Barleywine Appreciation Thread (2022)

Sorry for the long post. This will probably come across as a rant but I promise it isn't meant to read like one.

The two so-called styles do not work as rigid black and white things even though people talk about them as if they were. If one just drinks Bigfoot and Fuller's Vintage Ale (never mind that that beer is classified here as an "old ale" for unknown reasons... but I'm picking an English beer one can actually buy in the US), then that drinker will surely think that the American and English beers are certainly different styles. But Bigfoot and Fuller's Vintage are just two specific beers on various ends of the spectrum and do not represent all of the shades of beers that can be in the barley wine camp. If the classification here insists on dividing between two barley wine styles, then going by something as subjective as reading beer reviews will not be a good way of dividing all of the beers that exist between the two extremes. One should look at what the brewer calls it, the ingredients used, and the country of origin for something more black and white to go along with this black and white method of classification.

Hop choice is the clearest and common distinction used by people to differentiate such beers. Looking at the beers in the above posts - The hops in Black Hog Brewing Bacchanalian Barleywine are Cascade, Bravo, US Goldens, Centennial, Willamette and the beer is (to use the brewer's word's) "an orgy of American and British Malts, Hops, & Yeast." Tree House Tree of Life uses "traditional American bittering hops" and is described by the brewer as "an American Barleywine." Do I personally think that American hops automatically make a beer "American" in style? No. But my take is irrelevant because I don't like how the category is divided in two anyway. Regardless, there are going to be beers that fall into the "American" style that don't drink like Bigfoot. Heck, I don't think any beer drinks just like Bigfoot.

One beer on BA that always amuses me regarding classification is Anchor Old Foghorn, which is a classic Cascade dry-hopped beer classified here as "English." I suppose the thinking is that it's not as extreme as Bigfoot, but this is the beer that frickin' kicked off the entire craft beer "American" barley wine thing. BA doesn't classify Liberty Ale as an English pale ale even if it doesn't really resemble a modern American IPA. Even the BJCP gets it right by including Foghorn in their American category. Nonetheless, the BA classification means that people leave reviews claiming things along the lines of "nice, but I prefer American barley wines more."

Regarding the barrel treatment question, I'm really on the opposite end of thinking from most people. Brewers in the UK were experimenting with aging beer in spirit barrels for a long time (with even the first Thomas Hardy's Ale aged in sherry barrels... and aging beer in wood is clearly a major part of UK brewing tradition), but the entire "bourbon barrel aged" barley wine phenomenon (and the intention of such aging) really points to a product of American culture... not English. When an American brewer claims that their BBA barley wine is "English style," I don't like it. So what if the hop choice, character or balance is more in line with what style guides consider "English?" Why go out of the way to claim that it is "English style" if the beer resembles popular American practices more than what one considers an "English style" beer? Haven't the scales very clearly tipped in the other direction? Doesn't this barrel aging have a huge impact on the character of the beer... potentially more than where the hops were grown? Such beers have become an American convention. English brewers making BBA barley wines are making beers inspired by American beer. Unfortunately, we don't recognize this because we have a falsely rigid idea of beer styles. The thinking is that American barley wine is defined by hops. The landscape changes though. Is that really the only thing that can define the American barley wine? (The current convention is that this is more or less the case.)

Goose Island claims that their Bourbon County Brand Barleywine is a "traditional English-style barleywine." Is it? One can't honestly answer "yes." If a US brewer aged a pilsner in bourbon barrels with the intention of the beer taking on the flavor of bourbon touched wood, would they claim it was a "traditional Czech-style pilsner?" What if the American pilsner brewer used a pitch lined barrel instead? If there is such a thing as American barley wine, then both Anchor Old Foghorn and Goose Island BCB Barleywine are clearly in that family in my eyes. (I started this post by stating: "The two so-called styles do not work as rigid black and white things even though people talk about them as if they were"... and I am aware that it seems like I haven't taken my own medicine, but I still believe that statement. I think this post proves just how imperfect I am.)

 

Because no one demanded it, tonight’s barley wine is 2022 Bigfoot in a Stange.

 

My favorite Barleywine on tap to date is Eppigs Barleywine which was nothing like what I'm used to in a barleywine

Had Brew3k on tap not too long ago and it's among my least favorite. It just tasted like date syrup or something along those lines. Just Wayy too syrupy and became a chore to finish a 6oz pour.
Old guardian is always great , i always buy it when i see it at Stone Taproom
Treehouse Tree Of Life was a great barleywine blend .
El Segundos Old Jetty is for sure slept on, but it always wins medals and is their most awarded beer. It's among my top favorite BA Barlwywines
. Have never been too big a fan of Bigfoot but i always buy a single bottle when i can.
I have 2 bottles of Brew5000 I'll open one soon to see if i like it better than brew 3000.
I also recently got 2 StraightJackets from a good buddy and I'll open that realll soon

While i mostly prefer Stouts ,the wife likes Barleywines ,Sours and Farmhouse/Saison shit so i grab them from time to time.

