WTF is an NEIPA?

I said some examples. I have brewed the style several times and could probably tell you things about the style you have never thought about.

 

You may be surprised what I know about the style Wow, you're an assumptive dude. Guess you don't meet a lot of chicks who know other brewers, then.

 

I suppose that goes both ways. You imply that only neipa can be brewed in new england, you assume I know nothing of the style. The fact remains that there are brewers across the country making examples of the style that are wonderful, and there are more out there adding shit to their beer to make it hazy, and yet others rushing their beers and packaging with yeast in suspension.
Also, not sure what meeting women has to do with anything, must be an east coast thing.
But let's touch on some hallmarks of the NEIPA. Water profile is high on chlorides, low on sulfates, more along the lines of a stout water profile. Grists are usually simple, pale malt or pilsner malt for a base with a high percentage of adjuncts, usually wheat or oats of the flaked variety, and a touch of crystal or honey malt. Mash temps vary, I am curious about using higher temps to net a more starchy body. Hop schedules are biased towards flameout hops, with some examples relying solely on post boil additions for all hop flavor and aroma. Hop varieties typically lean towards the fruity and tropical hops such as mosaic, galaxy, citra, nelson, or the dank varieties such as columbus and simcoe. Yeast choice is vital, most people assume the yeast is a low flocculating one, but the most popular yeast strains are quick fermenting ester producing strains that are known for allowing biotransformations of hop oils during fermentation. Linanool seems to be the component that is changed into citranol, but I wish there was more research into this fermentation magic. For this reason most brewrts will dryhop multiple times, with some brewers going so far as to dryhop at the same time as they pitch their yeast in an attempt to maximize yeast hop interactions. Packaging the product with minimal oxygen ingress is key, and consuming these beers fresh is key. The haze comes from a few key process derived polyphenols if done right, but again, some brewers insist on packaging with yeast in suspension while others add haze inducing components such as pectin and flour. The former veers are delicious while the later yeast slurries and flour bombs are swill.
pretty sure this answers the op.

 

SFACRKnight PhD

 

Really good overview. One thing however is that is is geraniol that gets transformed into citronellol and linalool gets transformed into terpineol. In my beers, I use hop oils that have high geraniol content to max out the citronellol. Linalool is less volatile, so I don't focus so much on linalool in my oil additions because most of my hop varieties already have significant amount of linalool that will be easily retained. In my brief studies with a gas chromatograph and tasting panel, it appeared that citronella that came from biotransformation tasted stronger than citronella in the same concentration coming from hops that without biotransformation.

 

For a minute there I thought you had become the Dr. Seuss of beer writing, then realized those were real terms....

 

More accurately, they are strains that have otherwise high-flocculation except under conditions where the wort has high polyphenol content.

Biotransformation is going to occur with any yeast strain and is a pretty generic term that basically means, "stuff that happens to chemicals during normal metabolic processes".

 

I’m still trying to find New England on the map.

 

See, under a slide these beers typically have no yeast in suspension, or no more yeast than other beers of various styles. @Tarheel4985 Had a nice writeup in Craft Beer and Brewing magazine that touched on the importance of a high flocculating strain. It seems the consensus right now is the yeast floccs out fast enough to not drag polyphenols with it, leaving the beer hazy. My guess is hop oils and proteins attract to each other and create a haze that is at stasis, in essence the oils buoyancy counteracts the proteins ability to drop out.
@honkey thanks for setting those oils straight. It was one in the morning and I wasn't motivated enough to look those up. Have you played with higher mash temps with these beers? I'm very curious about a higher mash temp after hearing about Lagunitas using it on the brülosophy podcast.

 

Maybe that is the consensus here on BA, but it is definitely not the consensus elsewhere.

For instance, if the haze is not yeast-driven, how does this explain the large amount of (yeast) sediment found in the vast majority of these beers after only a short time in the package?

 

See, here's where things get strange. Have you thrown some of that on a slide? I agree some beers have a bit of what appears to be yeast sludge in the cans. However most of the commercial examples I come across here do not, and the ones that do miss the mark in my book. But even if the yeast floccs out, the haze is permanent. Have you gone through my yeast experiment thread? After a few months the haze hadn't dropped in a 1318 beer vs a 1056 beer. I will admit both beets were packaged on yeast, but yeast in suspension doesn't seem to be the culprit.

 

I would agree, but only if you say "the ONLY culprit".

Explaining this situation is more complex than saying "it's one or the other".

 

Wanted to chime in about IBUs, which seem to be a sticking point here.
What if I where to tell you that everything you know about IBUs could be wrong?
Check out the Experimental Brewing Podcast! They have an episode where they test out how if the IBUs match the perception of bitterness. Episodes 32 and 33 on this link
https://www.experimentalbrew.com/podcast?page=4
Basically, I don't think IBUs/bitterness should be used to define the style. For instance, I would say that Trillium beers and generally more bitter than Tree House beers, but I would consider both "NE" style IPAs.

 

I'm skeptical.

IBUs are only one measure, as there are other contributing factors, because isomerized alpha acids are only responsible for a fraction of the bitterness of a beer.

 

Apparently you haven't read the "Floaties" thread over in Beer Talk.

https://www.beeradvocate.com/community/threads/floaties-like-or-dislike.542817/

 

Nope, didn't mean to imply that NEIPA is NE only- that's a misinterpretation. Actually, I'm fascinated by the spread and development of it throughout the world at this point and have studied how far it's gone and who all is making it. What I meant was just that being in the land of their supposed origin, I have had a whole shit-ton of NEIPAs from many different brewers (of varying skill and experience level) and not a single local one had flour in it. The only exception was that TH Milkshake beer, and it's not from the region. I don't even know of any other brewers who DO add it, though I've discussed the topic with experienced professional NEIPA brewers in order to understand why it would be done.

Also assuming that I think you know nothing of the style is quite wrong, and I'm not sure where you pulled that one from. I DO think (and was implying) that I'm more likely to have consumed many more varieties of the style than you, being here in NE where nearly every craft bar has at least one on tap (and also my having taken lots of regional beer-cations, and attending many bottle and beer shares with cross-country traders).

As for the female thing, well, that's my assuming that your talking down to me was gender-based, which honestly was probably more a sensitivity based on experience rather than your actual intention. Though, our prior interaction where you assumed that most hype craft drinkers are male and proceeded to speak for an area in which you don't reside definitely contributed to this.

It certainly seems that we aren't on the same page here, and I suspect that won't be changing any time soon. But I don't need to prove my knowledge to feel validated, I just like to converse with others who share the same level of interest in beer and enjoy poking holes in blanket statements from time to time. Because it IS silly to talk flour additions when we both know that it's hop suspensions that really define the NEIPA.

 

I feel we can agree that there are brewers who are making this style, using shortcuts, and trying to cash in on the hype. We can also agree I said some beers use flour. Lastly, I assumed you were a male due to the large amount of male participants on this forum. I am sure we can agree beer is good as well. Cheers!

 

They're EVERYWHERE, brah. Even if you're not in Vermont.

Umm . . . .

 

They are ubiquitous here in Denver. And we do them well, alpha bits beat out trill and treehouse in a blind taste test.

 

North East US, it's where you don't have giant earthquakes or fires. Wear your shades its where many of the superbowl rings and world series trophies are.