Changes to the algorithm and what's considered an active beer

Blog Discussion in 'BeerAdvocate Talk' started by Todd, Mar 3, 2025.

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  1. Todd

    Todd Founder (13,518) Aug 23, 1996 Finland
    STAFF Mod Team Society Pooh-Bah

    The minimum (min) number of ratings required for an active beer to be scored and ranked has been 10 ratings for ages and the reality is that's too high given our current userbase, its activity, and consumer and industry changes over the last 5-10 years. On top of this, the threshold for what's considered active (rated within the last 2 years and not retired) is clearly too low. Combined, this hasn't been giving us an enough data to play with.

    So, what's changing?

    After proposing several ideas to the Mod Team, Pooh-Bahs, and Society members, I've decided to apply the following changes based on the feedback so far.
    • Expand what's considered active:
      • Beers rated within the last 5 years (up from 2 years) that aren't retired (discontinued by the brewery).
      • This will enhance top rated and brewery lists (active and inactive tabs).
    • Remove the minimum (min) as a requirement to be scored/ranked:
      • All active beers that have been rated will be scored/ranked.
      • The min will still be used within the algorithm that's used to rank beers for top rated lists and to generate the BeerAdvocate Score.
    • Increase the algorithmic min:
      • After a ton of testing, increasing the algorithmic min from 10 to 20 should cover our needs and we can reevaluate as needed.
      • Overall, this will strengthen active top beer lists, while improving discovery on less active lists by allowing beers with a lower number of ratings to break through until this list becomes more active. Those beers will also be subjected to a considerably lower weighted rank compared to their averages.
      • Example: a beer with a 5.0 average and only one rating might have a weighted rank of 3.94+, as it's being pulled much closer toward the average across all beers.
    • Add a scaling factor when under the min:
      • For beers under the min, we slightly reduce the beer's weighted rank based on the difference between the min and the number of ratings the beer has. This is experimental and may adjust over time based on feedback and further testing, but it should help soften the impact of beers with only a handful of ratings.
      • Example: that beer with 5.0 and only one rating now has an even lower weighted rank, because there's a 19 rating difference.
    • Include new beers with 0 ratings on active lists:
      • Specifically, the "active" tab location on brewery pages for better discovery and to help reduce the chance of duplicate entries.
    Other ideas are still being discussed, but this is a solid step forward. And the end result will increase the number of ranked beers from over 26k to over 253k, while also increasing the overall discovery of beers.

    Updates to support these changes are rolling out now…

    Questions? Feedback? Let me know.

    Thanks! :beers::heavymetal:
     
    Olesjm, md3kcn, desint and 47 others like this.
  2. ChicagoJ

    ChicagoJ Grand Pooh-Bah (5,247) Feb 2, 2015 Illinois
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    As a whole, these changes are solid and think we had good discussions and feedback the past week. Also glad there are no announced decay adjustments.

    Thanks for pointing out an example change regarding one rating of 5.0 across the board rating (3.94 is the adjusted score). This sets a solid threshold for most lists, though may skew results for some of the less popular styles which generate lower ”high scores” and/or lower rating counts than popular styles like IPAs, Imperial Stouts, etc. .

    Looking forward to seeing the adjustments to my two “home” state lists (Illinois & Nevada), plus any significant changes to California and the top National and Top 250 lists.

    Since the Top 250 seems to be the most sensitive list for BA as a whole, perhaps an archive link or a cut and paste the final list generated under the old calculations would be helpful to allow BAs chasing the list to compare with the updated list.

    Cheers!
     
  3. Todd

    Todd Founder (13,518) Aug 23, 1996 Finland
    STAFF Mod Team Society Pooh-Bah

    No problem. I’ll pull this together later this week.
     
  4. Todd

    Todd Founder (13,518) Aug 23, 1996 Finland
    STAFF Mod Team Society Pooh-Bah

    Update: There was a bug with calcluating the number of inactive beers. Fixes have been applied and numbers will update in a couple of hours.
     
