Why Aren't There More Barrel Aged Lagers?

We had a fine example using barrels specifically made for the purpose instead of recyling ones used to age spirits. Cathedral Tree Lager from Ft. George Brewing way out in Astoria, OR. It was a remarkable beer and a very distinct flavor from the oak. If you're in the area, I'd seek it out.

From the Brewery --
Notes: Cathedral Tree is a beer that pays reverence to the timeless lager style – Pilsners. Fermented entirely in 500 Liter oak puncheons, to incorporate Old World methodology and provide a mellow tannic structure that lends a full mouthfeel and support for classic German noble and modern hops. Finishes crisp, clean, and refreshing as any Pilsner should. Look for Cathedral Tree in 16-ounce cans. And just like the actual Cathedral Tree, this one is staying firmly planted at the coast.

https://www.beeradvocate.com/beer/profile/16077/417659/

 

Yes, perhaps this is the situation. Maybe you pick up 'more' vanilla, etc. from barrel aging then the rest of us.

Well, first thing is that breweries can set higher prices for barrel aged beers and there are tons of beer geeks willing to pay more for this aspect. A win-win it seems.

I would argues that folks willing to pay $20+ for 'NEIPA' beers is odd but like you stated: "But you know, brewing is odd." FWIW what I would state is: Beer consumers willing to pay outrageous prices, and make herculean efforts to get, Juicy/Hazy IPAs is odd. But we are where we are?

Cheers!

 

After seeing the bitburger item I agree. The image of aluminum chips was unnerving, but those clean slotted metal racks looked.like brewing equipment to me. It seems odd.that Budweiser would go through the hassle.of.the wood (including the extra hassle of limiting the woods impacts on the beer) when there are more appropriately industrial options out there

 

Well, AB had a 'corporate culture' of doing things the 'proper way' from a historical brewing perspective. In other words do things the way we have for the past x years. It is popular for beer geeks to shit all over AB but IMO the steps they take for QC/QA is the best in the brewing industry. I am personally not a fan of a beer like Bud/Bud Light but there is zero doubt in my mind they take all the proper steps to brew these beers in a quality manner.

The other aspect to keep in mind that the function of the beechwood strips is to provide a 'resting place' for the AB house lager yeast to rest and 'finish their job'. The fact that beechwood strips have rough edges provided more places for the yeast to rest. If they choose to implement metal 'shelves' instead would the AB house lager yeast perform exactly the same? The only way to know for sure is to run some 'experiments' but I suppose the philosophy of 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it' applies to AB here?

Cheers!

 

The video below cleared things up (pun intended). They simply layer the bottom of the tank with the chips as expected.

 

Patrik, did you catch the part in the beginning of the video where the young lady made mention of 50 degrees (F)? I read this once before but this video confirms this information: AB lagers beers like Bud at 50 degrees F which is quite warm compared to 'conventional wisdom' that lagering should occur near freezing temperature (around 32 degrees F).

Are you aware of any other lager breweries that lager their beers this warm?

Cheers!

@jesskidden

 

This is how recently-retired AB brewmaster George Reisch explained it a few years ago - on a no-longer-available website about his family brewery, the Reisch Brewing Co. (which closed in 1966*), comparing their process to that of AB's (which also supposedly contributes to their shorter lagering time):

Looks like it's been revived -
Reisch family celebrates revival of Gold Top beer with last brewmaster, now 100
(which could explain why that original website with the interview is no longer up.)

 

There are multiple 'processes' occurring during the lagering process. Yes, there are yeast related activities and this is of particular concern to a brewery like AB since they perform krausening (they add a small portion of young, actively fermenting beer to the bulk of beer which has completed primary fermentation). Do you know how many other breweries conduct a krausening process? For example does Molson Coors do this for any of their lagers?

In contrast a very popular selling European lager conducts a very cold and short duration lagering phase: they lager at 30 degrees F for a period of a few days. This scheme accelerates the other aspects of lagering (e.g., coagulation of protein-polyphenol complexes and precipitation of these complexes).

In other words getting the finished beer as cold as possible is optimum for some of the lagering processes but sub-optimum for any yeast related processes.

Cheers!

 

Nope, but I do know some of the post-Repeal US brewers which were known for Kraeusening.

