Schell's Response to the Brewer's Association

There's a lesson to be learned here: What's in a name? NOTHING, it's just a name. And names mean different things to different people. And yes, blacklisting breweries is Beer McCarthyism.

 

Crapping on the homebrewer, nicely played. Oh, you know who else home brewed in the past??? Just about ever great "craft brewer" this country has!!! They also own Schells ass when it comes to making great beer!!!

 

Dave Berg from Schell's already apologized for that. And it seems he was attempting a play on words that most missed (by definition, a zoigl can't just be one guy brewing at home - it's communal). The argument is over; no need to bring it back up.

 

Although, be definition, it is one guy brewing, just at the community or homebrewer association owned equipment. Then lagered and served at that individual's home.

And sadly, in a few of the remaining zoigl towns, its almost down to one guy. And, for all Dave knows, Im using community equipment (Im not, so he got that right, and he did apologize, so he has that going for him).

 

They make a good point. Not everyone is going to fit into the definition of craft beer and thats fine but there is nothing stopping them from labeling or marketing their beer as craft. What is key to this piece is the fact the brewers association not only lists craft brewers but one that are not craft. Just list the craft list they dont need to tell you every one else who does not fit the definition. The only definition that matters to these brewers is how craft is defined by law and barrel production so that they can receive the special economic protections

 

I have learned a lot from this thread and the related thread on the Brewers Association's Op-Ed piece. I think it's far to say there are a lot of people who care what company makes the beer they are drinking and there are other people who don't. I think a number of people have made valid points about great regional brewers who fall outside the Brewers Association's defintion of a craft brewey. The Brewer's Association does not have a defintion for craft beer. That is for the consumer to descide. The op-ed never said anything about the quality of the people or the beer being marketed as craft beer by the international conglomerates. The main point Brewer's Association is making with the op-ed piece is that consumers deserve to know who makes the beers they are drinking. I'm pulling a quote from an earlier point in this thread and contrasting it with the hyperlink below:


"Lack of transparency in beer labeling is a non-issue. If a beer drinker cares who brews the beer they drink, they will find out. All one requires is the internet and Google or a knowledgeable beer store employee. People simply don't care....Transparency in beer labeling is a distraction."

I do not think transparency in labelling and marketing is a distraction - As exibit A I am sharing this hyperlink that has come up before on a related thread. If you are not a raging beer geek like so many of us are on this site, and you see this segment - it is easy to think that Blue Moon was funded and owned and started by this one man on a DIY 7 bbl brewhouse. Blue Moon does not have the same access to market challenges true indie craft breweries face. Blue Moon does not have the same access to ingredeints challenges that true indie craft breweries face. It is now and has always been 100% owned by Coors which is part of the second-largest brewing conglomerate in the world.
http://video.foxbusiness.com/v/2034017725001/blue-moon-founder-on-the-craft-behind-craft-brewing/

Within 24 hours of the publication of the op-ed MillerCoors got this man on to national TV to double down on their marketing message that blue moon is a bootstrapping entrepreneurial success story. It's not. It's a success story about powerful marketing and powerful distribution. But there are over 2200 breweries operating in America today and we are all free to support, buy, and drink which ever beers we want. As beer advcates and consumers we are creating our own grassroots-oriented success story of powerful BUT AUTHENTIC marketing by championing the thousands of locally-owned craft breweries we are fortunate to have in this country. Marketing doesn't have to be a dirty word - it can simply mean sharing and promoting something you believe in. This passionate community doesn't always agree on what to share and what to promote - which beers to champion - which ideas to embrace - and that's why there are thousands of beer choices out there. And that's a beuatiful thing.

 

And they thought calling the 152 year old August Schell Brewing Company non-traditional would help get that point across?

 

With all due respect, Sam, you know as well as I do that the labeling of many craft brewers is far from transparent. I can look at a label and I know whose brewery is in the City, State listed, and note the name of the brewer is not the name of said brewery. I'm surprised this is an argument the BA wants to start.

 

So, if you petition the TTB and get the beer labeling "Name and Address" requirements changed so that no 'dba' brewery names would be allowed and the city/state listed would have to be the actual brewery, and not just the "headquarter" brewery, wouldn't that negatively affect a sizable number of Brewers Association member "craft brewers" who contract brew, use the "alternate proprietorship" model or "gypsy" brew at other breweries?

