1 Gallon Batch Sours

Well, I can't speak specifically to sours, but you would be over-pitching by quite a bit me thinks. Here is a nice write-up regarding over-pitching and how it can be detrimental.

http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f163/why-not-pitch-your-yeast-cake-166221/

 

The sourness comes from the bacteria not the yeast. Theoretically you want your pitching rate to be equal to a regular batch. If you over pitch sacc it will over attenuate and it wont leave anything left for the bugs to eat, which will leave you with a less then sour beer. It should probably take just as long, if you're aiming for complexity. A lot of people don't like investing that much into a beer that you can't drink for a long time and may not work out. But my theory is if you're going to wait over a year to drink a beer, if it works out then you'll be disappointed you spent that much time waiting for a 6-pack.

 

The White Labs blends only have ~10 billion cells, including Saccharomyces. If anything they'd be under-pitching even for a 1 gallon batch (in my humble opinion). Wyeast on the other hand would be over-pitching.

I like bottle dregs from unpasteurized sour beers. You could pitch dregs from a couple bottles along with a few grams of the dried brewer's yeast of your choice.

 

Not universally true. Brettanomyces will produce sourness in presence of oxygen. Some strains more than others.

 

Michael, why does White Labs make such small amounts (10 million cells) for their blends?

I took note that for the WLP655 (Belgian Sour Mix I) there is a Q&A of:

“Q. Although I doubt it, I was wondering if a starter culture is necessary for the mix?

A. Although many people like to make starters, it is not necessary with these vials. It is customary to under-pitch brettanomyces because the species thrives better under these conditions.”

Does it make sense to not make a starter if there are only 10 million cells?

Cheers!

P.S. Maybe you only need a small number if bacteria (Lactobacillus and Pediococcus) are involved?

 

True, but if you're comparing the amount of acid that Brett produces to that of Pedio then you thinking of a slightly tart beer vs. lambic, which is generally what people think of when they think of sours. I wouldn't use Brett is my only souring organism if I want something similar to Lambic pH.

 

Sure, but this is a lot different of a statement than "The sourness comes from the bacteria, not the yeast."

 

Fixed

 

“Brett, Lacto, Pedio are all technically yeasts.”

Hopefully a microbiologist will chime in. It is my understanding that Brett is a yeast but Lacto and Pedio are bacteria. Bacteria are not yeast.

Cheers!

 

Attenuation is determined by how much fermentable sugar is available, not by how much yeast is seated in the dining room. If you cook ten hamburgers, it doesn't matter if you serve them to ten people or to a thousand. The same number of hamburgers will be eaten either way.

 

Brett is yeast. Pedio and Lacto are bacteria.

 

I don't like making mixed culture starters (too many different and conflicting needs), I'd rather pitch the vial as is along with a healthy pitch of the ale yeast of my choice.

You are wrong Brettano-myces and Saccharo-myces are both yeasts, while Lactobacillus, Peciococcus, and Acetobacter are all bacteria. people often mistake Brett for a bacteria, but the others are.

 

While this is technically true, it would require constant aeration of your wort during fermentation to build any noticeable acidity. For all intents and purposes, Brett does not produce sour flavor in beer. Here's a presentation by Chad from Crooked Stave on the topic (about the 23 min mark is the part about Brett and sourness):

 

Looks like Kai found a very slightly higher attenuation with higher pitching rates, but only to a point (under-pitching under-attenuated, over-pitching did not over-attenuate): http://braukaiser.com/blog/blog/2012/06/09/pitching-rate-experiment/

If you serve one person 10 hamburgers they may not eat them all.

 

Ever had a Sanctification?

 

It contains bacteria too... https://store-54e42.mybigcommerce.com/bottle-logs/