 

I think this post also proves how imperfect styles are in beer.

Nevertheless, I prefer to have some sort of rubric to grade when compared against. It's grey array in the sorting line now, vs. grey area in everyone's scores (with no style.) But, for me, that style establishes some degree of certainty in what product I'm picking up.

How does the BJCP approach barleywines? It may very well be the same as us here, but wanted to ask for the sake of discussion. Lastly, how would you divide up these styles? Our two styles, plus BA versions of each?

P.S. rant away on the topic. Barleywines are my favorite. Happy to read more about them.

 

Never got to try the BA version but I loved regular Mouflan; hopefully it will come back sometime.

Your post reminded me that I have a have 2015 BA Bigfoot hanging around still. Thank you for that.

 

In all seriousness, I wrote the post in the spirit of fun nerdy conversation rather than a rant. If you take away American barley wines, and just look at English beers that people tend to consider barley wines, there's a lot of variety there rather than some monolithic style idea. ABV, color, IBU, adjuncts, yeast choice, hop choice, aging and blending... they are all over the place.

Regarding your question of how I would divide barley wines, I'm on the totally other end of the spectrum. I just think all such beers are "strong ales"... be it an American "barleywine," an English barley wine, a Scotch ale, etc. They are all various beers in one style. Nobody here will find that useful and that's fine. I still use those terms though - specifically barley wine because I enjoy the term. It's a romantic attachment and I can be romantic about beer... but it's all just strong ale. Any opinions that I expressed about whether a particular beer is an English or American style barley wine were only for a system and marketplace that divides the two to begin with.

 

How so?

 

It is ironic, given my status as a self-avowed, self-described hophead, but I prefer the more traditional English Barleywines with their emphasis on toffee-like malts. I'm so ashamed. 8=(

 

As you should be, but not necessarily because of the English Barleywine love.

 

The American barleywine drinks like an imperial red ale, imo. That kind of defeats the purpose of what a barleywine is supposed to be. It should be a showcase of barley, similar to a wheatwine's featuring of wheat. When you load it up with pine/resin/bitter hops you erase the flavors and nuances that barley has given the ale.

 

I had trouble getting into barleywines despite trying for decades. Somewhat recently two barley wines tripped something in my palate: Nemesis from Founders and Straitjacket by the marvelous Revolution. Now it’s off to the races.

 

I've posted this pic before, but it's one of my favorite beer ads. The red diamond sign signifies the beer.

 

A coworker of mine hated barleywines until I gave them a sip of a pour of Reuben's Three Ryes Men. We also split a bottle of Sucuba (~2 years of age on it) during that visit. Those two re-wrote what he thought about barleywines. Perhaps another one worth visiting.

 

agree - I looked at my tasting notes for all of the BC Barleywines I've tasted and they are all sweet. Thanks for the clarification - Cheers.

 

I have pFreim, MoAS, and Wendigo just waiting for this thread. I love the English iterations, I find the American variety can get a weird note in the hop flavors that I just don't enjoy. Once those hops oxidize the generic grapefruit pith flavor dominates and it's rubbish to me.

 

English, and it's not even remotely close! The incredible depth and complexity of the style is only rivaled by gueuze, in my opinion. There are so many layers to a (good) English barleywine. The malts bring out notes of toffee, tobacco, leather, caramel, figs, plums, raisins, pralines, chocolate, vanilla, coffee, and more! Conversely, American barleywines are much more straight forward, and tend to be one (or two) note beers, mostly featuring high booze and/or hop flavors, while generally lacking nuance. I do enjoy them, and there are some examples that are excellent and rival their English counterparts, but overall they are the inferior barleywine.

 

Question for all you Barleywine gurus - Harvest Ale is my top o’ the mountain English BW - I’ve had more vintages and variants than any other. I had this 1988 vintage in 2019 and it was in absolute top form - describing it as a complex mesh of sweet/dark fruits and a finish tasting like emulsified dust from my grade school Rawlings baseball glove (Mike Schmidt signed - a truly endearing reference!). Anyway - I see that Harvest Ale has been commonly released throughout the years with different labels (see alt version of my prized 88 bottle below). I’ve also noticed some very old vintages showing up at my local over the past few years in what appears to be brand new packaging. Anybody know JW Lees release protocols? It’s seems they keep some amount of beer in long term storage after initial packaging for future bottle and keg release. Is this a measurable thing or totally ad hoc? Cheers all - best BA thread in a long time.

 

Speaking of Barleywine. I completely forgot I have this bottle of locally made Cherry Street 12.12.12 in my fridge. An English style aged in bourbon barrels. Very young obviously, but I'm dying to try it.