Germany Bayernbiere Bought and Drunk

Discussion in 'Europe' started by boddhitree, Dec 15, 2012.

  1. einhorn

    einhorn Aspirant (293) Nov 3, 2005 California
    Beer Trader

    To my knowledge they stopped brewing it about 15-20 years ago. Maybe since I left Germany in 2008 they have reintroduced it, not sure. During the pilsner/export-only phase in and around Frankfurt it was a great beer that showed that the nondescript styles like that were on the decline. I guess in the whole discussion about "craft beer" in Germany it's beers like this that are "no-brainers" which combine the desire for keeping tradition but still want something other than pilsner, helles, hefeweizen & Munich dunkel.
    herrburgess likes this.
  2. herrburgess

    herrburgess Meyvn (1,016) Nov 4, 2009 South Carolina
    Industry Beer Trader

    I had it in the late 1990s, so 15 may be the max number of years since they "retired" it. Maisel always said that they tested a number of beers back in the day, and the Dampf was the one the brewers liked best. Guess brewers are no longer the taste-makers these days....
    einhorn likes this.
  3. seanyfo

    seanyfo Meyvn (1,020) Jan 2, 2006 United Kingdom (Scotland)

    Interestingly in a trade with Erzengel, I got a bottle of an India pale ale one of batch brewed by Maisel's

    Review to follow!
  4. herrburgess

    herrburgess Meyvn (1,016) Nov 4, 2009 South Carolina
    Industry Beer Trader

    Im sure it will be much better than the Dampfbier (ya know, because of the hops).
  5. danfue

    danfue Initiate (0) Sep 16, 2012 Germany

    Two different Kellerbiere from Schlossbrauerei Haimhausen north of Munich.

    The Kellerbier Dunkel is a good thing. Not quite sure about the Kellerbier aspect, but it's a nice dark beer with pleasant roasted malts-taste. What I like best though, is that it's not sweet at all. Rather dry and crisp.

    The Kellerbier Hell is new in their lineup. Also, not quite sure about the Kellerbier thing. It's a bit cloudy, but relatively clear for a Kellerbier. The taste reminds of those Helle or Pilsners you can get at some Gasthofbrauereien. Not much hops, rather sweetish and malty, low carbonation. Not convincing, but at some point you are just spoiled by some Franconian Kellerbiere.
  6. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Poo-Bah (3,004) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania

    “Not quite sure about the Kellerbier aspect” Does that statement mean that you are unsure if these beers are genuinely Kellerbiers (unfiltered beers)?

    I have consumed a number of Kellerbiers that are not very cloudy but to my palate I believe that they are indeed unfiltered beers. My personal preference is to drink unfiltered beers because I am of the opinion that filtering strips out flavors; the flavors that are stripped out result in a less flavorful and therefore a lesser quality beer.

    For example, Sierra Nevada Brewing no longer filters their beers:

    “When Steve Dressler of Sierra Nevada spoke at Hop Union’s Hop School he said they had stepped away from filtering that it tends to strip flavors.”

    boddhitree likes this.
  7. einhorn

    einhorn Aspirant (293) Nov 3, 2005 California
    Beer Trader

    I think that the term Kellerbier is quite wishy washy, almost a catch-all phrase. It can be an ale or a lager, color is non-attributive and alcohol is also not defined.
    boddhitree likes this.
  8. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Poo-Bah (3,004) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania

    When I see a beer described as being a Kellerbier (or Zwickel) my expectations is that it is an unfiltered lager (I personally have never had a Kellerbier that was an ale).

    I have no specific expectations as regards color but I have had a few Kellerbiers that were light in color like a Pilsner (and hopped like a Pilsner); some of those beers were labeled as Keller Pils. Brooklyn brews a beer called Gold Standard Export Kellerbier which is a higher gravity Keller Pils at 6.2% ABV. Urban Chestnut Brewing brews a Zwickel that looks like a Keller Pils to me; maybe it might be more appropriate to describe that beer as a Keller Helles.

