The 750 Saison

Discussion in 'Beer Talk' started by zid, Jun 26, 2016.

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  1. zid

    zid Grand Pooh-Bah (3,132) Feb 15, 2010 New York
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    [​IMG]

    Saint Somewhere and Jester King - Bouteille Vert

    This beer was brewed with orange blossom honey.

    Carbonation was very low by modern expectations with the style. This beer was an expression of subtlety and gentleness, and as a result, it was one of the most refreshing saisons I've had. The beer was a little hazy. At 5%, it was right in the sweet spot between Dupont and a table beer... and that's a lovely spot to be in if the brewer gets it right. The brewers get it right with this one. The refreshing aspect of this beer does not come with a sacrifice in personality. The personality is there, but it's a quite one. The bready malt and hops are perfectly balanced and the contribution from the yeast is perfectly measured. There's a subtle tartness but it's completely integrated with the beer. Honey is one of those ingredients that people will claim they taste if they are expecting it... even if any honey flavor shouldn't be in the finished product. I did not get any honey, but if I was trying to find some I probably would have fallen into the same trap I just described. I wish there was more beer in this bottle. Yikes!

    Bouteille Vert translates to "green bottle." I'll quote a blurb on the label:

    I did think it was worth quoting this bottle, but I do not want to jeopardize the thread by bringing up something controversial. Jester King's thoughts on the matter have been discussed here before. Glass matters, but the beer in the glass matters more, and the Bouteille Vert in this bouteille vert was beautiful.

    Cheers.
     
    #201 zid, Jul 18, 2016
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  2. zid

    zid Grand Pooh-Bah (3,132) Feb 15, 2010 New York
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    I forgot to mention in my last post that Bouteille Vert probably has a connection to Dupont's Biere de Miel... which translates to "honey beer."
    [​IMG]
    Jester King has made a beer of their own that they call Biere de Miel. I see this activity as an attempt to cover the Dupont spectrum. Not everyone considers this Dupont beer to be a saison. Dupont's beer dates back to when the brewery was known as Rimaux-De Ridder. Dupont brought this one back in '97. The beautiful and evocative art on the bottle (as seen above) is a replica of the original.
     
    #202 zid, Jul 18, 2016
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  3. utopiajane

    utopiajane Grand Pooh-Bah (3,982) Jun 11, 2013 New York
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    Wonderful! Thank you for the primer on the difference between the styles. when I go out next time I will be looking for grisette and bier de garde/bier de mars as well.
     
    #203 utopiajane, Jul 18, 2016
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  4. utopiajane

    utopiajane Grand Pooh-Bah (3,982) Jun 11, 2013 New York
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    the only two I have found were american, smuttynose and southampton.
     
    #204 utopiajane, Jul 18, 2016
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  5. zid

    zid Grand Pooh-Bah (3,132) Feb 15, 2010 New York
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    [​IMG]

    Saint Somewhere / Brasserie Thiriez / Brasserie de la Senne / Brasserie de Blaugies - Fraternite

    Is this the greatest saison supergroup of all time or a Shelton Brothers Floridian team building exercise? Either way, this isn't to be missed.

    I'm guessing this is a pic from the event:
    [​IMG]

    We've seen most of these brewers in the thread already - with the exception of Yvan De Baets from Brasserie de la Senne (on the right of the pic). Why haven't we seen them yet - because they don't use 750 bottles... and bless them for it. They make really fantastic beer and Yvan De Baets is considered one of the true authorities on saison.

    This beer couldn't possibly be more than the sum of its brewer parts, and naturally it isn't. It is a great saison in the European mold. The "plant-like" bitterness is very strong... but it doesn't quite work in the way that it does in the best examples. I can't say that this beer was worth the hefty price, but I'm very glad I had a bottle.
     
    #205 zid, Jul 19, 2016
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  6. Jacobier10

    Jacobier10 Grand Pooh-Bah (3,102) Feb 23, 2004 New Jersey
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    This thread persuaded me to revisit Brooklyn Sorachi Ace. I've had it before but it's been a few years. I opted for a 4-pack of 12 oz bottles, although it is also available in a 750 mL.

    This beer is driven by hops and is named after the only hop variety used in it. After some quick research, it seems that it might have also been brewed at one time with Perle hops. However, Brooklyn's website only lists Sorachi Ace hops. Other ingredients are German pilsner malt, a house Belgian yeast for primary fermentation and champagne yeast for secondary fermentation.

    [​IMG]

    It's straw colored and hazy with a large, fluffy white head on top. Good retention and some lacing on the glass. A punchy aroma starts things off with a bang. Coriander and lemon initially, then bright peppery spice gets your attention. Almost perfumy or floral in a way. Tasting it brings out a strong lemongrass flavor, not unlike a Thai tom yum or Vietnamese pho soup. Long aftertaste with a heavy, spicy, and dry finish. Medium-light bodied with lively carbonation that gives it an effervescent quality.

    This is a unique Saison, even for a style that is so open to interpretation. The flavors are bold and intense, which makes this beer great, but also causes me to want to move on to something else after one bottle; unlike something lighter like a table beer, which I could drink all day and night.
     
    #206 Jacobier10, Jul 19, 2016
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  7. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
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    Did you perceive any flavors of dill in that beer?

    Cheers!
     
    #207 JackHorzempa, Jul 19, 2016
  8. Jacobier10

    Jacobier10 Grand Pooh-Bah (3,102) Feb 23, 2004 New Jersey
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    Just going off of memory, no, I did not. But it certainly was aromatic and had a strong herbal/floral quality to it, so I see how dill could be perceivable. I have one bottle left from the 4-pack which I will probably have sometime this week, possibly tonight. I'll see if I can pick out any dill in that one.
     
