Adjuncts in a Dubbel

Discussion in 'Homebrewing' started by crcostel, Dec 21, 2017.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. crcostel

    crcostel Initiate (0) Feb 26, 2006 Illinois

    Was looking at Dubbel recipes and I noticed that two of my favorites had adjuncts. GI Pere Jacques had rye flakes and wheat. New Belgium Abbey ale had oats. I never thought of adding any of those to a Dubbel. Would you or do you all use any?
     
  2. Bryan12345

    Bryan12345 Initiate (0) Mar 17, 2016 Texas

    I could see using oats for mouthfeel. When I think of “adjuncts,” I think of rice and corn for the purpose of kicking up abv more cheaply. A dubbel IMO should be a little unbalanced toward the malty side, so my initial thought would be no rice or corn.

    But hey, try anything once :slight_smile:
     
    dmtaylor likes this.
  3. EvenMoreJesus

    EvenMoreJesus Initiate (0) Jun 8, 2017 Pennsylvania

    Their addition certainly isn't "classic", but definitely not out of the question. What are you looking for with their addition? Increased mouthfeel with better attenuation? If so, add as much as you like.
     
    Yalc likes this.
  4. crcostel

    crcostel Initiate (0) Feb 26, 2006 Illinois

    I wasn't actually looking to add them. I was looking at the grain bills those beers had for guidance and was surprised to find oat/wheat/rye.

    That being said, my current recipe has a higher percentage of candi syrup than I did last time so some oats might balance it out a bit.
     
  5. dmtaylor

    dmtaylor Savant (1,149) Dec 30, 2003 Wisconsin

    Wheat, rye, and oats are great foam enhancers. Without them a dubbel might have little head and not creamy. I'd say these grains are optional but not a bad idea.
     
    VikeMan and crcostel like this.
  6. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    Wheat - Check
    Rye - Check
    (Flaked) Oats - In my experience, not really. Possibly because they are loaded will foam negative lipids working against the foam positive proteins. I haven't used Malted Oats or Raw Whole Oats enough to really form an opinion.
     
    Yalc likes this.
  7. JohnnyChicago

    JohnnyChicago Initiate (0) Sep 3, 2010 Illinois

    FWIW, adjuncts are quite common in Dubbels and all abbey ales. Wheat starch is commonly used, and dextrose and candi syrups are used as up to 20% of the fermentables.
    Zero-adjunct beers are extremely uncommon in Belgian style beers.
     
  8. pweis909

    pweis909 Grand Pooh-Bah (3,250) Aug 13, 2005 Wisconsin
    Pooh-Bah

    Of course, candi syrups are common. In addition to adding flavor, they add alcohol without adding body. I always considered this an important element of dubbels. In contrast, I think of adjunct grain as having low flavor impact, but with impacts on body, foam, and/or mouthfeel. The foam effects might be desirable but mouthfeel and body effects seem to run counter to my thinking on the style, but maybe it would add something better than I imagine.
     
    JohnnyChicago likes this.
  9. crcostel

    crcostel Initiate (0) Feb 26, 2006 Illinois

    I meant more rye/wheat/oats vs candi syrup which I mentioned I was upping the percentage of this year.
     
  10. JohnnyChicago

    JohnnyChicago Initiate (0) Sep 3, 2010 Illinois

    You are right. Most Belgian brewers are fighting to decrease the body. Remarkably high attenuation and dry, champagne-like body in a relatively strong beer contributes to the Belgian brewers’ goal of ‘digestible’ beer.

    Attempts to ADD body to an abbey ale would likely seem very strange to a Belgian brewer. But we are Americans, we do what we do!:stuck_out_tongue:
     
  11. crcostel

    crcostel Initiate (0) Feb 26, 2006 Illinois

    This is what I have so far:

    Dubbel V2 (2gal)

    3.75lb Belgian Pilsner
    4oz Caravienne
    3oz Caracrystal wheat (based on Briess Reserve Dubbel Recipe)
    3oz Aromatic
    10oz D90 syrup @10min

    1oz Saaz @45min

    WY1762

    Stats:
    OG: 1.062
    FG: 1.013
    ABV: 6.43%
    IBU: 25.72
    SRM: 19.48
     
  12. JohnnyChicago

    JohnnyChicago Initiate (0) Sep 3, 2010 Illinois

    You certainly could add those body-increasing adjuncts, and it could very well make a beer you prefer (I’m a big believer in brewing whatever makes you happy!:grin:) but it likely won’t win any awards as it a pretty strong deviation from the style guidelines.
    Belgian dubbels, despite their malt flavors and color, are not thick beers

    Westmalle Dubbel for example, contains only 3 malts and finishes at a bone-dry 87% appearant attenuation.
     
  13. pweis909

    pweis909 Grand Pooh-Bah (3,250) Aug 13, 2005 Wisconsin
    Pooh-Bah

    On the other hand, there is Tripel Karmeliet, with wheat and oats, and probably some other commercial examples.. At least some Belgian brewers reputedly do not like to be pigeonholed into beer styles. My own best efforts at dubbels have emphasized dark fruit character with candi syrup and a judicious bit of crystal malt (and mostly pils). So I've kind of pigeonholed myself into thinking this is what dubbels should be.
     
    JohnnyChicago likes this.
  14. JohnnyChicago

    JohnnyChicago Initiate (0) Sep 3, 2010 Illinois

    Yeah, I think they use 3 different flakes grains, plus spices. That beer definitely finishes sweeter than others in its style.
    I am personally, NOT a tripel karmeliet guy. Or a huge fan of similar Belgian beers. I much prefer the ingredient simplicity of something like Duvel, with its pils, saaz. sugar, water, and yeast and all the flavor complexity in the world.

    I’m sure Belgian brewers would also laugh at our ‘style guidelines’ and that’s why I told OP to brew what he likes! But if you are interested in brewing to style, or entering in competitions or whatever, some pigeonholing is sort of necessary, I’d say.
     
    pweis909 likes this.
  15. pweis909

    pweis909 Grand Pooh-Bah (3,250) Aug 13, 2005 Wisconsin
    Pooh-Bah

    Maybe less crystal? If the goal is to understand the carawheat, I'd skip the caravienne and maybe use a lighter syrup.
     
  16. JohnnyChicago

    JohnnyChicago Initiate (0) Sep 3, 2010 Illinois

    Looks pretty good! I would try to get it a little drier personally. And I would use just one crystal malt and adjust color with Carafa.

    I have become a huge fan of Breiss DRC for Belgian and English beers. Not sure where in IL you are, but if you are in the city or burbs, Brew and Grow should have it in stock.
     
  17. crcostel

    crcostel Initiate (0) Feb 26, 2006 Illinois

    Swapped out the Caravienne for 2oz Special B

    My goal actually was to emphasize the candi syrup over specialty grains. But in looking into it I found the wheat/rye which I found intriguing.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.