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  5. Todd

    Todd Founder (13,518) Aug 23, 1996 Finland
    STAFF Mod Team Society Pooh-Bah

    Update: For beers under the min, we slightly reduce the beer's weighted rank based on the difference between the min and the number of ratings the beer has. This is experimental and may adjust over time based on feedback and further testing, but it should help soften the impact of beers with only a handful of ratings.

    Rolling out now and should be complete in less than an hour.
     
  6. REVZEB

    REVZEB Grand High Pooh-Bah (7,686) Mar 28, 2013 Illinois
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    Good call! :beers:
     
  7. beer_beer

    beer_beer Pooh-Bah (2,306) Feb 13, 2018 Finland
    Society Pooh-Bah

    Good work, NA is thanking!
     
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  8. Harrison8

    Harrison8 Grand High Pooh-Bah (6,285) Dec 6, 2015 Missouri
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    The lack of BA ratings to so, so many beer listings has been a complaint of mine for along time. I think this is a step in the correct direction. The weighting probably needs to get adjusted, as a local IPA that I'd consider "okay" at best landed in "good" alongside a local IPA that I would consider "very good" or "exceptional".

    If anything, it's more reason I should drop my 'okay' ratings much, much lower to land them in the "okay" category.
     
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  9. 2beerdogs

    2beerdogs Grand Pooh-Bah (5,682) Jan 31, 2005 California
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    Love this.
     
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  10. 2beerdogs

    2beerdogs Grand Pooh-Bah (5,682) Jan 31, 2005 California
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    Really good stuff. I hope this work will pay off for you and the mods going forward, like less updates sent from members regarding some of the updates we send you on beers, etc...
     
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  11. TrojanRB

    TrojanRB Grand Pooh-Bah (3,779) Jul 27, 2013 Texas
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    I think these are good directional changes that might require some refinement over time. A little evolution never hurt anyone!
     
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  12. JohnniEMc

    JohnniEMc Pooh-Bah (2,360) Sep 5, 2015 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    All good
     
  13. heymikew

    heymikew Pooh-Bah (2,685) Mar 18, 2011 California
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah

    I concur with the changes.
     
  14. Pivopijak

    Pivopijak Pooh-Bah (2,497) Jun 7, 2019 Washington
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah

    Great idea to up the threshold for inactives, as I have gone to numerous brewery tap rooms and reviewed many "retired" beers. My main objective when reviewing beers and places is to help beer lovers decide where to go and what to try, when traveling, so internet maps aren't the only research resource. Most people reviewing on those internet map pages are more interested in food and atmosphere than beer.
     
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  15. ronniebruner

    ronniebruner Savant (1,100) Jul 3, 2010 Arizona

    I like this idea! I been on BA now for 15 years!
     
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  16. bret27

    bret27 Grand Pooh-Bah (3,064) Mar 10, 2009 California
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Is this why I’m seeing brandy ba darklord w/vanilla beans show up on the top 250?

    As far as I can tell it was brewed once in 2011. unless there’s something I’m missing?(which is always a likely possibility)
     
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  17. Todd

    Todd Founder (13,518) Aug 23, 1996 Finland
    STAFF Mod Team Society Pooh-Bah

    I took care of this, but submitting a report for entries like this allows the mod team to quickly retire beers that are discontinued/no longer brewed.
     
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  18. bret27

    bret27 Grand Pooh-Bah (3,064) Mar 10, 2009 California
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Thanks.
    Honestly wasn’t sure if it was something I was missing. Will do this in the future when unsure.
     
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  19. Bhubbard34

    Bhubbard34 Pooh-Bah (2,585) Mar 4, 2016 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    But this one shouldn’t be retired….theyve announced brandy vanilla as a variant this year….releasing in May at Dark Lord Day. So no longer retired correct?

    [​IMG]
     
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  20. Bhubbard34

    Bhubbard34 Pooh-Bah (2,585) Mar 4, 2016 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah Trader

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