    The majority of the Kellerbiers that I have tasted are amber in color, very moderately hopped and of moderate gravity (e.g., around 5% ABV). Examples of that ‘type’ of Kellerbier would be Mahr's Ungespundet-hefetrüb, Weissenohe Kellerbier, Triumph Aldstadt Lager, etc.

    The common denominator for a Kellerbier is that it be unfiltered and a lager based upon my experiences to date.

  9. Crusader

    Crusader Initiate (196) Feb 4, 2011 Sweden

    I'm currently drinking a Spaten München and when I look at the back label I notice that the Swedish list of ingredients lists them as: water, wheat malt, barley malt, hops and hop extract. The curious thing is that wheat malt isn't mentioned in the other languages of which there are several on the label, only barley malt is mentioned. The placement of wheat malt ahead of barley malt would imply that the beer contains more wheat malt than barley malt, since ingredients have to be listed in order of importance according to Swedish law (and also EU law?). The importer, Carlsberg Sweden notes on their website of Spaten München that "the secret is supposed to be a handful of wheat added to the brew". I suppose the combination of a weissbier brewery and a lager brewery might explain the use of wheat in the beer, but when did wheat overtake barley as the primary ingredient in Spaten Helles? Has this always been so or is it a recent change I wonder.
    boddhitree likes this.
  10. danfue

    danfue Initiate (0) Sep 16, 2012 Germany

    The Kellerbier Dunkel at least just appeared to be a proper Dunkles to me - for sure unfiltered, but does that make a Kellerbier already? As einhorn said, it's one of those wishy washy styles, and these two examples here differ a bit from what is mostly sold as Kellerbier by other breweries.
  11. danfue

    danfue Initiate (0) Sep 16, 2012 Germany

    That would be interesting. One of the many useless German beer laws requires that beers containing grains other than barley must not be brewed bottom-fermented. Meaning, as soon as wheat is involved and the resulting brew is meant to be called "Bier", it has to be top-fermented. Maybe the law doesn't apply to beers that are exclusively brewed for export. Or maybe it wasn't even brewed in Munich, but in Copenhagen?! :wink:
    Crusader likes this.
  12. Crusader

    Crusader Initiate (196) Feb 4, 2011 Sweden

    The Export clause might be a pertinent one, since I've read that German breweries used to be able to use adjuncts in beers meant for export (I'm not sure if it even is necessary nowadays). The beer was brewed and bottled in München at the Spaten-Franziskanerbräu brewery as per the label though (That's one good thing about clear labeling laws I guess.

    Sweden doesn't have much in the way of laws concerning beer making other than requiring that the majority of the extract is from barley malt, but wheat beers are obviously sold here so that law, or description found in the law, isn't really applicable either.
  13. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Poo-Bah (3,004) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania

    “ …for sure unfiltered, but does that make a Kellerbier already?”

    I see your point. The best response that I have is that I am comfortable with the term Kellerbier just meaning an unfiltered lager. I have only had two ‘variants’ of a Kellerbier that I describe as: Keller Pils and Franconian Kellerbier (i.e., an amber colored, moderately hopped lager).

    “As einhorn said, it's one of those wishy washy styles, …” Yup!

    einhorn likes this.
  14. herrburgess

    herrburgess Meyvn (1,016) Nov 4, 2009 South Carolina
    Industry Beer Trader

    Kellerbier can range from pale yellow with very little haze to cloudy amber to opaque chestnut brown. Many Kellerbiers are served so "young" that the yeast hasn't even finished its work. So depending upon where you drink them, they can range from very yeasty (from the wooden keg at the brewery taproom) to completely clear (from the bottle where the yeast has settled to the bottom and not decanted).

    In other words, Einhorn is right: Kellerbier can mean literally 100+ different things depending upon circumstances.
    einhorn and boddhitree like this.
  15. boddhitree

    boddhitree Devotee (482) Apr 13, 2008 Germany

    Unless you live in the area or were driving though, how did you get hold of these beers? I can't find this brewery on any online sources from my usual suspects.

