Averagely Perfect Kölsch - Poll #3 - Grains/Fermentables

Discussion in 'Homebrewing' started by VikeMan, Apr 21, 2020.

?

Select ONE OR MORE Grains/Fermentables

Poll closed Apr 23, 2020.

  1. Generic Two Row and/or Pale Ale Malt and/or Pilsner

    37 vote(s)
    97.4%

  2. Wheat Malt

    19 vote(s)
    50.0%

  3. Flaked Wheat

    3 vote(s)
    7.9%

  4. Munich and/or Vienna Malt(s)

    19 vote(s)
    50.0%

  5. Dextrin Malt (Cara-Foam, -Pils, -Hell)

    4 vote(s)
    10.5%

  6. Other Cara/Crystal Malt(s)

    2 vote(s)
    5.3%

  7. Other Adjuncts

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%

  8. Other (write it in)

    1 vote(s)
    2.6%
Multiple votes are allowed.
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  1. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    -> Poll #2 <- determined that the Final Gravity target will be 1.008, with an OG target of 1.045.

    Now we'll start selecting the grains/fermentables. Pour yourself a beer...this will take a while.

    You can select more than one choice. The #1 overall choice will be automatically in. Beyond that, any other choices that get votes from at least 30% of respondents will advance to future poll(s) to determine exact combinations in/out. If less than 3 (beyond the top pick) get votes from at least 30% of respondents, three will advance to the combinations poll. There will also be polls (where necessary) to select specific varieties of the grains/fermentables that advance to the combinations poll. Want something that's not listed? Write it in.

    I recommend you think about this in terms of not only your personal preferences, but also in the context of the ABV and Final Gravity (and thus the attenuation) already selected, as well as any possible yeast strain selection that might be kicking around in your head.

    This poll will be open for 48 hours.

    If you have issues with or suggestions for methodologies used in this project, please send them via PM. Let's keep the threads themselves on topic to the question at hand and not about how you would have asked the question differently.

    The Averagely Perfect Kölsch Recipe so far...
    Target ABV: 4.8%
    OG: 1.045
    FG: 1.008
    Grains/Fermentables: TBD (This and additional polls)
     
    #1 VikeMan, Apr 21, 2020
  2. scottakelly

    scottakelly Maven (1,487) May 9, 2007 Ohio

    I would be interested in hearing from anyone who has used Wheat Malt before regarding their experience with it.
     
    #2 scottakelly, Apr 21, 2020
  3. wasatchback

    wasatchback Pooh-Bah (1,574) Jan 12, 2014 Tajikistan
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    You mean malted wheat in this particular style?
     
    #3 wasatchback, Apr 21, 2020
  4. Dave_S

    Dave_S Crusader (429) May 18, 2017 England

    Reinheitsgebot says no...
     
    #4 Dave_S, Apr 21, 2020
    SFACRKnight likes this.
  5. wasatchback

    wasatchback Pooh-Bah (1,574) Jan 12, 2014 Tajikistan
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    #5 wasatchback, Apr 21, 2020
    scottakelly and dmtaylor like this.
  6. Dave_S

    Dave_S Crusader (429) May 18, 2017 England

    Oh, good point. Brain fart there.
     
    #6 Dave_S, Apr 21, 2020
  7. pweis909

    pweis909 Grand Pooh-Bah (3,250) Aug 13, 2005 Wisconsin
    Pooh-Bah

    100% Pils is how I have always made this. It was my understanding that this was traditional, but I am no expert. I also believe I have heard authoritative sources say wheat is used in some contemporary, geographically authentic examples. Frankly, using the Wyeast Kolsch strain with one of my cream ales* has been on my bucket list.

    *w/ flaked corn and/or flaked barley, an homage to Spotted Cow (some say the WY yeast strain is a good match, although I have my doubts; would still be tasty).
     
    #7 pweis909, Apr 21, 2020
    chrisrennier likes this.
  8. dmtaylor

    dmtaylor Savant (1,149) Dec 30, 2003 Wisconsin

    I was told a loooong time ago that a Kolsch has a small portion of wheat malt. So, right or wrong, I've stuck with it. I recently brewed a Kolsch with 40% wheat that is still clear as crystal. But more typically I think about 15% seems a good figure. The rest should be pilsner, up to 100%, that's a good way to go. Not that the amounts matter here in this thread (not yet).
     
