Ballantine IPA

Discussion in 'Beer Talk' started by 57md, Mar 25, 2019.

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  1. 57md

    57md Grand Pooh-Bah (3,009) Aug 22, 2011 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah Society

    Can anyone explain why Pabst decided to discontinue Ballantine IPA?

    I know that some folks do not like anything made by a macro-brewery but I really enjoyed this beer and it was readily available at a great price for the last few years. I will miss it.

    Also, does anyone know if Pabst still plans to brew Ballantine Burton? This is another beer that I enjoy very much.
     
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  2. jesskidden

    jesskidden Grand Pooh-Bah (3,071) Aug 10, 2005 New Jersey
    Pooh-Bah Society Trader

    Well, the simplest answer is likely the truest - it just didn't sell in the quantities they expected. Part of that reason was they and their distributors didn't market the beer correctly, even though they did get lots of press (free, the kind Pabst likes) and spent a fair amount (for Pabst) on promotional events, POP items and other swag, etc.

    Although Ballantine India Pale Ale took on an larger reputation during the "craft era" than it probably ever had pre-1972, most of that was among the brewers and writers, not the mostly younger craft beer drinkers. Falstaff and successor Pabst, if anything, helped ruin it by both cheapening the IPA in the 1970-90s as well as the "Ballantine" brand itself, where they turned the only beer left, Ballantine XXX Ale, into a poor product which they tended to market in the "40's - malt liquor" segment.

    Pabst has even dropped both Ballantine XXX and IPA logos from their corporation PORTFOLIO webpage and killed both ales' websites. I also noticed the other day that Pabst's masterbrewer who was behind the revived Ballantine Ales and their promotion, Greg Deuhs, is no longer at the company as of Sept. '18.

    Well, it was brewed at Cold Spring's new Third St. Brewhouse and used the original P. Ballantine & Sons name as a 'dba' - not so sure the average craft drinker (as opposed to the geekery who read the advance press and knew the history, etc) would have known it was a contract-brewed Pabst product.

    OTOH, the original drinkers of the Newark-brewed IPA are all well-over 60 - not sure there was much attempt to reach them.

    At this point, Pabst is not even a "macro-sized" brewing company, by the Brewers Association of "small = under 6M bbl" definition.

    Supposedly (I've read two different stories from Pabst's people) there was still some Burton Ale in Cold Spring, aging in both bottles (2015 and 2016) and some aging in bulk tanks, on wood and hops - that was summer '17, tho'. Unlikely they'd brew more. They were going to release some of it as a "vintage-dated" product (last?) Christmas but I - in what was once Ballantine's home market - never saw it.
     
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  3. Giantspace

    Giantspace Pooh-Bah (2,879) Dec 22, 2011 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah Society

    I did enjoy the IPA and the few times I saw it on draft it was priced like a macro. I remember a case for under $30.

    I still have 4-5 Burton left from the first year they brought it back. A bit sweet for me but I do have a few each year. It was a bit pricey at $44 a case. I would not revisit this one.

    Enjoy
     
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  4. Amendm

    Amendm Pooh-Bah (2,305) Jun 7, 2018 Rhode Island
    Pooh-Bah Society

    XXX was my 1st taste of Ale, sneaked a sip from my granddaddies' bottle.
    Classified as a Blonde Ale...always assumed it was a Pale Ale.
    I’m going to try to find a bottle before its all gone.
     
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  5. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,181) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah Society

    How long ago was that?

    Cheers!
     
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  6. Amendm

    Amendm Pooh-Bah (2,305) Jun 7, 2018 Rhode Island
    Pooh-Bah Society

    5 decades, and it was likely better back then.
    Prost.
     
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  7. jesskidden

    jesskidden Grand Pooh-Bah (3,071) Aug 10, 2005 New Jersey
    Pooh-Bah Society Trader

    Uh, the Ballantine XXX Ale that MillerCoors brews for Pabst is not one of the beers being discussed (Ballantine India Pale Ale and Burton Ale) and, even though it's been missing from Pabst's Portfolio page, it's still being marketed. Should be pretty easy to find in RI - it's "second home" after Newark closed, and New England in general was a big market for the original brewery and for Falstaff's version. But, with a Pabst beer, ya never know.

    Well, when P. Ballantine & Sons was around, there was no such thing as a "Blonde Ale" style in the US. The beer (post-Repeal) was modeled after the hoppy, sparkling (aka "cream" or "brilliant") ales brewed in Canada during Repeal.
    Understatement of the year... it is a disgrace to the label.
     
  8. dennis3951

    dennis3951 Initiate (0) Mar 6, 2008 New Jersey

    Most of the people who were buying Ballantine XXX Ale when it was brewed in Newark were already in there 60's in the late 60's. It wasn't your fathers beer. It was your grandfathers beer. At least in North NJ.
     