    Also, topic - Kellerbier... I've found it can be practically anything the brewer says it is, varying hugely from looking filtered to looking cloudier than dishwater. I've found it's as much a marketing term as a beer style. Sometimes it's more than just being unfiltered but with other ingredients, more a Ur-wasnochimmer (old-whatever).
    danfue and herrburgess like this.
  16. danfue

    danfue Initiate (0) Sep 16, 2012 Germany

    My brother lived in Munich, now he's back to the Frankfurt-area, but a friend from Munich gave him some of this and he gave it to me. :grinning:
  17. steveh

    steveh Poo-Bah (1,931) Oct 8, 2003 Illinois

    That's really interesting -- even crazy-odd. Can you taste the wheat? If you're not familiar, it will be more grainy, less bready -- not sure what I could compare it to in Sweden, do you have saltine crackers?

    The last Spaten Premium (as they label the Helles in the USA) I drank had no wheat character to it.
  18. Crusader

    Crusader Initiate (196) Feb 4, 2011 Sweden

    It tastes like a clean German lager as far as I'm concerned, I didn't react when I drank it and I've had this beer numerous times over the course of the last few years, but only now did I notice the wheat malt in the ingredients list. I tend to check the ingredients list since European beers tend to give away more than non-European beers, and this time I noticed the wheat malt and it having been placed ahead of the barley malt (just as hop extract is now placed ahead of hops in the ingredients list for Jever Pilsener).
  19. TreinJan

    TreinJan Initiate (135) Apr 13, 2006 Netherlands

    Logical conclusion: it's an error, there is no wheat malt in there!
  20. seanyfo

    seanyfo Meyvn (1,020) Jan 2, 2006 United Kingdom (Scotland)

    Next installment of Bayern bier is from Moosbacher Privat Landbrauerei in the lovely town of Moosbach in the Oberpfalz (No idea if its actually lovely).

    Thanks to Erzengel for this one!
    Sampling their Zoigl today , abv 5.4%


    Appearance - Cloudy pale amber body. Thick creamy 3 finger head giving superb retention/lacing.

    Aroma - Green apple, orval-like acidic sourness, grassy/outdoorsy in the fields quality (obviously struggling for descriptives here)

    Taste - Acidic bitterness up front, not in an in your face assertive way like a really tart gueuze, more subtle becoming sweeter as biscuity malts come through in the full bodied yet delicate finish. Very refreshing.

    Mouthfeel - It's perfect. A light burst of carbonation that mellows to a wonderful delicateness with a full yet light body that coats the tongue. It's trully superb.

    Enjoyed this immensely. Superb refreshing flavours with a subtle nod of malt sweetness with a mouthfeel that nearly had it gone in 2 swigs!

  21. steveh

    steveh Poo-Bah (1,931) Oct 8, 2003 Illinois

    It certainly is. :slight_smile:
    seanyfo likes this.
  22. Crusader

    Crusader Initiate (196) Feb 4, 2011 Sweden

    That would be one explanation, but when the importer, Carlsberg Sweden, makes note of the wheat on their website it seems as though it's more than a typo.
  23. PancakeMcWaffles

    PancakeMcWaffles Initiate (0) Jun 15, 2012 Germany

    The german bottle says "Wasser, Gerstenmalz, Hopfen, Hopfenextrakt". Bought one a few days ago, wasn't very impressed by the beer, definitely not one of the better Helles out there.
    It's weird that the Carlsrberg Sweden website lists wheat malt...
  24. Gutes_Bier

    Gutes_Bier Disciple (390) Jul 31, 2011 Germany

    You're hurting my feelings, Spaten is maybe my favorite Helles.
    steveh likes this.
  25. boddhitree

    boddhitree Devotee (482) Apr 13, 2008 Germany

    Wow, another month is gone by and there was another beer from Pax Bräu waiting on my doorstep when I came home this week. This is another good one. It's the Imperial Honey Stout, which I couldn't imagine at first what it would taste like, but then again, that's why I love the beer from Pax.

