Oktoberfest Wiesn vs. Marzen

Somebody had the Paulaner weisn on WBAYDN yesterday. That's not available anywhere around here. I have the Paulaner märzen in my fridge and would love to be able to do a side by side comparison.
My Octoberfest visits were märzens in the late 70's, my understanding is that most of the beer served there now are weisns.
So far I've had oktoberfests from seven breweries this year, 4 have been märzen & 3 weisn styles. For me the märzens are “all afternoon & snacking on soft pretzels” beers while the weisns are “all day & eating half-chickens” beers.

 

As I've discussed in the past they're surprisingly more similar than you'd think.

I recommend doing a blind side by side tasting.

While you can find amber Oktoberfests in Munich, all of the Oktoberfest beer served at the festival are pale Oktoberfests.

It's easier to distinguish between the two styles than it is to determine if a beer is an "American IPA" or a "New England IPA" in my opinion.

 

Put me down in camp “Keep them all in one category, please.”

I like being able to review my Oktoberfests all in one place rather than switching between two different substyles.

 

If I recall, I don't know the percentage off the top of my head, but Paulaner Marzen is something like 30% Pilsner, 70% Munich malt... While Weisn is the inverse, at 30% Munich, 70% Pilsner.

 

The BJCP and European Beer Stat Awards have different categories for Festbier and Märzen, so the Brewers Association guidelines are not an outlier.

 

Then we'll need an Imperial of each, maybe a Brut of each, maybe a hazy of each, maybe in addition to the German, an American of each, maybe ...

Keep going and what was once 1 style becomes 30+ Yippee!

 

Should we put Vienna lagers and Helles into one category as well?

I know this was likely meant to be tongue-in-cheek, but the Germans just straight up have different style names for the "single" versions.

At least for the pale style anyways with a Helles. I suppose you could argue the Vienna lager being akin to the amber Oktoberfests part, as I've had far less Vienna lagers than I have Helles, so I'm less familiar with the style.

 

I often tell folks who are less experienced with the Vienna Lager style to view them as lower gravity (lower in alcohol) Amber Oktoberfest beers.

Because of this lower gravity aspect Vienna Lagers tend to have a greater 'drinkability' factor for my palate. YMMV.

Cheers!

 

I tend to prefer amber Märzens for a similar reason, and I don’t find problems with either style. Although I do notice that Vienna’s tend to be drier than Märzen. I suppose it makes sense, considering the identical origins between Dreher’s Vienna Lager and Sedlmayer’s Münchner Märzen.

It should be worth remembering that Märzen is not a color, but instead a strength-level between a normal-strength (~5% ABV) Vollbier and Starkbier such as Bocks. The Austrian brewery Hofstetten makes a Märzen called Hochzeitsbier apparently based on what the beer would’ve likely been served at the first Oktoberfest in 1810, and it is therefore a distinctively strong Dunkel.

Prost!

 

You are indeed correct here but I wonder how frequently the term of Märzen is utilized in this manner for German brewed beers. Have you ever seen a light colored German brewed beer of Märzen alcohol strength labeled using the word Märzen? For example Augustiner Edelstoff has an alcohol strength of 5.7% ABV but I have never seen the word Märzen on that beer's labeling.

If we take German beer rules out of the picture, beer drinkers typically associate the term of Märzen with Amber Oktoberfest beers.

Cheers!

 

I've often thought of Sam Adams Octoberfest as a higher gravity (albeit slightly now with it being 5.3%) Boston Lager.

And Boston Lager is considered by some (including the company in the past) as a Vienna Lager, and is labeled as such on this website (I don't think of it as a Vienna though).

https://www.beeradvocate.com/beer/profile/35/104/

When I was in Darmstadt last year in January a local brewery had a Märzen that I drank. It was amber colored but it also wasn't even close to Oktoberfest season.

 

I suspect that, as a niche style, Märzen is difficult to find at most breweries. As consumer preferences have gravitated towards pale lagers like Helles and Pilsner, I think Märzen has been discontinued or modified into the pale Wiesn beers today - and I think that the modern Wiesn style is a mere evolution of Märzen rather than something entirely new, especially as the strength has been maintained.

FWIW based on my observations in Austria, some smaller breweries continued to offered an amber, slightly-stronger lager called a Märzen, especially if their flagship was labeled as a Helles, as either a seasonal beer for the late summer and early autumn, or as a permanent part of their year-round lineup. One example of this is the Märzen made by Fischerbräu in Vienna. However, this picture becomes more complicated as Märzen in Austria is generally synonymous with Helles, being pale in color, balanced flavor, and around 5% ABV. That is totally unrelated to our discussion here though.

 

Depends if you’re drinking them while watching football

 

I like this idea, the Marzen could become more true to original style while a Festbier category could contain the pale outlier and such.

 

Schlenkerla Rauchbier Märzen is 5.4% and is darker than Amber in color, available year round.

 

The Oktoberfestbiers served at the Oktoberfest in Munich are more akin to Helles in color.

And any pale Oktoberfest I’ve seen here in the US certainly looks like a Helles.

 

They slot between an export Helles and a Heller Bock.