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  9. jesskidden

    jesskidden Grand Pooh-Bah (3,071) Aug 10, 2005 New Jersey
    Pooh-Bah Society Trader

    Well, yeah, it literally was "my father's beer"...:wink: (but by the '60s, we'd moved out of Irvington to central Jersey).

    But this was not my mother:
    [​IMG]
    And the ol' man probably didn't like this woman's music ("Turn that !@#$ down!") - Well, maybe "Me & Bobby McGee" 'cause he did like Kristofferson ---but, if offered, he would have taken one of those ales from her, I bet:
    [​IMG]
     
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  10. tjwarren

    tjwarren Initiate (0) Dec 31, 2008 Ohio

    So sad to hear. Glad I drove to PA to get a case last year. I really enjoyed it.
     
  11. anfield86

    anfield86 Pooh-Bah (2,594) Nov 21, 2006 New Jersey
    Pooh-Bah Society Trader

    Probably the same reason they shit canned Old Tankard Ale: it didn't sell.

    (which sucks because i loved that friggin' beer)
     
    #11 anfield86, Mar 26, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2019
  12. Bitterbill

    Bitterbill Grand High Pooh-Bah (6,772) Sep 14, 2002 Wyoming
    Pooh-Bah Society

    Ditto to the OT. It would have been a regular in my rotation.
     
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  13. rgordon

    rgordon Pooh-Bah (2,677) Apr 26, 2012 North Carolina
    Pooh-Bah Society

    OK then. We bought Ballantine Beer at Standard Drug in Richmond for $.79 a sixer back in 69-70. It was good enough for our budget. But we also drank Lowenbrau draft at Lums, found Ringnes for $3.99 a sixer and still found time for Red Cap Ale.We cherished National Premium a few years later, but the Ballantine line-up was very strange indeed. Looking back, the ale was an outlier and a remnant.
     
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  14. jesskidden

    jesskidden Grand Pooh-Bah (3,071) Aug 10, 2005 New Jersey
    Pooh-Bah Society Trader

    Yeah, the beer which was known as an old-fashioned "heavy" lager eventually got a bad rep thanks to messing around with the recipe to make it lighter (like most other AALs of the era) in the mid-60s - which only aggrevated the customers they had left and didn't re-capture any of their old market. And changing it back didn't help, so they brought it down to below-premium prices in the outer areas of their Northeast distro region - eventually even bringing out an even cheaper beer called MUNICH ("Aged in the Wood", tho', in some of their horizontal oak casks).

    The XXX Ale was typically sold in the premium segment (probably still is?) and a coast to coast distro region, tho' that was shrinking by the end of the decade, with the IPA sold even higher but not nearly as much as some other US "super-premiums" like Michelob. (IPA's price started jumping under Falstaff ownership even as the dumbed down and cheapened it - lower abv & ibu's, shortened the aging period. )
     
  15. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,181) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah Society

    The closest I ever got to a 1960's era Ballantine beer is this:

    [​IMG]

    My house was built in 1961 and during remodeling a Contractor found this can in the wall between two joists. Apparently one of the home builders had a beer with his lunch!?!:rolling_eyes:

    An interesting aspect to this can is the top of the can:

    [​IMG]

    @jesskidden, did the breweries have different cans for each state or was this just a PA thing?

    Cheers!
     
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  16. Ranbot

    Ranbot Pooh-Bah (2,389) Nov 27, 2006 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah Society

    Jack, was that can unopened?
     
  17. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,181) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah Society

    No, it is opened. The home building person decided to open the 'bottom' of the can for some reason (didn't want to drink from the 'inked' side?). This is an old fashioned can in that you needed a can opener ('church key') to open the can.

    Sometime later canned beers had pull tabs installed on the top. I would be willing to bet that @jesskidden knows what year that Ballantine cans would have had pull tabs.

    Cheers!
     
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  18. jesskidden

    jesskidden Grand Pooh-Bah (3,071) Aug 10, 2005 New Jersey
    Pooh-Bah Society Trader

    Well, not every state collected their excise or other beverage tax that way, but a few others still did - "stamps" on kegs, "tax paid" crowns or can lids.

    Similar to the ink stamp on the bottom of cigarette packs.
    "'
     
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  19. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,181) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah Society

    How was this 'managed' at the brewery? Did they have a bunch of different cans with the proper markings and then have to make sure they were delivered to the appropriate state(s)?

    Cheers!
     
  20. jesskidden

    jesskidden Grand Pooh-Bah (3,071) Aug 10, 2005 New Jersey
    Pooh-Bah Society Trader

    Not cans, just the lids. Those 2-ended cans came in with one end attached - the brewer filled and crimped on the other end w/tax stamp (when required ).

    Not sure how it was arranged. IIRC, for crowns, some brewers used the same generic cap if they sold beer in that state, others were "branded". Probably the same for most cans, except for Ballantine's copper colored cans. I guess it was up to if the brewer wanted to spend the extra printing cost.

    No harder to manage than the various different labeling requirements that were once more common than they are today.
     
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