    I like the imagery on the label. The bee & honeycomb, the crown symbolizing Imperial, and the Union Jack, well, at least the label is an Imperial Honey Stout.

    [​IMG] [​IMG]

    At the bottom, the ingredients listed are water, barley malts, honey, roasted barley, Challenger, Golding, Smaragd & Pacific Gem. A very nice list, if I say so. 7.4%
    Notice the best buy date is April 24. The filled on date is below, 24.10, or October 10, which means he has 6 month time frame.

    Appearance: A dark tan head sits above an ink black beer where absolute no light can pass through.

    Aroma: With all those different hops in the ingredient list, you'd expect something to come through, but I get some bitterness from hops, but mostly, I get roasted malts, molasses some alcohol notes, and... rauch (smoked) malt. It smells like it's got a lot of black malts, roasted malts (Carafa?) and little honey. It's a very complex aroma, not just like a stout, but the smoke malt aroma is quite pronounced.

    Flavor: In the front, lots of bitterness from hops and malts. It tastes like some black and chocolate malts were used, but also the hops are strong in the front. In the middle I get the first real stout flavors, bitter black malts, rauch and roasted malt and burnt sugar flavors. In the sides of the tongue, there's sweetness of chocolate malt and typical stout bitterness. In the back... this is where the WOW comes out. It's sweetness of honey, and lots of rauch malt, tasting also like a whisky. The aftertaste is bitter-sweet and smokey. This is a WOW WOW beer.
    Overall, it's definitely a stout, but also it's got wonderful, strong black malt bitterness with rauchmalz mixed in. After a number of beers in the last few months from the Bierkalender without any of Pax's signature smoke malt flavors, it's great to see it come back with a bang. This is the perfect blend of Fränkische and British styles, and with all those hops, though relatively unnoticeable, it lends a sweetness and complexity that is really delicious.

    Mouthfeel: Just like you'd expect in a stout: thick and enveloping. WOW.
  26. seanyfo

    seanyfo Meyvn (1,020) Jan 2, 2006 United Kingdom (Scotland)

    Blew my mind with this sentence
  27. herrburgess

    herrburgess Meyvn (1,016) Nov 4, 2009 South Carolina
    Industry Beer Trader

    Nice review as always, Tony.

    Q: How would you say Pax Brau compares (especially now that you've had their Imp Stout and their IPA -- those two bastions of U.S. craft culture) to the best craft brewers you have tried Stateside?
  28. boddhitree

    boddhitree Devotee (482) Apr 13, 2008 Germany

    First, thanks for the compliment; a put at least an hour into each and every review I write here.

    Good question. This is what I love about Pax's beers: they're nothing like the stuff stateside. The Cissy IPA had a mix of hops from German & USA (Saphir, Perle, & Cascade). but it didn't use any of th "normal" Pale Ale malts. I know that b/c I emailed Andreas Seufert to get his recipe. He used Pils (48%), Carafe Spezial II (4%), Münchiner (43%) & Rauchmalz (5%) as his grain bill. So, NOT your normal IPA, eh? I bet he used a similar grain bill in the stout, at least it tasted like there was the regular stout-like malts. But also Münchner, Carafa & of course, a strong Rauchmalz. Add that with the hops you see above (NZ, UK & German), and you get nothing like you find ANYWHERE in the world. I can see brewing this kind of stout. The honey lent only a slight addition in flavor, but its main contribution, I'm guessing, is in the whiskey-like taste in the back of the tongue & aftertaste. You could argue that these are a Fränkisch interpretation of these styles, but that'd be too simplistic, for the hop choices as well as getting all these strong-willed flavors to not only play nice, but to combine into a symphonic harmony but still with a mouthful of bursting flavor, where you can still pick out the distinct notes of each instrument/malt, truely that's where the art lies. Really, I plan on brewing the Cissy IPA next weekend (1st attempt this summer went sour with an infection, but now 6 months later, it's beginning to have cherry & sherry flavors pop out of the sourness as if it were a Belgian sour. Another 6 months overwintering in the cellar should really make this an interesting beer, despite not being at all what I'd planned or hoped it to be.) and I pray I'm able to make it as well as he did.

