Fellner's Canteen in Kenilworth NJ put it on draught in the late 70's replacing Rheingold Extra Dry : an even trade for me.
Pabst Dark draft until the mid-70s was very good. At the time Pabst Bock was canned for springtime, and had a slightly sweeter flavor that I didn't like too much. Around 1980 they brought out a bottled Pabst Special Dark which I never tried, but claimed to be a lighter dark beer. This might be the draft beer that @BJC encountered in NJ. Most dark lagers I had at the time were pretty insipid (Blitz Bavarian Dark bottles, Lucky Bock cans, Walter's, WI, dark draft, Old Chicago Dark . . . ). The packaged midwestern bocks were generally forgettable. Blitz's Henry's Dark and Heidelberg Alt dark were both OK. Huber's Augsburger Dark and Bock were the pick of the domestic lot that I tried. German standouts for me were Ritterbrau Dortmunder and Pschorr Brau Muenchner darks.
Even the watered down dark lagers of the past still have to be better than the mainstream light lagers of today? I would think? I didn't really start drinking beer regularly until about 1990, so I missed out on the "oldies."
An early Zymurgy has @mactrail's description of our Portland bar tour tasting the draft darks of the time. A description of Falstaff Dark as "foul stuff" was cut by the editors. It's hard to say if they'd be preferable to todays AALs I avoid the mainstream AALs of today at all costs. Just a matter of preference (but over a 50 year time span??) Compared to the pale AALs of the 70s, many were no upgrade. Realizing the truth, my old roommate called them Pizza Parlor Dark. So sometimes the darks were even more disappointing than the regular AALs. I suspect a lot of them were made without the benefit of roasted malt. The slightly sweet (?) caramel colorings may have covered up some of the malt body and hop bitterness. Others may have used roasted malt, but not enough to make a big difference. I'd say that Pabst and Huber used a good amount of roasted malt. I'd imagine AB did for its dark drafts, but I never ran across one.
Okay, okay, I know I have denied it in the past, but it's my fault, I admit it. A little over six years ago due to my health Doc made me stop buying beer. I had no idea this would cause such disruption to the industry, but apparently it has, and now I admit my part in it, and I apologize.
I feel you aren't the only one. I've cut back considerably, but not to the extent that you have. So I might not have the heavy responsibility you do. But I did apologize once to a nearby small brewery owner for not showing up enough to buy a beer and take home a growler.
I would think so, but it's hard to say. We definitely felt Pabst bock and dark were superior to the AALs available at the time (this would have been around 76 and 77), but they were no great shakes, so that's hardly saying anything. As @moodenba alluded to, they did have a bit more caramel and malt flavor then Coors Banquet, MHL, Bud and michelob. We were pretty much starved for good beer where I was living in the 70's (NorCal), so pretty much anything with even the smallest modicum of flavor seemed rich and robust by comparison.
Oh man, with both of us cutting back so drastically it's amazing more NYS breweries haven't gone under.
In your area most breweries are selling seltzers? At least locally, only a few sell them. And regionally and nationally on my shelves I don't see many from breweries.
I see them on tasting room menus a lot, but I don't see that many distributed. I think the hard seltzer consumer is similar to the AAL consumer; they like to know what they're getting from a big brand. That being said, it's incredible the amount of shelf space that they've taken from beer in most stores in less than 10 years.
Expiration dates are not an issue. Markups could be higher due to lower production costs. Most important, consumers drink a lot of the stuff.
I have 2 next to me that always has them on tap and in cans to go. The third has not seen any cans in their cooler, but may have one on tap. All 3 are known for its IPA’s, lagers/pils, stouts and one for its farmhouse style/belgian styles. 4 Boys is probably doing seltzers these days. Not sure about Flashpoint. I don’t go to the last 2 mentioned. Yup, the seltzers are the number one sellers over all beer styles. Go figure. I’m sure this trend will die down and some new zeltser will be the new drink.
Hard seltzers are still selling well but not in comparison to overall beer sales. From the internet: “While hard seltzer experienced explosive growth initially, beer still dominates the overall alcohol market in sales volume. Although hard seltzer sales soared in 2019 and 2020, reaching $4.1 billion, that figure pales in comparison to the $88 billion beer market. Even with a slowdown in hard seltzer growth, it has carved out a noticeable share of the beer market, but beer remains the leading alcoholic beverage by a significant margin. Here's a more detailed breakdown: Beer: In 2023, roughly 192 million barrels (31 gallons each) of beer were consumed in the US. Hard Seltzer: Sales peaked in 2020, reaching $4.1 billion, but growth has since slowed. Market Share: While hard seltzers have captured a portion of the beer market, with some estimates showing they account for 7.4% of total beer volume and 9.5% of dollar sales in chain retail stores, beer remains the dominant force.” Cheers!
Are you sure about these figures Jack? Even if this is just adults in the US, that number seems awfully high. Taking into account that there are many Americans who don't drink at all, many more who simply don't like the taste of beer (my wife for example), and those who are just "social" drinkers, that seems like a pretty high number. According to Mr. Google, current consumption is around 28.2 gallons per person per anum. Even that seems higher than I would have expected.
John, feel free to argue with the internet if you are so inclined: “In the United States, beer consumption is currently experiencing a decline, reaching its lowest point in over two decades. Specifically, beer shipments are predicted to fall below 200 million barrels in 2023, marking the lowest level since 1999. This downward trend is influenced by various factors, including changing consumer preferences towards other alcoholic and non-alcoholic beverages, as well as a decline in the popularity of certain traditional beer brands. Key Points: Overall Decline: U.S. beer consumption is at its lowest point since the late 1990s. Shipment Figures: Beer shipments are predicted to drop below 200 million barrels for the first time since 1999, according to Beer Marketer's Insights (BMI).” Cheers! P.S. As I have related to you on multiple occasions: "I am not a marketing guy".
I think a lot of breweries sell seltzers because people bring their families or friends to breweries and not everyone drinks beer. The seltzer is then consumed by the non-beer drinkers who tag along in a group. I think it is more egregious in grocery stores, as much as I do get annoyed by a tap being taken by a nonbeer.
I think if we look at the population growth in US from late 1990’s to today and apply the beer sales stats, the beers per person really tells a more accurate story on how much less people are drinking now adays.
A lot more beer choices today from locals whom have improved their beer making as a whole compared to 10+ years ago. But 80% of the local brewers just need to get out of the retail space game. I have a strong hunch that many of the local breweries that are going out of business last few years may be because they over leveraged their debt into investment in production sized brewing equipment to expand in retail space (where no one’s buying) thus crippling their profits from taproom success. And they can’t retract from retail production because no one is willing to buy their equipment and/or production space (at least not even close to the cost they bought it initially). Just my best guess here (with some insights from others in recent discussions).
Yeah, that's what I think as well. The brewpubs have cycled through American Wheat, Blonde Ale, Wits, Berliner Weisse and Gose, smoothie sours, and all the light lagers in an attempt to get the non-craft dollar, and now they're doing seltzers. Maybe something will stick someday.
