Was looking at Dubbel recipes and I noticed that two of my favorites had adjuncts. GI Pere Jacques had rye flakes and wheat. New Belgium Abbey ale had oats. I never thought of adding any of those to a Dubbel. Would you or do you all use any?
I could see using oats for mouthfeel. When I think of “adjuncts,” I think of rice and corn for the purpose of kicking up abv more cheaply. A dubbel IMO should be a little unbalanced toward the malty side, so my initial thought would be no rice or corn. But hey, try anything once
Their addition certainly isn't "classic", but definitely not out of the question. What are you looking for with their addition? Increased mouthfeel with better attenuation? If so, add as much as you like.
I wasn't actually looking to add them. I was looking at the grain bills those beers had for guidance and was surprised to find oat/wheat/rye. That being said, my current recipe has a higher percentage of candi syrup than I did last time so some oats might balance it out a bit.
Wheat, rye, and oats are great foam enhancers. Without them a dubbel might have little head and not creamy. I'd say these grains are optional but not a bad idea.
Wheat - Check Rye - Check (Flaked) Oats - In my experience, not really. Possibly because they are loaded will foam negative lipids working against the foam positive proteins. I haven't used Malted Oats or Raw Whole Oats enough to really form an opinion.
FWIW, adjuncts are quite common in Dubbels and all abbey ales. Wheat starch is commonly used, and dextrose and candi syrups are used as up to 20% of the fermentables. Zero-adjunct beers are extremely uncommon in Belgian style beers.
Of course, candi syrups are common. In addition to adding flavor, they add alcohol without adding body. I always considered this an important element of dubbels. In contrast, I think of adjunct grain as having low flavor impact, but with impacts on body, foam, and/or mouthfeel. The foam effects might be desirable but mouthfeel and body effects seem to run counter to my thinking on the style, but maybe it would add something better than I imagine.
I meant more rye/wheat/oats vs candi syrup which I mentioned I was upping the percentage of this year.
You are right. Most Belgian brewers are fighting to decrease the body. Remarkably high attenuation and dry, champagne-like body in a relatively strong beer contributes to the Belgian brewers’ goal of ‘digestible’ beer. Attempts to ADD body to an abbey ale would likely seem very strange to a Belgian brewer. But we are Americans, we do what we do!
This is what I have so far: Dubbel V2 (2gal) 3.75lb Belgian Pilsner 4oz Caravienne 3oz Caracrystal wheat (based on Briess Reserve Dubbel Recipe) 3oz Aromatic 10oz D90 syrup @10min 1oz Saaz @45min WY1762 Stats: OG: 1.062 FG: 1.013 ABV: 6.43% IBU: 25.72 SRM: 19.48
You certainly could add those body-increasing adjuncts, and it could very well make a beer you prefer (I’m a big believer in brewing whatever makes you happy!) but it likely won’t win any awards as it a pretty strong deviation from the style guidelines. Belgian dubbels, despite their malt flavors and color, are not thick beers Westmalle Dubbel for example, contains only 3 malts and finishes at a bone-dry 87% appearant attenuation.
On the other hand, there is Tripel Karmeliet, with wheat and oats, and probably some other commercial examples.. At least some Belgian brewers reputedly do not like to be pigeonholed into beer styles. My own best efforts at dubbels have emphasized dark fruit character with candi syrup and a judicious bit of crystal malt (and mostly pils). So I've kind of pigeonholed myself into thinking this is what dubbels should be.
Yeah, I think they use 3 different flakes grains, plus spices. That beer definitely finishes sweeter than others in its style. I am personally, NOT a tripel karmeliet guy. Or a huge fan of similar Belgian beers. I much prefer the ingredient simplicity of something like Duvel, with its pils, saaz. sugar, water, and yeast and all the flavor complexity in the world. I’m sure Belgian brewers would also laugh at our ‘style guidelines’ and that’s why I told OP to brew what he likes! But if you are interested in brewing to style, or entering in competitions or whatever, some pigeonholing is sort of necessary, I’d say.
Maybe less crystal? If the goal is to understand the carawheat, I'd skip the caravienne and maybe use a lighter syrup.
Looks pretty good! I would try to get it a little drier personally. And I would use just one crystal malt and adjust color with Carafa. I have become a huge fan of Breiss DRC for Belgian and English beers. Not sure where in IL you are, but if you are in the city or burbs, Brew and Grow should have it in stock.
Swapped out the Caravienne for 2oz Special B My goal actually was to emphasize the candi syrup over specialty grains. But in looking into it I found the wheat/rye which I found intriguing.