    So, short and sweet… I think these beers are better than those in the states. Anyone can make an "ABI". (Another Bloody IPA, in case you forgot) or Imperial stout, but to fuse two disparate styles, no traditions, and have them a) not be a train wreck on the tongue & b) actually transcend both beer cultures to build a new language for beer, now that's WOW-worthy. Anyone who has the money, lives in Germany, or a neighboring country, and doesn't sign up for his Bierkalender Abo is missing out and are… Only Camba Bavaria come close, but they still aren't at the same level. I've seen some interesting experimentation from Fritz Ale, and a few others, but really nothing that's both innovative and as sublime as Pax.
    #868 boddhitree, Nov 11, 2013
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2013
  29. JHDStein

    JHDStein Initiate (29) Aug 16, 2013 Germany

    Thanks for the review! As always, it's excellent stuff. And, as always, it makes me want to try something from Pax.

    However, it doesn't seem quite so easy to just "sign up" for the monthly subscription. I've been watching the Pax page on Biershop Bayern for a couple of months now, and the "subscription" is continuously sold out. Am I missing something?
  30. danfue

    danfue Initiate (0) Sep 16, 2012 Germany

    Karmeliten Brocardus 1844 from Straubing in Niederbayern. Sounds a bit like a Bock, but it's a reddish Dunkles. The bottle looks like a Belgian beer. Not much foam, it quickly disappeared after pouring. I like the red-brown color. It's quite süffig, rather malty and sweetish. On the back label it says it's hopped with two sorts of Hallertauer hops, yet not too much of it is conceivable. It's alright, but absolutely nothing special.

    JHDStein, seanyfo and boddhitree like this.
  31. boddhitree

    boddhitree Devotee (482) Apr 13, 2008 Germany

    That's been true on Biershop Bayern for awhile. The only way I know is to email Pax directly and sign up for the full 12 months subscription. I think the web page for Pax on Biershop Bayern hasn't been changed for quite some time, so I wouldn't hold my breathe waiting. I noticed the Bierkalender for 2013 was pulled down on Pax's website. On Facebook, Andreas Seufert said he was planning the Bierkalender now for 2014, so look there for news, not the official website. Hope that helps.

    Have you had the Vollbier or Weizen, ordered from Biershop Bayern?
    JHDStein likes this.
  32. danfue

    danfue Initiate (0) Sep 16, 2012 Germany

    For some reason, my photo can't be uploaded now. But I just had the Jahrtausendbock by Müllerbräu Neuötting. With 20°P and 8.9 % ABV this is beyond the typical German Doppelbock standards, feels more like a Belgian Strong Ale. Pretty red-golden color, medium carbonation, few foam. Very tasty, the alcoholic strength doesn't superpose any of the nice and sweetish malty tastes as with many German Bocks. Even some slight hops-bitterness can be conceived among the sweet Bock-taste. I try not to be fooled by extraordinary names (Millennium-Bock), but I believe this is really one of the best Doppelbocks I've ever tasted.
  33. einhorn

    einhorn Aspirant (293) Nov 3, 2005 California
    Beer Trader

    I tried this also about 6 months ago and wanted to like it so much. The label, look and feel of the beer had potential, and it fell incredibly short of my expectations. Glad to know I wasn't alone.
    danfue likes this.
  34. JHDStein

    JHDStein Initiate (29) Aug 16, 2013 Germany

    Thanks for the information! I will probably send Pax an email fairly soon, because you've made their beers sound so incredible, that I am dying to give them a try. Christmas is coming up, and my wife always wonders what to get me, a beer subscription sounds about right...

