Barrel Aging with WLP653 Brettanomyces lambicus

Discussion in 'Homebrewing' started by the_owl, Mar 3, 2020.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. the_owl

    the_owl Initiate (0) Feb 21, 2019 New Mexico

    So a local brewery had some Jim Beam barrels for sale after they finished an imperial red. I grabbed one thinking I would finally try my hand at a barrel aged brew.
    The plan was to brew two days in a row, on 2 grainfathers and a 10 gallon regular 3 vessel system.
    After much contemplation and expense, I decided I would just buy a 10 gallon whiskey barrel off etsy (much cheaper than the cost of being able to ferment 50 gallons at one time).

    The plan is to do a big saison with white labs 565. start it at 75 or so, and when it gets within a few points of being done, force transfer it to the barrel and pitch the 653 yeast.

    1. Should the barrel bother with an air lock or just fully cork it?
    2. How should I prep this barrel for holding my beer?
    3. What temp should I attempt to keep this barrel at?
    4. This shouldnt be a sour, just a brett right?

    OG 1.080
    FG 1.016
    Color 33.8 EBC
    Bitterness 44.7 IBU
    Alcohol 8.4% ABV
     
  2. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    You're planning to move the beer before the sacch yeast fermentation is finished, and you're also adding Brett, which will take the gravity down even further than the sacch yeast would. Unless you have done some pretty heavy duty math, I would make sure any excess pressure can escape.

    Assuming there are no bugs in your barrel and that your sanitation is good, no, this shouldn't be a sour.
     
    PapaGoose03 likes this.
  3. the_owl

    the_owl Initiate (0) Feb 21, 2019 New Mexico

    I'm going to splash 180. Degree water with star San before I transfer. I'm thinking (math'd) it will drop .04 . I plan on transferring at 1.014. I think a air lock is a safe bet . Thanks
     
  4. the_owl

    the_owl Initiate (0) Feb 21, 2019 New Mexico

    Edit, those fg numbers don't assume the 653 Brett yeast
     
  5. Supergenious

    Supergenious Maven (1,273) May 9, 2011 Michigan

    Air lock is a good idea.
    I’ve only used 1 barrel so far (So I’m no expert in this area), but I prepped by dumping a bottle of bourbon in it. I left the bourbon in it for about a week and kept rotating it whenever I could. This served 2 purposes: the alcohol helped sanitize the barrel, and gave it more bourbon flavor.
     
    PapaGoose03 and riptorn like this.
  6. Davl22

    Davl22 Maven (1,341) Sep 27, 2011 New Hampshire
    Trader

    How long are you planning on aging the beer? I've never barrel aged home-brew, but everything I've read and heard about aging wild ales in bourbon barrels is that it's a pain in the ass because bourbon barrels specifically allow greater oxygen ingress which inevitably leads to acetic acid development by the brett. I'd purge the barrel with CO2, and possibly even top off after awhile if you're letting it age long term. Definitely report back. I'd love to hear how this turns out.
     
    MrOH and PapaGoose03 like this.
  7. Brewday

    Brewday Zealot (721) Dec 25, 2015 New York

    From what i read almost everyone says don't use any chemicals, just really hot water or steam and roll the barrel with the same water everyday to check for leaks.
     
    PapaGoose03 likes this.
  8. Eggman20

    Eggman20 Crusader (433) Feb 14, 2017 Minnesota

    Yeah I'd agree with this. If the barrel has been freshly dumped you likely don't need to treat the barrel at all but I always like to put some hot water into it to be safe and to check for leaks/help re-hydrate the wood. If you are very confident in the barrel being leak free but still wanted to do some sanitizing just add Bourbon. Do be prepared for the barrel to leak a little bit. About half of the barrels I've used have had a little leakage on first use.
     
    PapaGoose03 likes this.
  9. the_owl

    the_owl Initiate (0) Feb 21, 2019 New Mexico

    Def going to purge with co2 before transfer. The plan is 6 months in this barrel.
     
  10. wasatchback

    wasatchback Pooh-Bah (1,574) Jan 12, 2014 Tajikistan
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    6 months is a very long time in such a small barrel. I’d check it after 2 months. I’ve never used Lambicus but most Brett’s don’t take that long to drop gravity and create their flavor profile. Your liquid to oak ratio and amount of O2 ingress is considerably higher than the normal size whiskey or wine barrels. You will see a significant increase in oxygen derived compounds (which is what you’re going for with the barrel anyway) in a much shorter time.

