Bad Trader: @evilhead

Tagging @evilhead for you.

 

did you use the trade system? Also, what is going on @evilhead

 

Lack of communication is awful but hold out some hope it may still arrive tomorrow. I have a packaged in route to me that was sent out right after Christmas that has been delayed and pushed back until tomorrow. Lot of crazy weather out there causing delays.

 

@homerunhitter7, if you don't hear anything soon let me know and I'll help to contact him. Done multiple trades with him in the past and there was never an issue. As stated the weather could be an issue plus keep in mind the holidays have a big impact on shipping schedules. California to Illinois always took a little extra time shipping in my experiences.

 

Seems really quick to be creating a bad trader thread. Did you reach out to him again before creating this thread? Did you try texting him or emailing him?

See guidelines for creating a bad trader thread, on the surface seems like this one doesn't meet the critertia.

<<
Was the trade conducted on BeerAdvocate?

• Is your trade partner's account verified?
  
• Did you use the Feedback System?
• Was beer shipped, either by you or the trade partner?
• Have you given them a chance to make it right?
• Have you exhausted all methods of contact?

If you answered NO to any of the above, don't post a bad trader thread. (Exception: It Forward threads, in some cases.)

If you answered YES to ALL of the above, continue.>>

 

His communication was not perfect, but he is not a bad trader. IMHO this thread have never beer started in first place and should be deleted.

 

This is got to stop. People are not following the rules and posting these threads when they shouldn't have. Can you take action @F2brewers @blue-dream ? Reputations should not be ruined because of people jumping the gun (without following the rules).

 

WOW @homerunhitter7 ...after one week during the holidays, no less, you thought this was your next best action??

Maybe next time spend time getting info up front to help yourself like:
-An actual send date or at least an approximation
-Use the trading system that is in place & don't ship until it has been accepted
-Phone number which you need anyways if you use Fedex
-Some patience
-Understanding that other people's lives aren't the same as yours so it may not be as quick & easy to get a box out with holiday responsibilities

Any number of these would have helped to tone down your inner chaos that led you to post this so quickly

 

Whoa guys, don't shred the dude for jumping the gun a little on starting this thread! He has 6 total trades on Beer Advocate, and had sent out a Prop and a Regal Rye and hadn't got a shipping number for a week. His trade partner should have communicated about the delay (but is absolutely not a bad trader)...

Yes, I agree, this shouldn't exist as a bad trader thread, but since when as a community did we start giving less experienced traders grief who might have gotten worried after a week (which is a quite a bit of time really) of no communication? I would be pretty darn worried too if I had sent out a relatively expensive and hard to get box and hadn't heard anything for a week...

Summary - not a bad trader, also not an illegitimate concern about a week delay. I agree, delete the thread, but don't give the guy grief for being worried about his beer!

 

I am almost to the point that when folks post this I start thinking whatever happens is 50+% their own fault. Is there some good reason folks act this careless and stupid?

 

No need to toss around hostility at a newer trader who doesn't know the ropes as well as those of us who've been around since the dawn of time.

And, as usual, this thread would not have been necessary without a bit of communication from the accused.

 

Don't quite buy into this. Being new doesn't apply here. @homerunhitter7 has been a member since 2014, has at least six trades under his belt (first one in 2014), and knew where to put a bad trader thread. That means he probably read other bad trader threads and saw Jason's How to Create a Bad Trader Thread that is listed under Beer Trading. What he should have done is messaged one of the mods to ask what to do if he wasn't sure. I'm afraid that this thread and a previous one has started a new trend of premature posting of Bad Trader threads to expedite trades without doing the proper steps. /rant

 

Totally understandable. You didn't exploit the system; at worst you posted this thread a little early, but to be honest, a minute of effort from your partner to send a note and all this would have been avoided... Frankly, if it wasn't for the holidays I wouldn't even say you created this early - a week is a long time to not hear back about a trade.

The fact you didn't have their cell number or email is absolutely not your fault either - they could have provided it without you asking - I always include my cell number when I give my address / organize an IP trade.

The flip side to all this, is you see bad trader threads where people waited weeks and weeks, and other traders got burned in the interim - there is no right answer to how long you should wait without any response from your trade partner... A few days is too soon, but a few weeks is definitely too long.

 

Plain and simple, the OP didn't follow the rules of posting a bad trader thread and as a result of this someone who is not a bad trader has a thread dedicated to them being a bad trader.

If everyone who trades started making bad trader threads when communication was perceived to be less than perfect this forum would be littered with threads.

 

Mixed feelings on this one. While it certainly seems like this is the second recent instance of somebody jumping the gun on a bad trader thread, it seems awfully coincidental that in both cases the "bad" trader responded pretty quickly once the thread was posted after being AWOL for some time...

If I were OP in this case I think I would've BM'd my trade partner letting him know that if I don't hear within X hours I'll have to post a thread.

 

Just because you have been on the site for a few years doesn't make you an expert trader. If bad trader threads are reserved for massive delays or people who are outright dicking / stealing / whatever then we essentially eliminate all possibility of the community helping move a trade along and actually successfully resolving. Yes, there was the holidays, but a week is still a week, and that is a long time to not hear anything - not so much as a 'sorry, holidays have been crazy, will ship your box Monday, my bad!'

It takes less than a minute to send a quick note to update your partner. If I didn't respond to a trade partner (who has my address and we have agreed to everything) in a week I would not be upset about a bad trader thread with my name in the title. I would be on here in an instant and apologizing.

Besides, the last 3 bad trader threads before this one were absolutely legit, so I don't know about this being a trend.
- thebrewbrotha turned out to be an absolute shark who completely screwed someone
- gonzohomebrewer has had really bad shipping delays twice now and left a dude hanging for over a month
- hiphopshooray was banned mid trade for being a huge douche (as far as I can tell) and posting spam

If there are threads being posted about a 2 day delay with zero follow up, then sure, but that isn't really happening yet...

 

Not sure what you mean about not following the rules here, as they aren't exactly black and white. He waited a week, and didn't have any other way to contact the trader. Is it a rule now that you shouldn't ship without getting emails and phone numbers? How long are people supposed to wait for someone to have the basic courtesy of an update? How many messages do they have to send without a response?

Obviously I haven't seen the discussions they had and all the specifics, but at face value (taking the OP at their word) a trade was agreed, addresses exchanged and a box shipped with a tracking number and then no response at all for a week. Not so much as a 'shit sorry dude I haven't forgotten, I will get this to you asap'

Lets be clear - leaving your trade partner hanging for a week is not what a good trader does. Sure, he isn't a bad trader, but even with the holidays, a week is getting up there in terms of hearing nothing back from someone.