Quick question regarding Council

Ok. So what's the question?

 

Only the Beats are worth drinking.

 

I really wanted to like this place. I only get down to the S.D. area a few times a year and the last time down went to several places to which I'd never been. (Loved Toolbox!) Stopped in at Council and actually ended up seeing several of my good friends from the Los Angeles area.

I like to try as many of the beers as I can and ended up with a couple of flights so that I could taste it all. Ladies behind the bar were polite and professional and very competent.

Some of the beers were decent; some were only "ok." I'm one to look for the best and I actually try to like what I taste. Hey, I'm not a brewer; I don't brew and it's really hard for me to criticize someone doing what I can't; what I won't and where I'm usually a beneficiary of their work! So, I thought most of the beers were worth the try and while I beers seemed somewhat simple and lacked any real complexity - they were "good." Sours were worth trying and I thought sufficiently promising that I was looking forward to more when they were a bit more experienced in sour production. I'm one who thought that bottling them was getting a bit "ahead of themselves." But, in today's beer world I'm sure it was profitable for them - so, why not?

My real problem was the brewer! (Liz?) This woman is young, relatively inexperienced, producing "ok" beer but nothing particularly noteworthy and she was really full of herself! She really thought she was "all that" and could not have been more off-putting. I was introduced to her and it was as if she almost went out of her way to be rude and to make sure that I knew that she knew waaaay more than me about beer. (And, I'm sure that she does.) Perhaps it was because I was likely as old as her father - I don't know. What I do know is that I have no desire to drink her beer, not because she's making somewhat simple and pedestrian beer, some good and some not, but because I have no desire to give my business to someone who treats me like shit. I'm hoping that perhaps I caught her on an off or bad day and that she really is a nice person. I'm doubtful that I'll be around to confirm, however, one way or the other. Too many other places (good and bad) where people want my business and value me as a customer. (Oh! Side note here: her husband could not have been nicer! Really super guy.)

 

I like Council, but when you examine the fact that it is essentially a two person show and they are throwing up at least ten beers on their tasting list these issues might arise. They are a local brewery in Claremont that are pretty much doing the best regularly available sours in the San Diego city area. The sours obviously are quick batch, not intensely complex beers, but at the same time where else in the country are you getting those types of beers on the regular basis that Council is putting out. I have issues with some of their beers and they definitely aren't a "must visit" when you come to San Diego like say Modern Times, Pizza Port, Stone or Ballast Point, but at the same time they are simply doing what they want to do and sometimes it is a hit and sometimes it is a miss. Obviously they aren't going to please everyone, but at least respect the fact that this is pretty much a partner ran brewery that does a solid job at presenting interesting styles in a completely saturated beer market. Whenever a beer friend of mine visits I always make sure to take them to Council and I guess that is the best advice I can give them.

That being said, the Cantaloupe Mint Beatitude was one of the best beers I have ever had.

 

Who else in the Southern California area is putting out sours at a regular and consistent basis as Council? Last I heard both her and her husband were working over 12 - 14 hours to meet demand. Obviously they are new to the brewing game, but at the same time they have a taste for what people expecting a sour beer are going to want. Sometimes they miss, sometimes they hit. San Diego is full of breweries that are so completely tuned, sometimes it's nice to see a little bit of creativity.

 

Toolbox? Phantom Carriage?

 

Highland Park should get tossed into that list. Bob is knocking it out of the park with not a bad beer among the crowd.

I mean, council is cranking out beers, but they're pretty much mediocre at best. Phantom Carriage... I mean, we all say they're about a year away from cranking them out on the steady. That broad acres treatments were something else entirely in the realm of amazing.

 

I have no idea how what you've said applies whatsoever to what I've said. You may be right or not; I don't know. What on earth does how hard they work or what they are producing have to do with what I said? So, sure....I can say that, indeed, you may be 100% correct in all you say and conclude. Doesn't change my point as to why I'd not go back nor does it change my point that, at least right now, her beers are pedestrian.

 

Absolutely! I could not agree more with you about Highland Park and, truthfully, about Council being a bit away from making good beer. (Well, some is good and even very good. Let's just say from making better beer.....especially the sours.)

 

That's fine. I don't think Council is attempting to be a definition of the San Diego beer scene. They fit a niche. Low alcohol, quick produced fruited sours. Lindemans has a following on here as well. I honestly would not rate a single beer from Council as one of the best in San Diego, but at the same time for people living in the southern part of the city, it's nice to be able to drive less than ten minutes and be able to get high quality fruited sours.