    I haven't tried the Vollbier or Weizen from Biershop Bayern, mainly because I've had a hard time convincing myself to order 6 liters of a beer that I have never tried. Perhaps it's time to take the plunge. Worse case scenario, it's 6 one liter Bügelflaschen that I can potentially fill with homebrew (when I eventually start brewing again).
  35. danfue

    danfue Initiate (0) Sep 16, 2012 Germany

    Schönramer is just an incredible brewery. Everything I've tried by them wasn't only good, but extraordinarily outstanding! Fantastic Pils, fantastic Weißbier, fantastic Doppelbock, fantastic IPA. And now, what a surprise...a fantastic Bayrisch Pale Ale. It's a single hop Pale Ale, using Mandarina Bavaria-hops. And that's what you get: a pleasantly fruity, somewhat sour and sparkling bitterness of tangerine, grapefruit and pineapple. Light, fresh white-bread maltiness, it's just a dream. At 5.5 %, it's very well drinkable. Wish I had tasted this a few months earlier, will need to stock up on this next summer! One of the best beers I had in months.

    The color of the beer is actually a bit darker, slightly amber/orange and a bit cloudy. It's just a cell phone-camera and the lighting in my kitchen isn't a photo studio.
  36. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Poo-Bah (3,004) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania

    I am a fan of the new Mandarina hop; Victory Brewing made a tasty beer called Victory CBC Mandarina Pale Ale.

    Below is a post I made in another thread discussing the topic of German IPA (or German Pale Ale).

    “What about a german ipa? Where are they at? Just kidding.”

    No joke, you may be seeing German IPAs very soon. The German hop growers are making new unique hops to compete with the US hop growers. These newer German hops could be used to make tasty German IPAs.

    Victory recently made a Pale Ale using of these newer hops:
    As a point of example I was able to drink a pint of Victory CBC Mandarina Pale Ale. That beer was a very tasty pale ale brewed with German Mandarina hops.

    Below is a description of CBC Mandarina Pale Ale from the Victory website:

    “CBC Mandarina Pale Ale
    Pale Ale
    A blend of German pils and caramel malts combine with German Mandarina and dry-hopped Mandarina to create a full bodied, citrus-hopped brew with a pleasant bitter finish and lots of hop flavor.
    ABV: 6.0%
    Special one-time release, March 2013”

    Other ‘new’ German hops:
    Huell Melon - pronounced melon aroma.
    Hallertau Blanc - white wine aroma.
    Polaris - super highs alpha as stated above, wintergreen aroma. A huge hop in the field, 3000 lb/acre yield.

    boddhitree and danfue like this.
  37. boddhitree

    boddhitree Devotee (482) Apr 13, 2008 Germany

    You did see review of this beer, right? And that's what got you to order it? I hope so. Though... hats off to your palate if you discerned Pineapple. Did you also get their IPA, which I found even better? :slight_smile:
  38. boddhitree

    boddhitree Devotee (482) Apr 13, 2008 Germany

    I haven't tried the 1st 2, but I have some Polaris in the cellar waiting for inspiration of what to recipe to add it to.
    Timosen brewed a beer with Polaris and wasn't thrilled with it; he said it was just too bitter, if memory serves.

    You forgot another new hop: Herkules, a super-duper, ultra bitter hop (17.9%+ AA). I brewed a beer with Herkules last year, which was supposed to be an IPA, which was so bitter it was undrinkable, but mellowed in bitterness to a lovely flavor after aging 6 months.
  39. boddhitree

    boddhitree Devotee (482) Apr 13, 2008 Germany

    I'm finally getting around to drink and evaluate the last of my Schönramer, or Private Landbrauerei Schönram. If this is half as good as the others, I'm in, and you are too, vicariously, for a treat.

    This is the Bavarias Best Imperial Stout. At 10%, a strong beer, which is why I saved it for last, wanting it to age at least 2 months more before drinking it.

