Averagely Perfect Saison - Poll #15 - Non-Pilsner Malt General Election

Flaked Wheat and Vienna.

 

I haven't been all that involved, but on this one I'd have to say flaked wheat and vienna sounds pretty tasty

 

Flaked wheat for body, head retention and to help feed the brett.

 

I went with flaked wheat and unmalted oats, thinking the complexities of adding unmalted grains would be helpful for giving the brett something to chew on. However, I have minimal brett experience and have never used this strain, which reportedly may not be brett. My reasoning may be flawed by false assumption. But that's why we brew the beers, right?

 

flaked wheat and unmalted oats for me. I'll bet some Vienna would be nice as well, but I don't want a "complicated" grain bill.

 

None of the Above . . . until someone comes up with a more convincing reason.

 

I may have to switch. I voted to wheat only, doesnt look that is going to win.

 

Wheat voters unite behind flaked or wheat malt?

 

Looks like Flaked is already out to a big lead with 23 votes (whether alone or in combination with others) vs 9 for wheat malt. I would consider jumping from malt to flaked in your respective grouping to try to boost it.

 

What, no Oat Malt?

 

Given that Saison DuPont is 100% Dingemans Pilsen, it's hard to argue with you here. On the other hand, I don't think there is a bad combination left up on that board either.

 

Saison DuPont might have been the model for this beer, if we hadn't opted for a Brett saison. Having opted to add Brett and sacch strains, we then chose a strain that might not be Brett (B. trois) . If it behaves like Brett, than some unmodified grain should give it something to chew on even though the sacch might do the bulk of the fermenting. I never brewed with trois, so this argument should not necessarily convince @PortLargo , but perhaps he can convince me that it is a bad argument, and I can change my vote.

 

Fair question. My experience with Brett is limited. I've pitched Orval dregs at bottling and it took a 1.002 beer (3724) even lower. Recently had Brett trois as primary yeast and it had 82%AÀ in two weeks. My conclusion: Brett will eat anything/everything ... just like 3724. Will an unmalted grain provide anything different? Supposedly Brett ferments long chain saccharides when Sacch has gone to sleep. What will flaked wheat give us that's not in Pils (other than haziness)? Brett experts chime in here.

Wheat (malted) has not helped my Saisons with better head, Munich and rye have added less than straight Pils.

I have real concerns we can't stop this beer at 1.002. We're starting low at 1.045 and using super attenuating yeasts. For @VikeMan, how's your Brewcipher algorithm for these two strains and this OG? Will it adjust for unmalted grains?

 

@PortLargo as I stated in previous polls, unmalted wheat will add back proteins which give body. Unlike longer chain saccharides, these won't be broken down and consumed.

 

This could be a good opportunity to collect data, at least about the strain being used. Not sure how mixing strains and timing of yeast additions might factor into things. Could be that the final attenuation is sensitive to which strains are mixed and the timing of that mixture. I guess when talking about Brett, the time to FG might be longer than the time frames usually considered for these things.

 

Agree, in my witbiers I see some increase in body at the 30% level and this beer needs body. Do you advocate a protein rest to make medium-chain proteins? What percentage flaked wheat?

 

I use Flaked Wheat in my American Sour that took BOS for body, haze, and approximating "Lambic", single infusion, 17% FW by weight. Has a good body to it for finishing at 1.000 and 7.2% ABV. Primary yeast is wild Sacc and Brett (which doesn't create glycerol which adds body as well).

 

I dont think this beer will be at 1.002.. I see 1.000 being what happens, IMO.

I'm okay with that, so I wanted something to hold back a LITTLE body. I'm not a fan of overly robust feeling saisons.

This one should be light, and refreshing.