With all of the things happening in the craft beer world lately, how do you guys feel about the future of beer geeks? Breweries and, especially, top tier beer bars, are closing at an unprecedented rate, people in general seem less and less interested in all things beer in favor of a handful of types of beer, AND the next generation is just not that terribly interested in alcohol, how long is it before we see less and less people geeking it up about our favorite beverage? Let's face it, without seeing demographics, I feel like a LOT of the major participants here are over 40 and a great deal of those who were very passionate about craft beer have joined the realm of the professional, whether that's brewing beer or selling it, again leaving fewer and fewer candidates for beer geekdom, "in the wild". So . . . how do you guys feel about our hobby? Are you all "doom and gloom" or do you see it continuing into the future unabated?
There are fewer beer geeks today. I feel like the wild beer trading, beer share and long line days of pre-pandemic are much behind us. A lot of beer geekdom is being lost by virtue of how much better beer is today and how many more breweries there are today. Way back in the day, something like Sculpin or Two Hearted was a real treat in a city like New York, and people had to actively go out of their way to get such product. Then there was Heady Topper and Tree House and the like that had superlative quality, so you had to network and engage in the community to get quality beers. Today, each city has a load of breweries that are making top quality product, which obviates the need for a lot of interaction. I live in Philadelphia, and here it looks like breweries are still doing pretty well. Granted the crowds are older than what they used to be, but places like Wissahickon and Cartesian are often packed, even though they are hardly hyped breweries. I also have not noticed too many breweries in Philadelphia shutting down (even Iron Hill that went out of business because of private equity rather than because of interest) is back open in Center City. Further, a number of new breweries recently opened, so the outlook is pretty bright. Monk's Cafe, a true relic of the original craft beer boom in the 80s, is still regularly packed, which is a bright spot. I don't know how many 20-somethings are getting into beer seriously, but I am sure that there are still some. Generally, I think the community should be open and people should try to get other people interested if they want the scene to survive. Admitted, I am not great at this, and I am still looking for a group of like-minded individuals in Philadelphia to keep the community aspect alive for me, but I think that is ultimately the key. The hobby has to be shared with others. Also, maybe $10 for a beer is a tough entry point for many... in today's economy.
$10 for a beer is tough in just about any economy. I can afford it, but I don't want to pay that much for a pint of something I've never had before, regardless of how highly rated it is. That's why my gf and I are always checking out flights. Sure, the per ounce price is higher. But the odds we'll find something we like is higher, too. My mid-20s son is becoming a beer geek largely on his own, but he's an exception. Most kids his age don't care so much if it's "beer" so long as it's cheap, tastes good, and gives them a buzz. And that's OK. I don't think good breweries will go completely out of business. And if the "craft" offerings do disappear, I'll stick with large breweries that make good products. I'm a BEER Advocate, not a "craft beer" advocate.
The expense of craft beer has always and will always keep it primarily the provenance of 30+ year-olds. It's not a concern that 20 somethings generally aren't into craft beer. Once they become professionals and have some cash, they will start figuring out how terrible the alcohol they've been drinking is and move up to better things, whether that be beer, wine, or the hard stuff.
So you'd say that availability of great beer is kind of a double edged sword? In that it doesn't force people to interact? I like this thought, but I also feel like it's trying to help people at the gym. It doesn't work unless they're open to it and most, in my experience, aren't. True dat.
That definitely made me lol, but it's not like that's the only thing headed south. I feel like the overall direction of craft beer is negative. More breweries? Sure. More availability? Sure. More cutting edge and/or interesting styles/types of beer? Nope. More breweries stepping outside of their comfort zone? Na. More interest in the history of beer and brewing and historical styles of beer? Not that I've seen. Guess you have to take the good with the bad?
I feel like with anything there will always be people who are devoted, committed and genuinely interested as long as there is widely available access. For most people I know craft beer is the norm and at every event people are drinking IPAs or porters and stouts, the occasional amber style, etc. So long as there are options available on tap at the bar and available in restaurants and stores then there will always be beer fans and craft beer geeks who appreciate the history and variety of styles.