    #208 Jacobier10, Jul 19, 2016
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  9. samuraichamploo

    samuraichamploo Initiate (0) Jun 6, 2013 New York

    Awesome: Love Buzz. The first saison I ever had.
    And happy to see Transmitter making an appearance.

    Love this thread.
     
    #209 samuraichamploo, Jul 20, 2016
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  10. cjgiant

    cjgiant Grand High Pooh-Bah (6,584) Jul 13, 2013 District of Columbia
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    I went ahead and grabbed a 750 Saison for this thread, though I thought I'd finish off the last bottle of a beer similar to some of those @zid started with. I had reviewed this for New Beer Sunday (week 590) a couple weeks back.

    [​IMG]

    This beer continues in DFH (and Sam Calagione) idea of having beers that pair with food. Here is a video the brewery did for the release of this beer that explains this:


    On that Sunday, I compared this beer to Saison Du Buff (Stone this year) and found more Saison characterstics in this beer because of it.

    A couple weeks removed and I am still finding I enjoy this beer. It starts off smoother and more full on the palate than I expect from a Saison - maybe the wheat? But the yeast notes come along fairly quickly along with the additives. A nice biting spice - at times herbal but mostly peppery - carries to the end. As I said, the Saison flavor component is not lost with this beer, but it isn't too traditional, as I understand it. Of course, it isn't meant to be.

    This could possibly get back into the question of, "What style is this?" Not sure if wheat and rye have any historic place in Saisons any more than marjoram and bay leaves (Although a quick search yielded something that said "not outside the bounds"). I'd be interested if anyone had more information they'd like to share.

    Either way, DFH is trying to do a classic saison here, but I think they do a decent job keeping it a decent part of the profile (in fact, I thought this year's Saison Du Buff tastes more like a pale ale - though it did have a little age on it as well).
     
    #210 cjgiant, Jul 20, 2016
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  11. Crusader

    Crusader Pooh-Bah (1,725) Feb 4, 2011 Sweden
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    For anyone who happens to be able to read French I think this book will be of interest.
     
    #211 Crusader, Jul 20, 2016
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  12. zid

    zid Grand Pooh-Bah (3,132) Feb 15, 2010 New York
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    I was excited to see you post here even though I can't read French. :slight_smile:
     
    #212 zid, Jul 20, 2016
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  13. Crusader

    Crusader Pooh-Bah (1,725) Feb 4, 2011 Sweden
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    I've enjoyed reading the thread so far and it gave me an excuse to look up some books on Belgian/French brewing. I figured someone in the thread might have taken French classes back in the day, I opted for German :stuck_out_tongue:.
     
    #213 Crusader, Jul 20, 2016
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  14. cjgiant

    cjgiant Grand High Pooh-Bah (6,584) Jul 13, 2013 District of Columbia
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    Can't Google run the Google book through Google Translate and help us poor Americans? :grinning:
     
    #214 cjgiant, Jul 20, 2016
  15. utopiajane

    utopiajane Grand Pooh-Bah (3,982) Jun 11, 2013 New York
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    I liked the lavender in this myself. Very nice review. =)
     
    #215 utopiajane, Jul 21, 2016
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  16. azurel

    azurel Initiate (0) May 27, 2016 Michigan

    What an excellent thread...Having only dabbled in saisons this thread is an excellent road map to dabble even more...Thanks for posting.
     
    #216 azurel, Jul 21, 2016
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  17. zid

    zid Grand Pooh-Bah (3,132) Feb 15, 2010 New York
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    As I mentioned in another post, the current brewmaster at Two Roads was the brewmaster at Southampton. I see him as a real ambassador for biere de garde in America. I've had the Holiday Ale and it really didn't do anything for me... BUT, it's because I'm not really a fan of the style. I hope they continue to produce this beer and I would love to give it another shot. @utopiajane , if you are referring to Southampton's Biere de Mars, even though I'm not one for the style, I'm even more appreciative of this offering simply because it is in a six pack. In that format, it's a real standout (along with the Two Brothers flagship). There's barely anything else like it in the market. I see why it isn't a popular style, but the scarcity of it really highlights the sameness on our shelves. I haven't had the Southampton 750 Biere de Garde, but I bet any bottles of that are pretty old. The beer stores on Long Island claim that the distributor isn't carrying Southampton 750s anymore... and Southampton is on Long Island (those 750s aren't brewed on the island, but still...) I haven't had a biere de garde from Smuttynose. It's funny how many saisons they produce. If you mean their Smistletoe, there's fruit and whatnot in that one.
     
    #217 zid, Jul 22, 2016
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  18. utopiajane

    utopiajane Grand Pooh-Bah (3,982) Jun 11, 2013 New York
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    I did not get to the shop but I did get the last 4 pack of tank 7 at wegman's so see you in a few hours.
     
    #218 utopiajane, Jul 22, 2016
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  19. Urk1127

    Urk1127 Grand Pooh-Bah (3,790) Jul 2, 2014 New Jersey
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    Patiently waiting Schlafly De Garde :wink::slight_smile:

    But as you said, its probably way overdue. I just want to see if theres floaters in it lol.

    @zid
     
    #219 Urk1127, Jul 22, 2016
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  20. zid

    zid Grand Pooh-Bah (3,132) Feb 15, 2010 New York
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    Go back a page. :slight_smile: No floaties.
    (I had to include the Schlafly Biere de Garde because I think their kolsch is a damn grand slam.)
     
    #220 zid, Jul 22, 2016
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