To my personal dismay English style beers like ESA just are not readily available since the majority of craft beer drinkers just do not give a damn about these sorts of beers. It is all about more Juicy/Hazy IPAs, Fruited Sours, Pastry Stouts, etc.

    I hope that someday Yards will decide to provide ESA on cask again with broad distribution. But given what gets the current craft beer consumer 'excited' I have little hope in this regard.

    Cheers!
     
  15. EmperorBevis

    EmperorBevis Grand High Pooh-Bah (9,338) Sep 25, 2011 England
    Mod Team Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    Cask, it is the best beer that I’ve ever drank, it’s the worst beer I’ve ever drank,
    It’s a fresh product with a limited shelf life & a lot of knowledge required to maintain and serve.
     
  16. steveh

    steveh Grand Pooh-Bah (4,174) Oct 8, 2003 Illinois
    Society Pooh-Bah

    It was fun and enlightening to have the same cask beer of different ages in pubs across the street from each other. Really highlighted just how the beer ages -- some for the better, some for the worst, some just intriguing.
     
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  17. AlcahueteJ

    AlcahueteJ Grand Pooh-Bah (3,242) Dec 4, 2004 Massachusetts
    Society Pooh-Bah

    I always get both excited and nervous when I see cask available in the US.

    It could be outstanding or terrible.

    If I see a beer on cask at a bar and it’s been on their list for a week or more, I stay the hell away.
     
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  18. HorseheadsHophead

    HorseheadsHophead Grand Pooh-Bah (3,732) Sep 15, 2014 Colorado
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    So what you guys are saying is that I need to go to England to get the real English ale cask experience?

    Alright, you've convinced me.
     
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  19. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    I would recommend you go now because even in England cask ale is not as popular as it was in the recent past.

    A few videos I recommend you watch:







    Cheers!
     
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  20. Bitterbill

    Bitterbill Grand High Pooh-Bah (7,036) Sep 14, 2002 Wyoming
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah

    Perhaps at a bar but at a brewery, say like Coopersmiths in Fort Collins, having a cask Punjabi Pale Ale is a pretty safe bet.
     
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