Are Cans Now Really Better Than Bottles?

The fact that there is CO2 in the bottle has zero influence on the ingress of oxygen into the bottle. Gases flow based upon partial pressures (i.e., the concentration of oxygen inside the bottle and the concentration of oxygen outside the bottle) and the rate of diffusion is defined by Fick's Law of Diffusion (do you remember that from your science classes?).

My homebrewed beers are bottle conditioned (i.e., they have live yeast in them). Bottle conditioned beers resist staling since there are live yeast in the bottle. I can 'get away' with using regular caps since I can rely on the yeast to 'do its thing'. I recently acquired some oxygen scavenging caps since that was the only type being sold at my LHBS on a recent visit. I have a batch of IPA were I used regular caps on some bottles and the oxygen scavenging caps on other bottles (I marked these caps to keep track). I have noticed zero difference in how this batch is keeping (e.g., hop aroma fade) between the two types of caps; I attribute this to the bottle conditioning (live yeast) effect.

If I were to produce commercial type beer (i.e., no live yeast in the bottle) I would most definitely purchase oxygen scavenging caps for those bottled beers.

Yeah, I am gonna have to disagree with you here.

Cheers!

 

They have probably gotten better, but beer cans have been a good container for beer for a very long time, at least back to the late '60s/early '70s. I believe that by and large, glass is still considered to be the superior (though less convenient) form of packaging.
Now that lower cost canning lines and lower minimum can orders have become more available, the process has become considerably less cost prohibitive for smaller brewers. I still believe that 30 years ago, craft brewers secretly wished they could can their products (and one craft brewer I spoke with in the late '80s actually made no secret about it, citing cost as the only limiting factor).
So a lot of the anti can sentiment we were hearing in the earlier years of craft beer was merely "spin". Small brewers for the most part did look down upon the lowly can, and some of them put a bit of marketing effort into hyping the superiority of the glass bottle simply because back then a canning line was too expensive to implement. Nowadays canned beer seems to be the greatest thing since sliced bread and is looked upon as something very hip. Now it's cans that are getting the positive hype.

 

Cans are better in almost every aspect, period.

 

I can see that you are a man of many words!

Cheers to you sir!!

 

I drink most of those 16 oz can beers right out of the can. I think the less it's exposed to oxygen the higher nose and taste retention you get. I use glass to obviously, but Im not a fanatic about it.

 

The artwork on some cans more than makes up for that though, would you agree?

 

Cans are a lot easier to ship when I find myself breaking the law and shipping beer (mostly due to lost football bets...)

 

There is also the environmental impact of cans. I don't much about the topic myself, but Lagunitas is pretty familiar with it.

You can read about their feelings here: http://www.beerpulse.com/2012/04/la...-last-brewery-in-the-us-to-use-aluminum-cans/

I've wondered how @woodychandler feels about this

 

They do seem to have undeniable benefits. I would be hesitant to buy a can conditioned lambic though.. sounds a bit strange.

 

Better long term storage of high alcohol beers.
Environmentally glass is better than aluminum.
Glass can be more successfully stored with unfinished product (I hear this sometimes happens to other folks) by carbon dioxide add. and recapping.
Better to contain bottle conditioned beers with high carbonation.

I know you said one, but...

 

A number of folks have detailed having positive experiences in aging cans of Ten Fidy. Maybe cans are just as good from a cellaring perspective.

The whole glass vs. can and environmental 'debate' is dependent on a gazillion assumptions and how broadly you perform the analysis/assessment. There is no definitive 'winner' here. It is sort of watching a debate between politicians where politician A quotes statistics that support his position and the other politician quoting statistics that support their position; when you factor in the statistics which get published with no or minimal supporting facts it just gets more 'interesting'.

Until somebody decides to make 'heavy duty' cans maybe this is the "one": "Better to contain bottle conditioned beers with high carbonation."

Cheers!

 

Not really. I am sure you have read through these before forming your opinion, but maybe others haven't

https://www.google.com/webhp?source...=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=bauxite mining disasters

Glass is made from sand. It needs to be melted just as does aluminum. The fuel used to transport bauxite, the chemicals needed to process bauxite, and the aluminum itself is far in excess of glass.

Yes, one needs to assume using a whole lot more fuel and a whole lot more poisonous chemicals, and creating toxic byproducts that cause environmental disasters, as needed for aluminum, is bad. I assume that is the gazillion assumptions?

I am certainly always looking for opposing viewpoints that are superior to my own understandings, though.

Cheers!

 

Lol, good points.

When I'm thinking cans I'm thinking stuff I'm going to drink fairly quickly. As to long term storage all my stuff is bottled , so not a clue. So the one exception may very well be aging beers in glass not cans. Cans can be recycled too, the cheap shit comes with screw caps they can be resealed very easily. The light protection and reduced oxygen still is the big plus. And they're pool and beach friendly, where bottles get poured out or your asked to leave.

 

That article is over three years old and a year after it appeared, Lagunitas was given to say that they would amend their stance based on CANsumer preference. Hmmm. This reminds me of CANversations that I had with people at both Troegs & Victory BC when they said that they would be the last, also. I type this as I drink their beers from a CAN.

I hear this kind of stuff all the time. It CAN become tiresome since the people defending glass bottles put forth the idea of reuse vs recycling. This ignores the preponderance of screw-top bottles, which are neither reusable nor economical. When I was a lad, bottles came in reusable cardboard cases, were made of heavy glass, included a deposit for their hopeful return & often actually were sterilized and reused. Those are from the age of the dinosaur. Straub Brewery in St. Marys, PA was one of the last to use returnable glass bottles and got out of the business because they became cost prohibitive. Glass bottles now get thrown into the recycling bin, are crushed/broken and melted down before making new bottles. I would not be averse to the return of refillable bottles, but in today's eCANomy, it is unlikely to happen.

At least with CANs, there is a small economical incentive to collect the spent CANtainers and get them into the recycling stream. I am not arguing that bauxite mining is hard on the environment, but if more CANs got recycled, less of it would need to be mined.

I also agree that kegs are absolutely the best medium. They CAN (& should) be returned, cleaned & refilled, creating the endless cycle of which the returnable, refillable glass bottle crowd dreams. I would cry if draft beer from a keg were to go away. I will not shed even one tear for the demise of screw-top bottles.

My $0.02 worth.

 

Lots of differing things available via web searches on all manner of topics.

Cheers!

 

I have no evidence to support my bias, but I tend to believe that cans are fresher longer than bottles. And they fridge easier.

 

They're lighter, they don't break, no caps to pop might they also be better as trading material?

 

Not one mention of BPA yet. A substance that is banned in baby bottles, causes disease in lab rats, that we 100% know seeps into beer and food. Impact on a grown human? Inconclusive. Could be nothing, could be overall harmless. But unless I am specifically heading to the pool, I'll take good ol' inert brown glass, from a local brewery, kept cold and out of direct light. 95% of my beer is consumed from a glass, why add a chemical I don't need to?

 

You win the thread

 

Whether or not they are better, given a choice I choose cans. For the lighter weight (I usually buy my beer by the case) and efficiency with space. They are just easier to carry. I have no problems with people who prefer bottles, as long they share one with me