Belgian or French saison yeast?

Based on what you say, you are looking at Brett for those flavors. I have little experience with 3711, but 3724 is very spicy and some yeast flavors. However, if you are using 1056 as well, stalling will not be an issue as your 1056 will finish it out pretty easily.

 

I am a fan of combing yeast strains, but suspect 1056 will not play well with 3724 (not sure about 3711). The 1056 max recommended ferm temp is low 70s, usually it shines in the mid-60s. For 3724 your minimum temp should be high 70s, with temps up in the 80s common. So if you combine the two the compromise doesn't look all that good. You'll have fermentation, but at least one yeast will be out of it's element. The 3711 is a little closer to 1056 with temps but I have no experience with it. For the Sofie dregs I would try and research it's optimum temp before using and if compatible would attempt to make a proper starter.

I heard the same stories about 3724 being difficult, but recently had it (3724) go from 1.055 to 1.005 in eight days. Temp started in high 70s and ended in mid 80s, no bubblegum in sight. I used a light bulb to maintain the temp.

If you really want some citrus-zing I recommend dry-hopping with something like Citra or Centennial. You see this from The Bruery and DuPont with some pretty good results.

 

I've only used Wyeast 3724 Belgian Saison and we fermented on the warm side and ramped it up. Its noted to get sluggish, the higher temps helping it finish off. Perhaps the 3711 French saison yeast is better for you because of that. I have no experience with 3711, but it seems to be noted as the one you can ferment at normal ale yeast temps. I know some people on this board have had no problem with the Belgian Saison at those lower temps as well, so maybe its a toss up.

I am however curious what your plan is by adding 2-3 yeasts? I'd think you only need the french saison strain (fermented on the cool side so the esters are subtle) and the Sophie dregs, which will add the wild yeast. Why the American Ale yeast?

 

My suggestion is to solely ferment with 3711. It is not clear to me why you would want to use 1056 as well in this beer.

Cheers!

 

Based on the description of what you like and what you're trying to accomplish: ditch 1056 (no reason to use it), and use either 3711 or 3724 (or 3726 if you can get your hands on it). Personally, I prefer 3724 to 3711. About a week or two after primary fermentation, pitch some brett B (Orval dregs work great for this) and give it another 2+ months in primary before bottling. Even if 3724 stalls on you, the brettanomyces will take over and complete fermentation. Whenever I've done this, the beer has finished at 1.005 or lower (even with a stalled 3724 fermentation). This is actually my favorite method of brewing - season yeast first followed by brett.

 

I would do 3724 or 3726 and hit it with the dregs from the Sofie. 3711 may very well leave no sugars for the Brett to chew on. 3724 might or might not slow down, and if it does, it will kick back up again with time, and you are letting this beer age anyways to get some character from the Sofie. The Brett might kick up when the 3724 slows down for awhile. If you want more character from the Sofie go with something other than 3711. The 3726 works super fast and easy, leaving enough for the Brett to work on unlike 3711 and is a much more flavorful yeast. I much prefer 3724 & 3726 to 3711. I will usually primary with 3724 to 1.006ish (easy to do, no sugar) and then bottle with Brett added to the bottling bucket along with the priming syrup. Definitely niz the 1056, it is pointless in this beer and may even harm it (fusels if too hot, overtake the "character" in the final product, etc.)

 

I am just curious if there's anything left for brett to eat after 3711 (aka "the beast") is finished.

 

Yes, brettanomyces will eat byproducts of the primary fermentation, nutrients left in the dead sacc cell bodies, and sugars that the sacc strain could not. I've pitched brett in beer that was already down to nearly 1.000, and a few months later had pronounced brett flavors (with very little effect on final gravity).

 

I'm with Jack, I'd go with straight 3711, it's a bit cleaner and more refined than the 3724 strain. From your description I think it will give you what you want. I would look to the hops for the citrus notes.

 

3711 more "refined" than 3724? I'm looking forward to your definition of refined. And besides, is "refined" what anyone looks for in a saison yeast?

I would say this: 3711 won't stall in the winter time, while 3724 might.

 

3711 wouldn't stall on neptune.

And "refined" isn't likely to be easily defined in the context of beer, but I'm anxious to hear the debating points.

But FWIW, I do consider a good saison to be a pretty refined beer, even if that beer is just a smash fermented at 64F. I mean it's not like it's an IPA or pale ale, or that we're trying to satisfy the ordinary craft beer masses...

 

as suggested skip the 1056, using multi yeast strains generally doesnt work that well as one or the other will dominate

3711 is very bland compared to 3724, it isnt as complex and the flavor is to my taste buds, a bit flabby

Too many people jumped on its bandwagon IMO because of the supposed finicky nature of 3724, you just have to pitch enough yeast and give it a bit of time and it will do its work, Im slow to racking beers ~3-4wks and Ive always had 3724 finish in that time frame

 

The Belgian is my preference. Yes, it can take time and will prefer to be warm. Does Sophie use Brett? If so, maybe this is a beer that will not want to finish quickly anyhow. 3711 is useful if you need to turn the beer around fast, but it is less interesting to me.

 

I've used both but only once with 2 different beers. Belgian tasted better but stalled even when I left it outside during the summer when it was in the 80s. French saison fermented very quickly and finished around 1.004 without the need to ramp up temperatures although I did still ferment in the summer. So as I said previously with my limited experience I would go with French saison if you are not able to ferment pretty warm.

 

Don't be afraid to try 3724 some time. I have used it many times at temps less that 80F and never had it get stuck. It does sometimes (usually) go pretty slow, and I have become convinced that a lot of the stuck/stalled fermentation stories about 3724 are due to a misinterpretation of what's happening.

 

Maybe this will help. 3724 is more like the Frankenstein of saison yeasts, and 3711 is more like Count Dracula. They can both be monsters and create fear in brewers, but Frankenstein is a bit rougher around the edges and if something upsets him he will freak out and stop working and even if he does finish the job he will leave a mess of phenolics behind. While 3711 the vampire of yeasts has refined taste and won't leave until he's done with the beer and will clean up after himself, leaving less of mess of phenolics behind.

 

Best answer - 5 points. Analogies FTW.