1968

Discussion in 'Homebrewing' started by Boonedog, Nov 25, 2013.

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  1. angrygrimace

    angrygrimace Initiate (0) Apr 11, 2011 California

    If it goes under 64 or so, it can flocculate out, but that doesn't seem super likely. You can swirl if you it poops out early, but there's no reason for that to happen unless your ambient is lower than 65.

    The fermometer reads the temperature on the back, not the ambient on the front.

    It depends what he pitched it at. If his room is 66 ambient and the beer was 58 when he pitched, its not out of the realm of possibility it hasn't ever reached the current ambient temperature. A full carboy has a lot of thermal mass and the difference between 58 liquid and 66 ambient isn't enough to expect it to shift particularly quickly towards ambient.
     
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  2. Boonedog

    Boonedog Initiate (0) Apr 10, 2013 Illinois

    So sure enough at 14 days I seem stuck at 1.020 which is 66% attenuation. Going to bring this upstairs where its a bit warmer (68) and swirl the carboy to rouse those yeasties.

    Should that do the trick so I can at least drop this to 1.017 or so?
     
  3. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    What was your grain/extract bill, your mash temp (if all grain), and your mash length (if all grain)? Your attenuation might be finished. Published attenuation expectations (like 67-71% in this case) can sometimes be misleading.
     
  4. Boonedog

    Boonedog Initiate (0) Apr 10, 2013 Illinois

    This was a club brew. We did 30 gallons. We all are using a different yeast and the others have done fermenting from 1.012-1.015.
     
  5. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    Right, so what was the recipe?
     
  6. Boonedog

    Boonedog Initiate (0) Apr 10, 2013 Illinois

    6o lbs pale malt
    5.75 lb caramel 40
    2.75 lbs carafa III
    1.5 lbs chocolate
    1lb columbus whole leaf 60 min boil
    1lb cluster at KO

    Mashed 60 min at 152. Batch sparge.

    we may have put extra pale in because our OG was 1.060
     
  7. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    Based on that grain bill, mash temp, mash length, and yeast strain, I would have expected (in my system) attenuation in the neighborhood of 74%. You may well have a bit further to go. Did you take gravity readings 2-3 days apart? That could help determine if fermentation is really stuck, or just slow. In either case though, a temperature bump couldn't hurt at this point.

    Given all the information, I wonder if your yeast is tired. How much yeast did you pitch? And how did you oxygenate?
     
  8. Boonedog

    Boonedog Initiate (0) Apr 10, 2013 Illinois

    We oxygenated each carboy with pure O for "approx" 90 seconds. I made a 1.5L starter from a new, fresh smack pak.
    I didn't think the grain bill was low on fermentables. This IS my first experience with a "Black Ale"
     
  9. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    It sounds like you had plenty of yeast and O2.
     
  10. Boonedog

    Boonedog Initiate (0) Apr 10, 2013 Illinois

    Yes, if fact this ferment went crazy early on. I thought it would be attenuated out after 5 days or so but alas, no.

    Thanks for your help. This is going upstairs for the week. Especially now with this weather.
     
  11. bulletrain76

    bulletrain76 Maven (1,311) Nov 6, 2007 California

    That final gravity might be about right. Mashing above 150 with that yeast and a substantial amount of crystal malt, that yeast is going to struggle a bit to get through everything.
     
  12. Boonedog

    Boonedog Initiate (0) Apr 10, 2013 Illinois

    You may be correct. I am going to give it another week and bottle. At worse it will be a bit sweet.
     
  13. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    Sam, I took note of “Mashing above 150 …” So, you expect a more fermentable wort with a mash of 150 vs. 152? I specifically ask this since Greg Doss presented results at the 2012 NHC of attenuation vs. temperature and his experiment indicated that fermentability reaches a peak at 153°F:

    • 150°F: Attenuation 83.02%

    • 151°F: Attenuations of 83.02% & 83.96% (two test cases)

    • 153°F: Attenuations of 84.91% & 84.91% (two test cases)
    Greg also tested a large number of Wyeast yeast strains (51 strains in all) for the ability to attenuate the same wort and 1968 is pretty much at the mid-point with a value of 76%; the lowest value is around 74.5% and the upper value is around 79% (excluding 3711).

    Cheers!
     
  14. bulletrain76

    bulletrain76 Maven (1,311) Nov 6, 2007 California

    Pretty much any professional brewing text cites 145F (Well, 63C) as the optimal mash temperature for maximum fermentability. Raising temperature form there will lower fermentability. I'm not familiar with Greg Doss' experiment but it runs counter to established brewing science and I would be curious to see what his methods were.
     
  15. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    If you're an AHA member, you can read his .pdf from the 2012 NHC on the website. Kai Troester did similar work, and found peak single infusion mash wort fermentability at 152F, just 1 degree off from Greg's results. I can't explain why they got different results than whoever first made the claims that ended up in the pro brewing texts.

    I should add that Greg's trials only went down to 146F. Not sure how low Kai went, but it's all on his website.
     
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