See, I think that the emphasis on "innovation" for innovation's sake is a losing proposition for beer broadly. The inevitable conclusion of it is these smoothie sours and milkshake stouts that are effectively only beer by a narrow legal/taxation definition. Does growth in "beer interest" really count if the interest is in fruit juice and chocolate syrup that are alcoholic? I wonder about this. I do feel like there's a real growth in the appreciation of old world lagers lately, with authentic attempts at Pilsner and various other Czech styles becoming much more popular. Outside of that, it's always been a niche of a niche but I dont think its really going away.
If things level off to a sustainable level, I’m OK with that. I was never on board with the more ridiculous aspects of beer geek culture—the truck chasers, limited releases, lines, raffles, exclusive societies etc.—all of which was fueled by a FOMO beer bro mindset. Hopefully we will continue to see a healthy mix of interesting new styles, tried and true classics, and enough limited barrel-aged offerings to maintain a ready supply of special-occasion beers. Around here I feel like things have calmed down since the high water mark of beer insanity, but it’s not like it’s ever difficult to find some excellent beer to drink.
I would certainly agree . . . . . . . . but I'm going to split some hairs with you now. I don't think that a lot of the things going on in craft beer are as much innovation as they are just pure bastardization. Those things that you mention are ridiculous caricatures of flavors already present in the "real beer" versions. While I certainly like the lager-centricity going on in craft beer lately. I don't really find it to be increasing the diversity of beers produced, as a lot of them tend to be different in name only.
Agreed. Outside of finding things to talk to you all about, I'm pretty happy with craft beer at the moment, as I can find just about everything that I like with relative ease. Here too.
I guess I'm really not sure what you mean by innovation then? If we're sticking to a relatively traditional menu of ingredients then what exactly are you expecting brewers to innovate on? I'm also confused about why you're bringing up diversity of beers in regards to historic styles. More for the sake of more isnt a healthy culture. Theres nothing sustainable about it. Beer, historically, was consumed in the form of a small handful of styles that changed depending on your location and the time of year. Trying to constantly serve up something "new" to cater to novelty obsessed consumers isnt a recipe for a lasting culture
Maybe not endangered, but it does feel like a trend that's aging out. Not beer on the whole per se, but I'm not seeing a whole lot of younger faces in the local tasting rooms or beer-centric bars/restaurants. GABF has been an unc-fest for a while. Obviously younger folks still buying beer to some degree, but they aren't as enthusiastic about it. That might be one of the the things driving the commoditization of beer on the whole. They don't care much about anything being unique or special, they just want an acceptable version of style X.
I see innovation as something like the following: using a Belgian yeast in an otherwise American IPA or stout recipe or, and I've never heard of anyone doing this, doing a double decoction mash on an IIPA. Because I feel like all of these "different" pilsners that people are producing really aren't that different when it comes right down to it. Agreed.
In a roundabout way, my short answer is old beer geeks are becoming Neanderthals. I am 66 and I had my first craft beer in 1987. Really enjoyed the 90's and the 00's. But the onslaught of hazy IPAs and flavored beer of the last few years does not interest me and I find it hard to give any of that a fair shake. My son is 30 and I've tried to get him interested in classic craft beers but he only prefers IPAs. He is indicative of the younger crowd that is spending money to buy beer. I've tried to help him distinguish subtleties but he just doesn't get it. He wants a big IPA. I've taken him to brew pubs where I ordered an ESB, Abbey Tripel, or Old Ale and offered a sip but he always orders an IPA on the beer menu. Drinkers under 40 are the big spenders and brewers cater to them to pay their bills and these young consumers seem less interested in the look, aroma, and mouthfeel and only care about whether the hops are explosive. I guess in a weird sort of way, they are HOP geeks rather than craft beer geeks.