They were employing it for the Heileman Old Style Lager they are/were brewing for Pabst, and IIRC some of the former Miller breweries (in particular the now-close Eden NC facility) also did it for some of their other contract-brewed beers, like some of the Samuel Adams' beers.

 

https://www.beeradvocate.com/commun...he-hell-out-of-you.634278/page-2#post-6804460

https://www.beeradvocate.com/beer/profile/417/452134/?ba=MNAle#review

 

That's a fine testimonial.

 

I think the key aspect here is the kräusening. The basic late 1800s, early 1900s American lager beer process consisted of primary fermentation, ruh storage and kräusen fermentation in chip casks. The temperature was the highest during primary fermentation, the coldest during ruh (very low temperatures achieved with the help of artificial refridgeration), with the kräusen fermentation taking place at a temperature inbetween the primary fermentation temperature and ruh storage, so the beer warmed up slightly from the ruh storage when going over to the chip casks but didn't reach primary fermentation temperatures. Though even as early as the turn of the century some brewers were dropping the ruh storage stage and only doing kräusening (Liebmann & Sons for example), and there were also those who advocated the use of slightly warmer primary fermentation temperatures and or kräusening temperatures in order to achieve a brisker fermentation which they argued helped protect the beer from infection since the yeast got off to a stronger start. There's alot more that can be said about this but I think it's important to know where the practise comes from in order to understand it's place today.

As for Budweiser it is clear that Anheuser Busch were using this basic three step process at least until the 1940s. Note the mention of temperature:

"So Budweiser mellows slowly at slightly above 32 degrees fahrenheit".

That sounds like the ruh temperature to me, with the kräusening temperature being warmer. At some point they dropped the ruh stage but maintained the kräusening step, and no doubt increased the temperature at which the kräusen fermentation takes place. The mention of 6 weeks and then 10-12 weeks I take to mean the ruh stage and the total period of storage, so that 4-6 weeks were spent in the kräusening stage. With that lenght of kräusen fermentation the goal wouldn't be to achieve the fastest or strongest fermentation possible, leaving the beer fully attenuated just sitting there with the yeast at warmer temperatures, but instead a slow and continual process of secondary fermentation.

Now with warmer temperatures, at or near primary fermentation temperatures, one would expect a stronger fermentation, and stronger attenuation of the added extract in less time. This I imagine is of benefit in producing a more modern, lighter beer. I think this is where the idea comes from that kräusening produces a more attenuated beer, if you treat the kräusening step like primary fermentation, then naturally the result will be more of the same. Whereas in the past the idea was not to eliminate the added extract, but to use the added extract to achieve plentiful and stable carbonation in the beer, with the trade off being the added extract, yeast particles and fresh hop resins.

There is a document online showing an overview of the Anheuser Busch brewery in Baldwinsville New York where one can see that they do have a ruh cellar apart from the chip cellar, my thinking then is that beers such as Busch and Natural light go to the ruh cellar and are treated with a standard lagering treatment at very cold temperatures for 1-2 weeks. I have a hard time imagining them letting beers sit at 50 degrees fahrenheit in those ruh tanks without undergoing a kräusen fermentation.

 

Are you aware of any other lager breweries that lager their beers this warm (i.e., 50 degrees F)?

Cheers!

 

I haven't come across it myself no, if I came across it I would be sure to take note since I would be intrigued to see an instance of it, outside of perhaps a British brewery conditioning their lager beers like they do their ales, that I could imagine.

 

I remember back in the 90s when Dave Miller was writing for Brewing Techniques magazine and working in St Louis, he was making that argument; and I'm sure he was pretty familiar with AB's procedures as well. Essentially it was: do you really think that they would go through all that trouble of cleaning and sanitizing and re-cleaning and sanitizing those chips if they thought the effect on the final product was so negligible?

 

I figure the geekery will respect the process only after the suits in Belgium tells St Louis to cut it out. (Sorta like the outcry when they announced they were going to brew Budweiser with hop pellets instead of whole hops - even tho' most "craft" brewers already used pellets).

 

I have batch 5 bottles, they’re dated 032919. I know I missed the batch out after that too, which had to have been before this spring.

Next to it I see Lakefront Brewery’s barrel aged doppelbock, which was also excellent.