A touchy subject...

I'd agree with those saying to make starters when using liquid yeasts. For someone just starting out, dry yeasts like SAF-05, Nottingham, Windsor, etc., make some decent ales, are more potent right out of the package and are generally more user friendly. The only thing they lack is the tremendous variety available with the liquid models.

 

There is some good and true advice in this thread about fermentation temp and yeast health and pitch rate, and these should be his primary plan of attack. But the above sentence really caught my eye. Doubling back and trying a batch with RO water, maybe even bottled and bought, could help eliminate some off flavors that you may be tasting. Slightly different than the bananorama that you describe, but some estery flavors that are very common and even classic in some English brews are directly related to the hard water that is used in certain regions. It is a limiting factor in some of the finest brewing regions of the world.

 

@ Geezerpk: I've mostly used dry yeast, and I seem to be getting better results when I make a starter with those as well. I know the manufacturers say you don't, and even one of the magazines did a blind test with dry, rehydrated and startered, but I can say from my experience that the results are better with the starter.

 

Jr

Perhaps you're making higher gravity beers than I do. Most of mine are 1.065 SG or lower and I always get a vigorous ferment by just hydrating and stirring in. Many claim you don't even need to hydrate. I also have started recycling my yeast by pulling a couple of cups of trub/yeast slurry from fermentor after transferring the beer to the bottling bucket and store in the fridge for the next batch. With the price of the dry yeasts, like Nottingham going to $3.50 and more I appreciate the savings.

 

It's only limiting until you learn how to brew with it. I brew with extremely hard water-without a water softener appliance die within 3 years. I get my brewing water pre softener and brew excellent beer with it, you just have to adjust recipes and know which styles (very few) really need softer water.

 

Actually, it's the other way around - I don't know if I've made one OVER 1.065. I can say that with a similar reecipe, it just tastes better with a starter.

 

exactly

 

Can you point me to where I can find anything relating esters in English ales to the water? I always thought it was the yeast.

 

I pour my chilled wort back and forth between the boil pot and the primary about 5 times through a strainer which helps aerate the wort prior to pitching the yeast.

 

Second hit on a search, no mention of water chemistry.
http://beersensoryscience.wordpress.com/2011/02/04/esters/