    If that barrel you buy off Etsy isn’t freshly dumped you might have a rather difficult time even getting it to hold liquid. If it is freshly dumped you’re gonna get a bunch of spirit character on the first turn. Subsequent fills will result in less.

    Bourbon/Whiskey barrels are generally the worst when it comes to leaking.

    You can buy breathable bungs. I wouldn’t bother with the airlock personally. It’ll just go dry and you’ll be having to monitor it. The Brett fermentation will be so slow anyways, the breathable bung is all you need.

    Personally on a home brew scale I don’t think barrels are really worth it. If you want oak character use some oak cubes. If you want added complexity from micro oxidation there are better, less expensive ways to achieve it.
     
  11. the_owl

    the_owl Initiate (0) Feb 21, 2019 New Mexico

    The barrel was $100. Certainly cheaper than most of the other brew stuff I've bought. For me this is about learning.
    This may be something I keep doing we'll see. At worst I make some shitty beer. Wouldn't be my first!
     
    Jasonja1474, PapaGoose03 and Eggman20 like this.
  12. Eggman20

    Eggman20 Crusader (433) Feb 14, 2017 Minnesota

    Brewing is all about exploration! Like mentioned above for sure check the beer after a month or so (best if you drill a small hole for tasting and plug it with a stainless steel nail). Smaller barrels will be exposed to a lot more oak than larger barrels.
     
    Jasonja1474 and PapaGoose03 like this.
  13. MrOH

    MrOH Grand Pooh-Bah (3,995) Jul 5, 2010 Virginia
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah

    Am I reading correctly that this barrel has only held Bourbon?
    If so, you may end up with more barrel character than wanted in a Saison, no matter how big it is, if you don't keep it's time in the barrel short. Maybe do a beer with a big body first (Imperial Stout, Wee Heavy, Barleywine, or Quad) that will carry the bourbon flavor a bit better, then have the big Saison on deck to fill the barrel immediately after packaging the initial beer.
     
    Jasonja1474, PapaGoose03 and Davl22 like this.
  14. deadwolfbones

    deadwolfbones Pundit (795) Jun 21, 2014 Oregon

    As someone who's made excellent BBA beers with 5-gallon barrels that I don't think I could have replicated without them, I strongly disagree!

    I also think there's a lot of inherited wisdom about barrels that doesn't match up to the reality.
     
    Jasonja1474, PapaGoose03 and Eggman20 like this.
  15. deadwolfbones

    deadwolfbones Pundit (795) Jun 21, 2014 Oregon

    Got a link to the etsy shop?
     
  16. the_owl

    the_owl Initiate (0) Feb 21, 2019 New Mexico

    Not handy. I see they are priced higher now.
     
  17. the_owl

    the_owl Initiate (0) Feb 21, 2019 New Mexico

    I won't have time for that. I have two yeast starters already. Do you think a good water soak for a few weeks will help? I think I may do an airlock as a means to siphon some and taste. What do you think about carbing this beer? I have a beer gun, and I was thinking about adding some corn sugar in , racking it, then putting 3-5 lbs behind it just to bottle in bombers.
     
  18. MrOH

    MrOH Grand Pooh-Bah (3,995) Jul 5, 2010 Virginia
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah

    Wouldn't hurt.
    So far as your idea about the beer gun, I've never used one, so someone else will have to chime in
     
  19. the_owl

    the_owl Initiate (0) Feb 21, 2019 New Mexico

    Well, the time has come to bottle this. Its very clear, lots of banana and whiskey. Very interesting beer.I did do a Diacetyl rest with these two brews, so im guessing the banana is either the brett or saison yeast.

    Question again. Im going to keg this, but not carb it. I want to bottle condition in bombers using a blichmann beer gun. Should I mix a little priming yeast and sugar. before I keg? Im worried there isnt any yeast left after three months in the barrel
     
  20. wasatchback

    wasatchback Pooh-Bah (1,574) Jan 12, 2014 Tajikistan
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    you should definitely re-yeast! You’ll end up with much faster refermentation and it’s much less likely to get THP.

    1-2g of champagne yeast. Add it to the keg with you priming sugar. Give it a couple hours and then bottle with the beer gun. This is how I bottle every mixed ferm beer.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.