Big English Barleywine

Discussion in 'Homebrewing' started by Dave_S, Sep 7, 2020.

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  1. Dave_S

    Dave_S Crusader (429) May 18, 2017 England

    Hey folks!

    I'm looking at brewing a small batch of a historic Stock Ale as a kind of Majority Ale for the tiny brewery assistant who's due to be arriving at the end of the month.

    The basic recipe (from Ron's book, obvs) is a shedload of pale ale malt, a ton of Goldings, and not much else. It's one of these traditional keeping beers that's brewed somewhere north of 1.100 and hopped to saturation point with the expectation that the bitterness will fade to something manageable over the course of several years of aging and/or export to Russia.

    A couple of questions:
    i) I'm considering using Crisp Chevallier malt for this - it's historically appropriate, but I'm not sure how well it'd work in a beer that's essentially just base malt turned up to eleven. Has anyone used it in a base-malt-centric beer before? The other option is probably Warminster Maris Otter.
    ii) Any thoughts on yeast for this sort of beer? I'm currently thinking of co-pitching Windsor and London ESB, to get a bit of fruity goodness but also to try to get some sort of sensible FG. Obviously alcohol tolerance is important here!

    Thanks
     
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  2. MrOH

    MrOH Grand Pooh-Bah (3,995) Jul 5, 2010 Virginia
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah

    Had three nephews born within 2 months a few years ago, and did something similar. I used all TFGP, pitched wlp007 initially, once krausen settled added wy3724, and then once I got stable gravity, racked to secondary on whiskey soaked oak and Brett C. Let it age for a year and then bottled with more Brett C.
     
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  3. SABERG

    SABERG Grand Pooh-Bah (5,001) Sep 16, 2007 Massachusetts
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah

    The last Barleywine I brewed was Marris and EKG, with Irish ale yeast.
    Seems tame on the front side, with time, delish.
    Brewed 3 times no ages well, and good young.
    Cheers
     
  4. hopfenunmaltz

    hopfenunmaltz Pooh-Bah (2,647) Jun 8, 2005 Michigan
    Pooh-Bah

    The Chevalier malt might give you a lower yeild. The Warminster MO is excellent. I would mash high in pH, 5.4-5.6 range.

    Pitch a big healthy starter, plenty of nutrients, give it O2 when you pitch more O2 at 12-18 hours into fermentation.

    Control the temperature, don't let it get away from you.

    If Ron says anything about water, follow his advice. Otherwise a British Pale Ale profile should work.

    If your using a big dose of EGK to hit the IBU target you will have high tannins for a while, makes the beer a little aggressive.
     
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  5. MrOH

    MrOH Grand Pooh-Bah (3,995) Jul 5, 2010 Virginia
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah

    Well, if he's doing a true majority ale, there shouldn't be any tannins, or even much bitterness by the time the kid hits 21.
     
  6. pweis909

    pweis909 Grand Pooh-Bah (3,250) Aug 13, 2005 Wisconsin
    Pooh-Bah

    Do you mean the Lallemand London yeast (formerly London ESB)? Both it and Windsor leaves maltotriose behind, so I don't think you get the attenuation you want. If you mean Wyeast London ESB, you'll probably do better, although I think I would go with a Whitbread strain, US-05, or Nottingham. I have used one of the Lallemand strains, either London ESB and Windsor (not certain, but I think Windsor) in conjunction with a Brett c secondary to make a great old ale. If going for long term aging, which it sounds lie, Brett might be a nice touch.
     
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  7. hopfenunmaltz

    hopfenunmaltz Pooh-Bah (2,647) Jun 8, 2005 Michigan
    Pooh-Bah

    That's true. He might be disappointed on the early samples. Aging at cello temperature for years is a key part of the process.
     
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  8. MrOH

    MrOH Grand Pooh-Bah (3,995) Jul 5, 2010 Virginia
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah

    Best rock 'n roll song featuring a cello!
     
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  9. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    I did not know that Hawkwind did a song called Motorhead. That's a moment of Zen.
     
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  10. hopfenunmaltz

    hopfenunmaltz Pooh-Bah (2,647) Jun 8, 2005 Michigan
    Pooh-Bah

    Need. More. Coffee.

    Keller.
     
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  11. MrOH

    MrOH Grand Pooh-Bah (3,995) Jul 5, 2010 Virginia
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah

    Was the last song Lemmy wrote while in Hawkwind, which is why he named his band that after his manager wouldn't let him name it Bastards
     
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  12. SFACRKnight

    SFACRKnight Grand Pooh-Bah (3,348) Jan 20, 2012 Colorado
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Us05 is tolerant to alcohol and won't throw the esters English yeasts do if fermentation gets warm.
     
  13. premierpro

    premierpro Savant (1,060) Mar 21, 2009 Michigan

    I would not co-pitch those two yeasts. Pick one of them as they both throw a lot of esters and don't attenuate well. I would go with WLP007 or even 34/70 as a co-pitch. Good luck!
     
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  14. Dave_S

    Dave_S Crusader (429) May 18, 2017 England

    Right, sorry, got distracted from this thread. Thanks for the thoughts!

    I'd assumed based on the Lallemand website that London was reasonably clean and attenuative, so the idea was for that to do attenuation and Windsor to do "English yeast character". But looking closely you're right, it doesn't ferment maltotriose so maybe not. Maybe Nottingham, then, or maybe a co-pitch of Notty and London. (Coincidentally, Nottingham, London, Maris Otter and EKG would be an ingredient for everywhere that I've lived which is kind of cute...)

    In terms of aging, it's not going to be a true majority ale, but definitely something I'd hope to pretty much not touch for the first year (I suspect that with a newborn in the house our barleywine chugging activities are going to be on hold for a bit anyway) and then drink over the course of years rather than months...
     
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  15. Dave_S

    Dave_S Crusader (429) May 18, 2017 England

    Oxygenation and keeping the temperature under control - yes, for sure!
     
  16. MrOH

    MrOH Grand Pooh-Bah (3,995) Jul 5, 2010 Virginia
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah

    Definitely do this!
     
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