    #8 dmtaylor, Apr 21, 2020
  9. scottakelly

    scottakelly Maven (1,487) May 9, 2007 Ohio

    Correct, in regards to kolsch. I've had plenty of experience using it in other styles.
     
    #9 scottakelly, Apr 21, 2020
  10. scottakelly

    scottakelly Maven (1,487) May 9, 2007 Ohio

    From your experience is there anything flavor-wise, etc that wheat malt brings to the table for this style?
     
    #10 scottakelly, Apr 21, 2020
  11. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    According to K. Florian Klemp (with emphasis in bold by me):

    “A grist of pilsner malt ensures a brilliant straw-gold color (wheat has been largely phased out) and soft maltiness.”

    http://allaboutbeer.com/article/kolsch-2/

    Perhaps wheat was used in the past but now is passé?

    I have never used any wheat in brewing my Kolsch beers.

    Cheers!
     
    #11 JackHorzempa, Apr 21, 2020
    dmtaylor likes this.
  12. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    I thought some of you might be interested in this video about the History of Kolsch:

     
    #12 JackHorzempa, Apr 21, 2020
    premierpro and riptorn like this.
  13. Granitebeard

    Granitebeard Zealot (549) Aug 24, 2016 Maine

    Ima be the guy that fights the basic beer styling and say give 'er some color... Yes I voted for the c-malts, I feel we should add something a little extra even if it is not the way the Germans would do it. Also, I would not be expecting much, just a hint of something more...
     
    #13 Granitebeard, Apr 21, 2020
  14. Naugled

    Naugled Pooh-Bah (1,944) Sep 25, 2007 New York
    Pooh-Bah

    Hmm I’ve always used some sort of dextrin malt, but I guess wheat will do a similar thing. I voted for dex, but I can be persuaded to flip.
     
    #14 Naugled, Apr 22, 2020
  15. wasatchback

    wasatchback Pooh-Bah (1,574) Jan 12, 2014 Tajikistan
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    I think it can add a touch of “doughy” character and potentially help with head retention a bit. Just a bit more complex than straight pils.

    For me the three options would be

    100% Pils
    Pils with 10-15% Wheat
    Pils with 10-15% Vienna

    Munich doesn’t belong in this style. I don’t think any C malts do either. Maybe 2-3% Carahell but I don’t really see the point in that.
     
    #15 wasatchback, Apr 22, 2020
    Hanglow, MrOH, dmtaylor and 1 other person like this.
  16. OddNotion

    OddNotion Pooh-Bah (1,915) Nov 1, 2009 New Jersey
    Pooh-Bah

    Pilsner, Wheat and Vienna for me. Don't want to see any Munich, I think it would overpower this style even in a relatively small amount. No need for Cmalts either, the Wheat can add any wanted body and head retention.
     
    #16 OddNotion, Apr 22, 2020
  17. Hanglow

    Hanglow Pooh-Bah (2,051) Feb 18, 2012 Scotland
    Pooh-Bah

    Pils+Wheat.

    I think Vienna is also used traditionally?
     
    #17 Hanglow, Apr 22, 2020
  18. scottakelly

    scottakelly Maven (1,487) May 9, 2007 Ohio

    I actually like to use a little light Munich malt in my pale German beers. Usually around 5%. I don't think it overwhelms the beer at all.
     
    #18 scottakelly, Apr 22, 2020
  19. dmtaylor

    dmtaylor Savant (1,149) Dec 30, 2003 Wisconsin

    Not much. Wheat is a pretty mild flavor. It might add a slightly unique bread or cracker flavor that you may or may not get from pilsner malt alone.
     
    #19 dmtaylor, Apr 22, 2020
    scottakelly likes this.
  20. dmtaylor

    dmtaylor Savant (1,149) Dec 30, 2003 Wisconsin

    +1
     
    #20 dmtaylor, Apr 22, 2020
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