 

The Lower Palatine is part of the current state of Rheinland-Pfalz ("Pfalz" = Palatinate) and that state indeed borders France (and Luxemburg as well) although the "Pfalz" proper did not. The Upper Palatine is one of the 7 administrative divisions of the state of Bavaria and it borders the Czech Republic in the East. Part of it actually was part of the Kingdom of Bohemia for several centuries. We've got a very checkered past over here

 

For Germany (and Austria) it's rather easy. Avoid everything listed here:
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brau_Holding_International
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitburger_Holding
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radeberger_Gruppe
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anheuser-Busch_InBev#Deutsche_Marken
for Austria: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brau_Union#Biermarken

In general, asking Wikipedia is a good source to find out who actually brews any given name. For a list of what to drink / look for in eastern Bavaria (= the districts of Upper Palatine and Lower Bavaria) you can always ask me as well

 

Oh nono Not even remotely There's not many towns left, true but where it's still alive it really IS alive Take a look at the official "Zoiglkalender" for 2012 right here:
http://www.zoiglinfo.de/pdf/Zoiglkalender_Internet.pdf

 

I can't edit my own post anymore so I'm replying to myself... I just posted a much longer post on the subject of "Zoigl" in the German subforum that also includes links, adresses and dates for 2013 so if anyone is planning a trip, there#s a good place to start

Here: http://beeradvocate.com/community/threads/zoigl.56655/

 

Cool, I will check that out, although I doubt my trip will be in 2013.

Also good to hear its thriving in the few remaining towns, I had the impression is was down to a couple of households per.

 

Sometimes doing the right thing hurts. If Sam and the BA are serious about the transparency, they will consider that acceptable. Honestly, I see it as a win-win situation. Transparency for the big guys, the hypocrisy argument that you sometimes make goes away. At a cost for the small guys in having to get new labels (hopefully with enough time lag to use up old labels/cans).

 

I agree, but Schell's wasn't on the list because of independence for being a fake success story, they were there for using adjuncts. What is your opinion on that? Frankly traditional is the criterion I can least get behind. I avoid AAL because they taste bad, not because they're "nontraditional." I love Palo Santo Marron and some of your wilder stuff, but how is that in anyway traditional? Is it really important? Is it just a poor choice of words?

 

As has been noted a few times in these threads, there are "craft brewer's beers" (<that awkward phrase since the B.A. doesn't define "craft beer") being contract brewed in "Non-Craft Breweries" that are on the B.A.'s Blacklist - Cold Spring, City, Genesee, The Lion, etc.

And we all know that Blue Moon was created as a Coors product by a Coors employee in a Coors facility. It has always been a "faux" craft beer, one that does not fit the current B.A. definition because of the "Independent" factor.

But it HAS been brewed in a "craft brewery" - twice, in fact. Go figure, huh?

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Or full screen larger view here

 

I appreciate that Sam Calagione took the time to participate in this thread(s): both by reading the posts and making a post.

Sam states: “The main point Brewer's Association is making with the op-ed piece is that consumers deserve to know who makes the beers they are drinking.”

I for one would very, very much like that beer labeling would clearly detail “who makes the beer they are drinking”. If AB InBev is brewing a beer like Shock Top I want to know that it is brewed by an AB InBev brewery. Also if MillerCoors is brewing a beer like Blue Moon I want to know that it is brewed by MillerCoors.

I for one will believe that the Brewers Association is genuine about “consumers deserve to know who makes the beers they are drinking” when I look at a can of Sixpoint beer and the label details: “Brewed by Lion Brewery in Wilkes-Barre, PA”. Until that day I really won’t think that the Brewers Association is truly committed to the idea of: “consumers deserve to know who makes the beers they are drinking”.

Cheers!

 

lol, sometimes i think jesskidden must have a photographic memory. the obscure minutiae and documentation that he seems able to call up at will is haunting...

 

You keep bringing this up, but you fail to mention one thing. Who is brewing the beer? I dont think the equipment matters, its the brewer, right? So if Crafto craft company contracts to the Lion, but crafto brews it on Lion equipment, isnt that different than if they contract it and then The Lion's brewer brews it?

And, does that even matter? Once the brewery rents the equipment and the brewer, they become the effective "owner", in the same way that a renter controls their rental property. Police cant get permission to search from the leasing company, they have to get it from the renter, for example.

That said, I wish the labels made it clear where the beer is brewed.