Every brewery isn't going to blow everyone's mind, I've been to plenty of hyped breweries all over the country and some of them disappoint. I don't take that out on the owners and say things like "she's inexperienced and rude". I simply understand my palate might not be fully appreciative towards what they are doing. I guess that is where I take offense.

I also agree with the fact that there a better breweries doing sours in southern California. At the same time, like I said in my previous post, I find it hard to believe that any of these breweries Toolbox included are doing it a regularity as Council and as well as consistent as Council. Personal preference, but I love me some fruited sours.

 

Unfortunately, your experience is neither unique nor isolated - I've never had any personal interaction with her (including ordering beer, always happened to order from someone else when I'm in) but I've heard enough first hand accounts similar to yours that a trend has formed. Perhaps it's a public persona that has formed to deal with craft beer geeks that she unfairly lumps everyone into, or perhaps there's some other reason for it, but it's definitely there. I'm sure she's faced some degree of sexism over time and has built up certain defense mechanisms, but condescension is equally unappealing from her as it is from Pat McIlhenney or anyone else, regardless of gender.

Their beer started out quite good - the first batch of Gavel Drop they produced was fantastic - but has been tremendously inconsistent for most of their time in business. Most of the batches of IPAs that I've tried have had rather obvious off flavors and Pirate's Breakfast would vary quite a bit in how it turned out. Some batch variation is to be expected in any young brewery and can be excused, but serving beer with blatant off flavors on a regular basis is neither expected nor excusable.

The Beatitude series is their one saving grace (subject to its own variance, especially in acidity), but I'm curious to see how far that can be taken. Early batches sold out immediately but successive releases have moved slower. I'm sure they're okay with having the beers stick around for more than a couple hours but considering how much extra capacity they brought online to produce Beatitude, they're going to be reliant on people buying it with some regularity, rather than as a curiosity. Considering the other options that are appearing for a much lower pricepoint like Avery's Lilikoi Kepolo, I can see some difficulty in convincing consumers to make a $12 bottle of ~3% ABV beer a regular purchase.

 

I pretty much stick to the Bully Pulpit for the IPAs there, though I do remember getting a pint from a batch that died off fairly dramatically after a few weeks. Generally, I think that it rises quite a bit over mediocre.

As to Liz, maybe somewhat of a cult of personality has developed. I thought they played along too much with the "only female owner / head brewer combination" hype, to be honest, but perhaps that's just me. In the early days, I'd talk with her quite a bit, and never found her condescending. She'd always ask what I thought about what I was drinking, good or bad. As they've hired more servers and a few assistant brewers, I've seen her around there less and less, though, so I'd probably not be a good judge of what she's currently like with customers.

 

Agreed that the Gavel Drop featuring Nelson was not that good. However, the Bully Pulpit is a good IPA. Buddy and I went there they other day and both agreed it was better than Citraholic which we had both tried around the same time. The Beats are good and so is Pirate's Breakfast. Stick with those and you'll enjoy your time there.

 

very surprised to hear this, though maybe I just happened to go on good days. I've been twice and really enjoyed many of the things I had both times - I thought the bully pulpit and quorum w/hallertau Blanc were outstanding, I really enjoyed most of the beat. treatments I had, and pirate's breakfast was good too. some of the other IPAs were just average, but I was coming from Alpine and Societe, so I assumed that that had colored my impression.

Also, everyone there has been super nice when I've been.

 

Whoa, I don't know if I'm a serious Beachwood fanboy, but imo Bully Pulpit is nowhere near Citraholic.

Council impressed me the first time I went there and since has been a let down every time. Pirates Breakfast isn't bad, and the BBA Pirate's Breakfast tasted exactly the same. I have high hopes for them in the future because it seems they are passionate and have a good vision but right now it's pretty lacking.

 

Doomsayer, it's not even close. Citraholic was meh. There are so many better IPA's. Where the hype train left the station on that beer is beyond me.

 

No way Bully Pulpit is better than Citraholic. Crazy talk.

 

I can't really speak to Bully Pulpit because nearly every batch I try these days is riddled with off flavors, but the original batch of it that they made before it became a regular beer was insane (http://www.beeradvocate.com/beer/profile/34734/127231/). That particular beer and batch was up there with a lot of great hoppy beer I've tried. Sadly, I haven't had anything like that since their early days. Off flavors. I'll leave it at that.