Blending Windsor with another yeast for better attenuation?

It's a fine idea. Just pitch the windsor first and the second yeast after fermentation has slowed down. Most flavor and aroma compounds are produced in the first few days of fermentation.

You could also just use Fermentis S-04, which is a pretty well attenuating English yeast. I think a few NE breweries use it or similar.

 

I've done this, Windsor with Notty at the same time. It works. However I wonder if the Windsor really does much of anything since it quits so dang quickly compared to whatever other yeast you add. Might save yourself some cash possibly by just choosing a moderately attenuative yeast like S-04 or something like that. Notty and US-05 are very high attenuators, which is fine if that's what you want, but maybe you don't. Up to you. It's all good.

 

Fermentis S-04 may be flocculant but it will result in a hazy beer if you brew a "NE" style IPA.

I used S-04 to brew my version of a Trillium Galaxy Fort Point Pale Ale and that beer came out very hazy (see photograph below).

FWIW I am not personally convinced that "NE" style IPAs are hazy due to yeast in suspension.

I would very highly recommend S-04 for your batch of beer.

Cheers!

 

The haze should come from massive use of late hops, and nothing more. People who use hazy yeast or add flour are missing the point entirely.

 

That answer to that question is hotly debated. Read this thread when you have a few hours...
https://www.beeradvocate.com/community/threads/northeast-pales-ipa-dipa.319817/

 

I once brewed an American IPA using a combination of Windsor and Nottingham. It was a very good beer and I can't take the credit. I intended to use S-05 but accidents and mistakes led to this alternate blend of yeasts. It attenuated from 1.062 to 1.010. Since I only did this 1x, I hesitate to leap to conclusions, but I believe I did get some muted expression of the flavors and aromas that Windsor brings to the table, and the Nottingham probably helped with the attenuation.

 

If you want yeast haze then use us-05 with it as it is an atrocious floculator.

 

Interesting. I've never brewed a NE IPA, and I'm familiar with the haze debate, but I always assumed that using a less flocculant yeast or just simply rushing through the primary on a flocculant strain contributed in part. I used to use S04 a lot a long time ago and can vouch that it flocs extremely hard and fast. I would be willing to bet that it is contributing nothing to the haze in your beer.

 

For my taste I did not like a Windsor IPA. Made 2 just to be sure. I'd use the notty and use a lot of FO, whirlpool and dry hop additions with the notty

 

Yeah…think a lot of people are missing what potentially is really happening with these beers. My theory goes something like this: Poor flocculatting yeast like US-05 actually clears the beer up a lot faster than a highly flocc'ing yeast like Wyeast 1318. The haze is really a protein-polyphenol complex, that I believe a yeast like US-05 will strip out of the beer because it's slow flocc'ing allows the protein-polyphenol complex to attach to yeast and get dragged out. But a strain like 1318 which will flocc quickly won't strip out and it will only eventually get dragged out of suspension by gravity which can takes months, instead of weeks like the yeast-protein-polyphenol interactions you get when using US-05 (more on this in the Oct issue of BYO...)

To the OP…personally I'm a big fan of Notty in these beers.

 

I posted my thoughts on this topic in a past thread: https://www.beeradvocate.com/commun...uicy-and-hazy-ipas.448537/page-3#post-5009223

The executive summary was:

“So, in a nutshell my theory is that the haze of the so called “NE” style IPA is a combination of proteins and polyphenols: protein-polyphenol.”

You can read Dave’s (@telejunkie) theory on why haze is exacerbated by using highly flocculent yeast strains in his post in this thread.

Cheers!

 

Well, Dave Green posted his theory that the fact that S-04 (and WY1318, WLP007,WY1098,...) are highly flocculant is the reason why the so called "NE" style IPAs are hazy.

Cheers!

 

Thanks for the info! Interesting reading.

 

I agree with jack on the US04 for this style. Don't use any fining agents with this yeast and you should have enough haze if that is what you want. I do not worry too much either way. I just want my beer to taste good. Take care.

 

Nice hypothesis. Is there strong evidence that the haze is protein-polyphenol complex? Because I have heard different people say they different things about the contribution of suspended yeast to the haze, e.g., high cell counts, low cell counts, etc. My own two batches with 1318 did not clear up completely with time, maybe suggesting more at play than yeast, but I have done no cell counts.

 

there is pretty strong evidence from some of the popular commercial beers in this hazy IPA category…but these beers are unfiltered and some yeast will make it into the finished product so there definitely with be a decent cell count. But from my understanding, if you took a cell count with US-05 vs. 1318 7 days post brew date, the US-05 cell count would be quite a bit higher.