    A look at the labels below shows some interesting details.
    1. From the front, there's zero info about this beer, just a "Bavarias Best" and the coat of arms of the brewery, as you can see below on the Bierdeckel. I kinda like the label: sparse, easy to pick out in the store, noble (black and gold) but still somehow how indicating it's mysterious but cutting edge inside.
    2. The back gives more info. As well as announcing it's an Imperial Stout, it says Obergäriges Starkbier, or "top-frementing strong beer."
    3. As with most German breweries, the ingredients list is extremely unhelpful, listing the standards Water, Barley malt, Wheat malt (interesting for a Imperial stout, isn't it?), Hops and Yeast. I wish they were enlightened enough to give specifics.
    4. Check out the Best Before date, and tell me if you agree with how I read this. 28.02.28 is February 28, 2028, wow a full 15 years from today. Have you seen this before?

    [​IMG] [​IMG]

    Appearance: Inky black, no light getting through this thick looking beer, which is under a dark tan head that dissipates quickly.

    Aroma: Mmmm...! lots of black & roasted barley malts, plum-licorice mix, a bit of alcohol, and it wafts up to hit your nose powerfully, even a good 3 inches above the glass.

    Flavor: WOW. It matches its aroma perfectly. Up front, I get a decent amount of bitterness and alcohol notes on the tongue, as much from the black malts as the hops. It feels like a barley wine or slightly like whiskey up front, yet it's got thickness like a stout, even on the top of the tongue. In the middle, more bitterness, and the sides you start to get the plums, sour cherry and licorice, toffee, sweet and sour simultaneously. Again, I get a slight alcohol bite, but no hotness, which allows the alcohol to be well hidden behind immense malty flavors. In the back.... "öh mien gott" is the best way to describe it. It's super sweet, but it good way, verging on Belgian territory here. I get even more plums, sour cherry, and licorice, with some black and barley malts, both sweet and still a nice bitterness... in an intensity that's hard to describe. It's a powerful yet comforting, gemütlich feeling from the front to back of the tongue. The aftertaste is still roasted barely and doesn't let up for quite some time. You could put this next to any American or British version of an Imperial Stout proudly and not even need to say it's from Germany, except that its German roots are hidden in the bitterness which tastes more like a German Noble hop rather than a typical British hop, for there's no grassiness, earthiness or spiciness typical of the UK hops; rather, it's got a smoothness in the bitterness that's noticeably present but utterly sublime and incredibly süffig. This is a great aperitif but also a beer I'd like with a German Torte or cake.

    Mouthfeel: Thick, I mean a heavy THICKness, verging on motor oil but it still slides down the gullet gracefully with ease.

    Overall: super-WOW. I didn't think a German brewery could make this beer, but here it is sitting in my glass, begging to be sipped, allowing me slip into a mellow happiness with an aftertaste that begs me to keep on sipping. What I really like about this beer is constancy of flavor from front to back, exactly the same flavors and no let up in intensity. It's the prefect gray winter-day and night warmer. Is it better than American or British Imperial Stouts? I have no idea, but there's not a note out of place here, no harshness, and though intense, no extreme flavors screaming for attention. I might need more of this beer in my next order.

    This concludes the Schönramers I ordered from Biershop-Bayern, and I wasn't disappointed in a single one. It's become one of my favorite breweries, and really needs more love from the German as well as international community.
    #879 boddhitree, Nov 16, 2013
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2013
  40. danfue

    danfue Initiate (0) Sep 16, 2012 Germany

    I had the IPA a few months ago already and found it superb as well.
    I didn't order this one now, it was included in that Kalea beer-calendar. Having read your review of the Imperial Stout now, this is probably going to be the next one I'll try. Although their traditional German styles are fantastic as well. I only had the Pils and the Weizen, but after what I've tried, I'm sure they also make an excellent Export, Helles, Dunkles, etc..
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